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wilcthree

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How much longer are the Italian BD collar points than that of the non-Italian?
Very good question, one to which I do not have the answer. Would be good to know this as well, as I was thinking earlier that the Italian BD collar point length and their placement might account for the roll/"S" silhouette.
 

Burzan

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Is the Italian much better in the roll department? How about a large Italian?



Do you have other Italian BD collars? They seem quite long, which is what I am after... How do you like them?

Also, the Large Italians is very rolla-licious. Do you have any of those to compare?
I prefer the Italian because of the longer points and resultant roll for shirts I am less likely to wear with a tie.

Not sure the difference between the Italian and the so called Large Italian you mention
Take my insights with a grain of salt, as they’re based on an N of 1 re: the Italian BD collar. To my eye, it has a more curvaceous “S” than normal BDs. Both have really good rolls, it’s just easier to see the “S” silhouette from top to bottom of collar/buttoning point of the Italian. I agree the Italian looks better worn open, especially when paired with a Neo sportcoat. Would love to try a large Italian button down but would have to go MTO for that. I can say that it’s inspired me to cop more SM Italian button downs to add variety to my shirt wardrobe.
How much longer are the Italian BD collar points than that of the non-Italian?
Very good question, one to which I do not have the answer. Would be good to know this as well, as I was thinking earlier that the Italian BD collar point length and their placement might account for the roll/"S" silhouette.

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7_rocket

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To my local guys in the GTA,

Where can I buy quality laces for the chukka two eyelet boot? The laces it came with are comically too long. Gotta look while walking around on the carpet downstairs!
 

SoundBrewer

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I have a question about collars. I prefer Spier's oxford shirts to Proper Cloth's oxfords. The material feels more substantial and holds up better throughout the day. I wear the Spier classic button down collar and the Proper Cloth soft ivy collar. But I can't figure out how to get the Spier collar right.

Here's my particular problem: my Spier shirts look and fit great with a tie. But if I go tie-less and unbutton the top button, the collar still has a tendency to close. From afar, I look like a dork who has buttoned the top button without tie. By contrast, when I wear my Proper Cloth oxfords without a tie, the collar tends to stay open a bit more. I'm not sure that the collar size is too small, though, because I can comfortably stick a couple fingers in the collar.

What am I doing wrong? Should I go with the Italian collar? What about dropping the second button by an inch? And has anyone had success getting a tailor to open a new button hole?

Anything to make me look less of a poindexter!

Thanks!
Up to you, but I always just leave both the top two buttons undone.
 

Joe Schmoe

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I don't own a blue suit and I'm wondering if this medium blue suit is appropriate for professional business dress environments?

It's hard to tell from the pictures but that suit strikes me as a bit casual. I have a suit that is an even lighter shade of blue -- but it's got a subtle windowpane pattern, you can hardly see it with the naked eye but it adds texture and depth to the fabric. It's a fashionable business suit -- but it's still a business suit. The S&M suit in the picture is a very nice suit, and I'd certainly buy it for casual occasions, but it strikes me as a little too casual. It's a shade or two lighter than a standard navy blue business suit, but it doesn't have any texture.

On second thought, I looked at the closeup pics and... they look right. OK, I'm changing my mind on this one. It's worth a try as a business suit. There's a good chance that it will work. There's still some risk -- in my experience, a business suit that is in an aggressive color has to be expensive. You can save money on a basic navy suit, a grey pin stripe, etc. If the fit is good and the fabric isn't insanely cheap, you'll be OK. But if you're going to go with a nonstandard color, the fabric has got to be of the highest quality or it just doesn't work.

This one is worth a shot though, if it's in your budget. Odds are it will work in a business environment.

Cavet: I've got ultra-traditional tastes, most people would probably say that this suit is certain to work in a business environment. But as stated above, I think it's worth a go, there's a very good chance that it will work in a business setting. I like it and would take a chance on it myself if I were in the market for a new S&M suit.
 

conak

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I have a question about collars. I prefer Spier's oxford shirts to Proper Cloth's oxfords. The material feels more substantial and holds up better throughout the day. I wear the Spier classic button down collar and the Proper Cloth soft ivy collar. But I can't figure out how to get the Spier collar right.

Here's my particular problem: my Spier shirts look and fit great with a tie. But if I go tie-less and unbutton the top button, the collar still has a tendency to close. From afar, I look like a dork who has buttoned the top button without tie. By contrast, when I wear my Proper Cloth oxfords without a tie, the collar tends to stay open a bit more. I'm not sure that the collar size is too small, though, because I can comfortably stick a couple fingers in the collar.

What am I doing wrong? Should I go with the Italian collar? What about dropping the second button by an inch? And has anyone had success getting a tailor to open a new button hole?

Anything to make me look less of a poindexter!

Thanks!
I assume this is due to the button spacing, but I always either wear SM shirts with a tie or unbutton the top two buttons. I think unbuttoning only the top button usually looks bad unless you have a v-neck sweater on to drop the focus point. To my eye, one button open says 'I'm trying to relax because it seems cool', which will always come off as tryhard, like Kamala Harris pretending she smoked pot in college. Either go fully relaxed or go full tie.
 

c.bisesar

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I assume this is due to the button spacing, but I always either wear SM shirts with a tie or unbutton the top two buttons. I think unbuttoning only the top button usually looks bad unless you have a v-neck sweater on to drop the focus point. To my eye, one button open says 'I'm trying to relax because it seems cool', which will always come off as tryhard, like Kamala Harris pretending she smoked pot in college. Either go fully relaxed or go full tie.
I leave the top two unbuttoned, but I find having two buttons is a bit much so I use a small strip of fabric tape between the second and third buttons so it's really only 1.5 buttons open. Now that I write it out, sounds pretty overkill :confused2:
 

XxLogo

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I assume this is due to the button spacing, but I always either wear SM shirts with a tie or unbutton the top two buttons. I think unbuttoning only the top button usually looks bad unless you have a v-neck sweater on to drop the focus point. To my eye, one button open says 'I'm trying to relax because it seems cool', which will always come off as tryhard, like Kamala Harris pretending she smoked pot in college. Either go fully relaxed or go full tie.
I usually only go 1 unbuttoned and it just makes it look better casually and usually opens nicely. In the summer, I will go 2-3 unbuttoned with casual shirts though. Just gets too cold in Canada fir me to show half my chest in the dead of winter 😂
 

conak

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I leave the top two unbuttoned, but I find having two buttons is a bit much so I use a small strip of fabric tape between the second and third buttons so it's really only 1.5 buttons open. Now that I write it out, sounds pretty overkill :confused2:
Wow, I wouldn't think that would hold all day... But this is why MTO usually offer option to choose the button spacing. It's a surprisingly thin line between "I can't believe it's not butter" and "Guys, if you don't stop I'm telling the principal".
 

conak

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I usually only go 1 unbuttoned and it just makes it look better casually and usually opens nicely. In the summer, I will go 2-3 unbuttoned with casual shirts though. Just gets too cold in Canada fir me to show half my chest in the dead of winter 😂
Ha, true, but that's the beauty of a tie. It doesn't add much warmth by itself, but it let's you close your collar aesthetically. And if you don't want a tie, a scarf will always work.
 

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