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Spanking

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by Douglas, May 4, 2010.

  1. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    I think the concept of "time outs" almost deserves its own poll. Purely anecdotal, but to a child, the ones I see where "time out" is the preferred discipline of choice, you get bratty, misbehaved, spoiled little monsters that have no respect for adults, particularly their parents.
     
  2. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    I'd just like to take a moment to call shenanigans. When they learn that there's no bite behind your bark, then they'll tell you to fuck off and take the dessert, or steal your money and get their own dessert later that night. Grounding and other similar punishments take consent, which a pissed off kid isn't going to give.

    +1

    I can have my son go to his room, get me his favorite toy, and I can break it in front of him. why? because he knows that I will punish him worse if he doesn't comply with that punishment. a very very small amount of corporal punishment 5 years ago serves the purpose of showing that I will back up threats.

    again, I hardly have to punish my son at all any more, but when I do, he understands that there is a threat behind it.
     
  3. Matt

    Matt Senior member

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    I think the concept of "time outs" almost deserves its own poll. Purely anecdotal, but to a child, the ones I see where "time out" is the preferred discipline of choice, you get bratty, misbehaved, spoiled little monsters that have no respect for adults, particularly their parents.
    the only place timeouts work is here [​IMG]
     
  4. cross22

    cross22 Senior member

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    I'd just like to take a moment to call shenanigans. When they learn that there's no bite behind your bark, then they'll tell you to fuck off and take the dessert, or steal your money and get their own dessert later that night. Grounding and other similar punishments take consent, which a pissed off kid isn't going to give.

    Most responses to my comment are similar to this. I am not saying if your 16 year old comes home high you should take his desert away. I am saying from the beginning one could have used the above methods instead of spanking to discipline kids and teach them their bad behavior will have negative consequences.

    If your 16 year old is going to tell you to fuck off and steal your money, he will. And if you try to spank him, he will hit you back. The only choice left for you will be to really get into a brawl with him and physically dominate him. Good luck with that and make sure you stay in good shape.
     
  5. cross22

    cross22 Senior member

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    I think the concept of "time outs" almost deserves its own poll. Purely anecdotal, but to a child, the ones I see where "time out" is the preferred discipline of choice, you get bratty, misbehaved, spoiled little monsters that have no respect for adults, particularly their parents.
    Timeouts work great especially for boys < 4 years old who have a lot of energy and want to move around. There is nothing they hate more than sitting quietly and doing nothing for 10 minutes.
     
  6. Dedalus

    Dedalus Senior member

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    +1

    I can have my son go to his room, get me his favorite toy, and I can break it in front of him. why? because he knows that I will punish him worse if he doesn't comply with that punishment. a very very small amount of corporal punishment 5 years ago serves the purpose of showing that I will back up threats.

    again, I hardly have to punish my son at all any more, but when I do, he understands that there is a threat behind it.


    What is the difference between telling your kid to fetch his favorite toy and giving it to you to break or else you will spank him vs. telling your kid you will break his favorite toy in front of him if he doesn't stop acting like a jackass? The threat is just as real, no?
     
  7. Mark from Plano

    Mark from Plano Senior member

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    I think the concept of "time outs" almost deserves its own poll. Purely anecdotal, but to a child, the ones I see where "time out" is the preferred discipline of choice, you get bratty, misbehaved, spoiled little monsters that have no respect for adults, particularly their parents.

    The issue is that timeouts have to be strictly enforced and make the kid miserable to be effective. Most parents just aren't willing to follow through and that's why it doesn't really work. There are times however, when the kids are REALLY young (say under 7) when timeouts are about the only thing that will work.

    Disciplining properly without spanking is REALLY difficult and most parents who reject spanking do a damned poor job of it. It requires (for most people) extensive professional training and committment over a period of years to make it work. Many parents are unwilling to do that so they wind up with bratty kids.

    The basic brain functions of pleasure seeking and pain avoidance really are the primary motivators, despite how "developed" we think we've become. Children are master manipulators and if they aren't controlled early, often and consistently will become little monsters.
     
  8. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    Most responses to my comment are similar to this. I am not saying if your 16 year old comes home high you should take his desert away. I am saying from the beginning one could have used the above methods instead of spanking to discipline kids and teach them their bad behavior will have negative consequences.

    If your 16 year old is going to tell you to fuck off and steal your money, he will. And if you try to spank him, he will hit you back. The only choice left for you will be to really get into a brawl with him and physically dominate him. Good luck with that and make sure you stay in good shape.


    I find this post a little funny, given that you have already shown you a) believe in and b) are a proponent of Pavlov. It also shows you have probably never trained an animal.

    If you encode your physical dominance in someone from a young age (or any mammal, like a dog or horse), any normal 16 year old will have huge built in inhibitions from physically challenging you. It will not last forever but hopefully by the time the conditioning effectively wears off, they are a mature adult and physical challenges are not needed.
     
  9. Prada_Ferragamo

    Prada_Ferragamo Senior member

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    Most responses to my comment are similar to this. I am not saying if your 16 year old comes home high you should take his desert away. I am saying from the beginning one could have used the above methods instead of spanking to discipline kids and teach them their bad behavior will have negative consequences.

    If your 16 year old is going to tell you to fuck off and steal your money, he will. And if you try to spank him, he will hit you back. The only choice left for you will be to really get into a brawl with him and physically dominate him. Good luck with that and make sure you stay in good shape.


    That's why you have to hit the gym everyday. [​IMG]
     
  10. Mark from Plano

    Mark from Plano Senior member

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    +1

    I can have my son go to his room, get me his favorite toy, and I can break it in front of him. why? because he knows that I will punish him worse if he doesn't comply with that punishment. a very very small amount of corporal punishment 5 years ago serves the purpose of showing that I will back up threats.

    again, I hardly have to punish my son at all any more, but when I do, he understands that there is a threat behind it.


    We had something like this early on, except it was a charity box. The favorite toy wasn't broken it was given to charity. We'd drop the box off at the donation center on Saturdays.
     
  11. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    The issue is that timeouts have to be strictly enforced and make the kid miserable to be effective. Most parents just aren't willing to follow through and that's why it doesn't really work. There are times however, when the kids are REALLY young (say under 7) when timeouts are about the only thing that will work.

    Disciplining properly without spanking is REALLY difficult and most parents who reject spanking do a damned poor job of it. It requires (for most people) extensive professional training and committment over a period of years to make it work. Many parents are unwilling to do that so they wind up with bratty kids.

    The basic brain functions of pleasure seeking and pain avoidance really are the primary motivators, despite how "developed" we think we've become. Children are master manipulators and if they aren't controlled early, often and consistently will become little monsters.


    Mark, I would agree that in theory "time out" should work. However, sort of like communism, I have yet to see a parental unit that uses it as an effective tool of discipline.
     
  12. Thomas

    Thomas Senior member

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    +1

    I can have my son go to his room, get me his favorite toy, and I can break it in front of him. why? because he knows that I will punish him worse if he doesn't comply with that punishment. a very very small amount of corporal punishment 5 years ago serves the purpose of showing that I will back up threats.

    again, I hardly have to punish my son at all any more, but when I do, he understands that there is a threat behind it.


    This is important, and why I make it a point to never bluff with ours. If I lay out consequences, then I follow them to the letter, or invite disrespect. I have to pick out the consequences carefully, though.
     
  13. brlfvr

    brlfvr Senior member

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    I can't stand precocious children, but the adults who enable them are the worst [​IMG]

    +10. I was in a store recently where a kid was being really loud and rude right next to me. I asked the kid to calm down and the father told me "obviously you don't have kids". It's the idea that it's acceptable to have your kid lose his shit and cause a scene and act as if though that's just what kids do that makes me want to beat the parent not the kid.
     
  14. cross22

    cross22 Senior member

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  15. Prada_Ferragamo

    Prada_Ferragamo Senior member

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    Mark, I would agree that in theory "time out" should work. However, sort of like communism, I have yet to see a parental unit that uses it as an effective tool of discipline.
    I remember in child psych class that I took as an undergrad, we spent 2 weeks discussing physical punishment vs. timeouts and their impact on the child's well being. The conclusion was that if time out is used, it has to be used consistently and immediately to be effective, no maybes and buts. However most parents tend to cave in after a short while and the kids tend to resort back into their bad behaviors later. But if spanking was used, kids will associate physical pain with bad behavior, and think twice before they will behave badly again.
     
  16. Don Carlos

    Don Carlos Senior member

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    Yet another extremely disappointing thread title vs. thread delivery.

    I clicked here expecting skanks in schoolgirl outfits, and instead I get some ghey debate on child rearing.
     
  17. 1969

    1969 Senior member

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    Interesting topic. I (we) don't spank our son (he's 6) but I certainly imploy the &quot;thunder of the gods&quot; verbal approach when needed. In fact, I have calmly warned my son that I'm about to start screaming if he can't follow instructions. It scares the hell out of him when it does happen and I feel better about letting him know it's coming if he can't regroup.
     
  18. Matt

    Matt Senior member

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    It really isn't that difficult to understand. I simple terms, I am saying you your 4-year-old will respond to a spanking the same way he responds to a timeout. You are just picking the method that appeals to you more.
    no, the 4 year old looks at you blankly, ignores what you said, and goes back to being a precocious little shit when you threaten him with timeout. He cries when you spank him. That's a pretty big difference in response. edit - hey, you deleted your post...
     
  19. cross22

    cross22 Senior member

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    I find this post a little funny, given that you have already shown you a) believe in and b) are a proponent of Pavlov. It also shows you have probably never trained an animal.

    If you encode your physical dominance in someone from a young age (or any mammal, like a dog or horse), any normal 16 year old will have huge built in inhibitions from physically challenging you. It will not last forever but hopefully by the time the conditioning effectively wears off, they are a mature adult and physical challenges are not needed.


    Actually, if you look at statistics you see that kids who get spanked are far more likely to resort to violence as a form of conflict resolution than kids who don't. And by the time he gets his muscles and his hormones flowing and he is doing well beating people in the street he can't wait to beat you down exactly because of his previous fear.
     
  20. scarphe

    scarphe Senior member

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    Most responses to my comment are similar to this. I am not saying if your 16 year old comes home high you should take his desert away. I am saying from the beginning one could have used the above methods instead of spanking to discipline kids and teach them their bad behavior will have negative consequences.

    If your 16 year old is going to tell you to fuck off and steal your money, he will. And if you try to spank him, he will hit you back. The only choice left for you will be to really get into a brawl with him and physically dominate him. Good luck with that and make sure you stay in good shape.


    you do nto spank 10+ you beat them. the brawl you discuss will happen but only if the teen is sure he will win, the fear instilled from strength shown to him continously make that certain. for most teens that time never comes.
     

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