• I'm happy to introduce the Styleforum Happy Hour, our brand new podcast featuring lively discussion about menswear and the fashion industry. In the inaugural edition, a discussion of what's going on in retail today. Please check it out on the Journal. All episodes will be also be available soon on your favorite podcast platform.

  • Styleforum Gives - Holiday Charity Auction 8: Cuir de Russie card case from Equus Leather

    We are very proud to present this year's edition of the Styleforum Holiday Charity Auctions, this year in support of the Ronald McDonald House Charities of Spokane (www.rmhcspokane.org). Each Auction lasts 24 hours. Please follow and bid on all the auctions.

    The 8th auction is for a Cuir de Russie card case from Equus Leather. Please bid often and generously here

    Fok and the Styleforum Team.

  • STYLE. COMMUNITY. GREAT CLOTHING.

    Bored of counting likes on social networks? At Styleforum, you’ll find rousing discussions that go beyond strings of emojis.

    Click Here to join Styleforum's thousands of style enthusiasts today!

Somewhere, Sator is crying

james_timothy

Distinguished Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2008
Messages
2,492
Reaction score
94
Yes, but more importantly, which is it, black vest or gray vest?
 

Manton

RINO
Dubiously Honored
Joined
Apr 20, 2002
Messages
41,583
Reaction score
2,855
Gray.
 

Sanguis Mortuum

Distinguished Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2006
Messages
5,059
Reaction score
134
Next she'll have judges turning up in jeans...

Has anyone got any pictures of women in tails though? I can imagine it looking a bit strange. Maybe a sensible female alternative would be reasonable rather than abolishing it completely?
 

Mark from Plano

Lifestyle change - no homo
Joined
Apr 11, 2007
Messages
10,856
Reaction score
397
I would think that the thing that would make Sator cry is the fact that some idiot dressed, or ever considered dressing up a woman in men's formal daywear in the first place. Cross dressing should never have been part of court protocol and shouldn't be today. That said it would be a sad thing indeed if it were eliminated for formal presentations before the court by men.

What needs to happen is an evolution in women's professional dress that includes all levels of professional formality. What is more likely to be done is to simply do away with the morning coat as the author suggests.
 

JLibourel

Distinguished Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2004
Messages
8,754
Reaction score
467
Do they in fact wear morning coats or frock coats? I believe the author of the article seems not to realize that they are quite distinct and different garments.

Agree that it seems quite ridiculous to have women dressing in men's formal daywear.
 

Manton

RINO
Dubiously Honored
Joined
Apr 20, 2002
Messages
41,583
Reaction score
2,855
Originally Posted by JLibourel
Do they in fact wear morning coats or frock coats? I believe the author of the article seems not to realize that they are quite distinct and different garments.

Agree that it seems quite ridiculous to have women dressing in men's formal daywear.


It's a morning coat.
 

Morgan

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2006
Messages
660
Reaction score
492
I think that point is not so much that the clothing is archaic as that it's hopelessly gendered. You can't suggest a sensible female alternative because there is none, unless it's an off-the-shoulder gown. Morning dress is still okay for non-professional purposes like weddings and, uh ... weddings. But in the 21st century morning dress is a costume, and it's so distinctively masculine as to make it clear that the solicitor general is a man's job. A sensible female alternative would be a very conservative modern pantsuit or skirt suit, neither of which existed when morning dress was standard court attire outside the Supreme Court. If you allow that, then what's to keep the next male solicitor general from wearing a modern conservative business suit? Tradition no longer exerts its restraint once you've allowed women to go modern. But you can't keep women in archaic men's clothing either, because it's ridiculous on its face.
 

Infrasonic

Distinguished Member
Joined
May 27, 2007
Messages
1,900
Reaction score
217
I could be wrong but I believe male/female barristers in England wear the same outfits to court...
 

james_timothy

Distinguished Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2008
Messages
2,492
Reaction score
94
Originally Posted by Morgan
Tradition no longer exerts its restraint once you've allowed women to go modern.
Yes it does, just not as a strict rule. 30 years is too short for a decent new form to be derived from the old traditions and accepted. Women's wear steals liberally from distinctly masculine wear. Give it time- another 20 years or so.
 

Bhowie

Stylish Dinosaur
Joined
Oct 5, 2008
Messages
13,850
Reaction score
3,991
Originally Posted by Mark from Plano
I would think that the thing that would make Sator cry is the fact that some idiot dressed, or ever considered dressing up a woman in men's formal daywear in the first place. Cross dressing should never have been part of court protocol and shouldn't be today. That said it would be a sad thing indeed if it were eliminated for formal presentations before the court by men.

What needs to happen is an evolution in women's professional dress that includes all levels of professional formality. What is more likely to be done is to simply do away with the morning coat as the author suggests.


+1
 

Infrasonic

Distinguished Member
Joined
May 27, 2007
Messages
1,900
Reaction score
217
Originally Posted by literasyme
Underneath their gowns? Really?

Never heard of Knight of the garter..?
 

greekonomist

Distinguished Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
1,500
Reaction score
3
OK, anybody know what Scalia's avatar is on SF? Manton?
 

Styleforum is proudly sponsored by

Featured Sponsor

How many pairs of shoes do you own?

  • 1 - 4

    Votes: 31 3.7%
  • 5 - 10

    Votes: 143 17.2%
  • 11 - 20

    Votes: 276 33.1%
  • 21 - 30

    Votes: 130 15.6%
  • 31 - 40

    Votes: 71 8.5%
  • 41 - 50

    Votes: 49 5.9%
  • 51 - 60

    Votes: 25 3.0%
  • 61 - 70

    Votes: 22 2.6%
  • 71 - 80

    Votes: 17 2.0%
  • 81 - 90

    Votes: 7 0.8%
  • 91 - 100

    Votes: 9 1.1%
  • 100+

    Votes: 53 6.4%

Related Threads

Forum statistics

Threads
429,166
Messages
9,229,704
Members
193,747
Latest member
geraldreed4545
Top