I ordered these through a local haberdashery here in Charlotte so I could try on a similar pair at their store prior to ordering. We picked out all the options I wanted and the store handled the order from Rancourt. Unfortunately, for whatever reason, the ones I ordered fit a TINY bit differently than the beefroll loafers I tried on and and they slip on my heel. Understandably, the store can't take back this custom-made shoe they do not stock. I ended up paying about $450 for them. They are basically Rancourt Beefroll loafers but in the "Venetian" style. So they have the flat upper with no penny holder thing. They also have the Lactae Herve gumsoles which I really like. These shoes are ALMOST perfect for me except for the slippage on my skinny heels which is often a problem for me. It's a REALLY good looking shoe though and exceptionally comfortable. I have worn them for a total of about 5 min, in my bedroom on carpet trying to convince myself that they fit. But they just don't. I would like to get $275 for them if possible. Thanks.