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Satin Tie

bcjohn

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I have my eye on a couple of satin ties. Are satin ties appropriate for business wear? Or, are they too formal? Thanks.
 

LaoHu

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Originally Posted by bcjohn
I have my eye on a couple of satin ties. Are satin ties appropriate for business wear? Or, are they too formal? Thanks.

I prefer to wear satin ties with a suit in the evening at social (non-business) occasions.
 

Testudo_Aubreii

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I'm reviving this thread to raise a question. The sartorial adepts here and at AAAC tend to agree that it's hard to make a satin tie look good, especially in the daytime, and that they aren't very versatile. Even for black tie, where you'd think satin is a natural fabric, most knowledgeable commentators prefer black grosgrain over black satin.

I used to agree with this, probably because I'd seen too many pictures of bright red or gold or cream satin ties worn with dark, matte-finish suits. Those ensembles, IMO, are egregious.

I think the problem is that the tie's having both a bright color and the shiny finish of a satin weave contrasts too much with the matte finishes and dark or neutral colors of most suits. It's an unholy combination of Beau Brummel's subdued wool dress coat and the Scarlet Pimpernel's peacocky satin court suit. The effect is that the tie is thrown in your face. The only way to avoid the enormous contrast while keeping the peacocky tie is to wear a high-sheen suit or a bright-colored suit. And even with a cream linen suit, Trump's tie would still make an eye-popping contrast. So it seems that the consensus is right about bright-colored satins.

But is it right about dark or neutral-colored satins? The more I think about it, the more I wonder whether a black, midnight blue, or gray (but not silver) satin tie isn't an excellent way to liven up a boring daytime suit-shirt combination.

C. P. Snow liked black or dark navy satins with his sober suit-shirt combos:




So did Joseph Austen Chamberlain (Neville's half-brother):


Connery Bond did it in a mid-to-light-gray with his otherwise dreadfully dull navy 2pc and white shirt:

Sober but not severe, as it would have been had that tie had a matte finish.

Look how this black satin subtly livens up Alexander Korda's gray flannel 3pc and white shirt:

Had he worn a bright blue satin like Trump's, the effect would have been garish: enormous contrast with the flannel, equivalent to jamming the tie in your face. Had he worn a solid reppe in navy or black, the ensemble would have been dreadfully dull. (No accident that this is from asuitablewardrobe.dynend.com, Will being a discerning fan of certain satins.)

Ralph works the texture contrast of flannel and satin in this SF post. Not bad, but would have been better with a navy satin.

I'm on the fence about this Pacific blue satin worn by Moore Bond (stolen from Matt S's excellent bondclothes blog):


I think it works, but only because the 6x3 DB coat has such a high wrap that it hides most of the tie.

So I am wondering whether the conclusion is: black, very dark blue, and non-silver gray satins can subtly liven up severe suit-shirt combos.

But what about dark purple? Here we come to a difficult and controversial area, as purple always is. I would say that George Osborne's mildly-dark purple satin with sober suit-shirt combo the other day

is still too close to Trump. While miles better, it still over-presents the tie. A grenadine in that shade and hue would have been much better. But what if we swapped that shade and hue for something two or three shades darker, or with a navy undertone to it, like dark indigo? What say you, SF?
 
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Gdot

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Perhaps.

However, I simply find plain satin ties to be too delicate to be worth the trouble when there are so many other good choices out there. It seems they are completely unforgiving of the slightest rumple, rub, or tiny spot of soup. Either they are pristine or they look like trash.

Given that there are so many other great choices - why go there?

(Said he, who just recently was once again suckered into the shiny sparkle of an apple green satin tie only to wear it once and be disappointed by it's totally unforgiving nature.)
 

LeviMay

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not too formaljust too shiny.

I simply find plain satin ties to be too delicate to be worth the trouble when there are so many other good choices out there.

Both of these.

During the day, even the best satin ties have a tendency to look cheap, due to their shininess. In the evening, when condensation from one's gin is prone to falling and staining all but the darkest satins, they are a risk. Either way, there are many much better choices.
 

Testudo_Aubreii

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Interesting point about the rumpling problem, Gdot. The risk of stains is present with any tie: it's why I wear bibs when eating anything dangerous. But satins do seem to noticeably rumple/wrinkle more than any other tie fabric, except maybe cotton. I wonder whether the Fermo Fossati satin that Sam Hober sells might be better at resisting rumples than most RTW satins. I also wonder whether thickening the interlining might also help. David Hober would know.
 

Gdot

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Interesting point about the rumpling problem, Gdot. The risk of stains is present with any tie: it's why I wear bibs when eating anything dangerous. But satins do seem to noticeably rumple/wrinkle more than any other tie fabric, except maybe cotton. I wonder whether the Fermo Fossati satin that Sam Hober sells might be better at resisting rumples than most RTW satins. I also wonder whether thickening the interlining might also help. David Hober would know.


Not sure I can get with the bib idea - unless you're sitting around the house in a tie and bib. But whaddo I know? :D

I doubt more lining would help with the rumpling. Perhaps a higher quality thicker silk as you mention might work.

It's just all so dreadfully tiring to think about that I find myself saying - why bother?
 

Mr. Pink

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Glen plaid navy suit, grey and white microcheck shirt and navy Fermo Fossati tie from Sam Hober. At least on sober colors like this I disagree with the conventional wisdom. I've tried this same combination with oxford weave and reppe navy ties. It doesn't work without the contrasting texture of the satin. Incidentally, the Hober FF ties are less glossy than most satins and are not particularly delicate or prone to rumpling. The colors are very deep and true.


 

Gdot

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^^^^^^^^ Wonderful ^^^^^^^
 

ShayaEXQT

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i find the problem with satin is that they are more prone to the little bit of dry skin on your finger making a pull than other ties...
 

Testudo_Aubreii

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Nice and sharp, Mr. Pink. That's the look C. P. Snow went for. Sober suit, sober shirt, dark satin tie. Is that the Dark Navy David Hober is currently selling as #7? http://www.samhober.com/solid-fermo-fossati-satin-ties/

Interesting point about water drops leaving temporary stains, LeviMay. That probably means that only the dark satins are really versatile. The temporary dark spot would be too noticeable on the lighter colors.

So the conclusion thus far seems to be: black, midnight blue, dark navy, and oxford gray can make good ties in satin, IF the satin is a beefy, wrinkle-resistant fabric like Sam Hober's Fermo Fossati.

Anybody know how dark David's Dark Charcoal FF satin is? On my monitor, it looks like mid-gray.
 

Mr. Pink

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Nice and sharp, Mr. Pink. That's the look C. P. Snow went for. Sober suit, sober shirt, dark satin tie. Is that the Dark Navy David Hober is currently selling as #7? http://www.samhober.com/solid-fermo-fossati-satin-ties/
Interesting point about water drops leaving temporary stains, LeviMay. That probably means that only the dark satins are really versatile. The temporary dark spot would be too noticeable on the lighter colors.
So the conclusion thus far seems to be: black, midnight blue, dark navy, and oxford gray can make good ties in satin, IF the satin is a beefy, wrinkle-resistant fabric like Sam Hober's Fermo Fossati.
Anybody know how dark David's Dark Charcoal FF satin is? On my monitor, it looks like mid-gray.

I can't remember if it's dark navy or navy. I ordered quite awhile ago when David was offering the FF satins only as pocket squares. I have swatches for the rest and the dark charcoal is dark, much darker than David's charcoal grenadine or repp silks. I intend to order one at some point.
 

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