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Elessar

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Paul, hello from Cambridge! Becoming increasingly interested in shopping and supporting local, I've been exploring your offerings (alongwith, say, Old Town in Norfolk). I am absolutely in love with the aesthetic of the items on offer from you.

One thing I haven't been able to determine is your return policy for online orders. As I say above, I live in Cambridge, so London is not very far--however the website seems to indicate that you're not often open to visitors. In the absence of being able to try multiple items in-store in various sizes, is it possible to order a few and then send them back your way if the size or style doesn't fit? I can even bring them back to you in person--visits to London aren't very infrequent.
 

sehkelly

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One thing I haven't been able to determine is your return policy for online orders. As I say above, I live in Cambridge, so London is not very far--however the website seems to indicate that you're not often open to visitors. In the absence of being able to try multiple items in-store in various sizes, is it possible to order a few and then send them back your way if the size or style doesn't fit? I can even bring them back to you in person--visits to London aren't very infrequent.

Thanks for the kind words!

Sure, yes — we routinely send out more than one size to customers, and they're entirely welcome to send back whatever doesn't work out for them.

Note that the cost of the return is down to the customer, however, as we don't do free returns. However, we can book a return on behalf of the customer with DHL — with DHL either coming to their door for a collection, or with the customer dropping the parcel off at a local DHL collection point. Again, not free of charge, but likely easier and cheaper than sending via other means (more so for international customers than in the UK, but still probably a few quid to the good).
 

Elessar

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Fantastic, thank you very much Paul / @sehkelly! I am sure you'll be hearing from me before long.

And just to confirm, you do not open the workshop at all to come look at and perhaps try things? I will likely be in London a couple times in the next couple weeks, so was wondering about the possibility.
 

ojaw

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Fantastic, thank you very much Paul / @sehkelly! I am sure you'll be hearing from me before long.

And just to confirm, you do not open the workshop at all to come look at and perhaps try things? I will likely be in London a couple times in the next couple weeks, so was wondering about the possibility.
Good luck with that : )
I was lucky enough to be in London years ago when the shop was still open to the public - I remember it being about the size of a lavatory, with a loft. Smelt much better though.
 

Jnarcane

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Paul, why are the sleeves of the field shirt shorter than those of the shirt -- while the chest bigger?
 

sehkelly

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The shirt is cut as a traditional dress shirt, with sleeves that taper to a tight cuff, permitting a jacket to easily slide over the top.

The sleeves on the shirt are longer than on any of our other garments to account for the fact a shirt should always reach the wristband, and ideally stop at the wrist bone, showing a fraction if you have a jacket worn over the top, and thus the cuff is tight and grips the wrist in that area -- and with the excess length gathering the length of the arm, as e.g.

shirt-button-down-bd-needlecord-barley-worn-3@2x.jpg


The extra length also takes into account that a shirt will be washed repeatedly, usually (let's be realistic!) in a washing machine, and so will shrink in length gradually the first handful of washes. If you lose 2cm in the length over that time, it's just as well it had more than 2cm in excess in the first place!

The field shirt is cut as a relaxed jacket, and so the sleeves are wider and shorter, with a less tight cuff, and there's more room in the body -- both good for layering. If it had the same measurements as the shirt it'd be good for neither, with insufficient ease in the body and sleeve for anything to be worn underneath.
 

sehkelly

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Fantastic, thank you very much Paul / @sehkelly! I am sure you'll be hearing from me before long.

And just to confirm, you do not open the workshop at all to come look at and perhaps try things? I will likely be in London a couple times in the next couple weeks, so was wondering about the possibility.

I am alas almost never there anymore. It is a shame but being a two-person operation means we have to be really strict and streamlined with out time, and that means almost every waking hour is given to managing the website, developing the garments, and packing orders for customers.
 

Jnarcane

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The shirt is cut as a traditional dress shirt, with sleeves that taper to a tight cuff, permitting a jacket to easily slide over the top.

The sleeves on the shirt are longer than on any of our other garments to account for the fact a shirt should always reach the wristband, and ideally stop at the wrist bone, showing a fraction if you have a jacket worn over the top, and thus the cuff is tight and grips the wrist in that area -- and with the excess length gathering the length of the arm, as e.g.

View attachment 2198787

The extra length also takes into account that a shirt will be washed repeatedly, usually (let's be realistic!) in a washing machine, and so will shrink in length gradually the first handful of washes. If you lose 2cm in the length over that time, it's just as well it had more than 2cm in excess in the first place!

The field shirt is cut as a relaxed jacket, and so the sleeves are wider and shorter, with a less tight cuff, and there's more room in the body -- both good for layering. If it had the same measurements as the shirt it'd be good for neither, with insufficient ease in the body and sleeve for anything to be worn underneath.
That all makes sense to me except the sleeve length of the field shirt being shorter. Although tradition demands that shirt cuffs peek out from the sleeves of a suit jacket or sport coat, to my mind, that norm doesn't exist for an overshirt or casual workweary jacket. I'd expect a jacket of that sort to have sleeves at least as long as what's under it. Am I wrong?

Edit: Per your point, I suppose that for some wearers, the shirt would have lesser or equal effective length than the field shirt due to the tighter cuff.
 
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Iskander

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That all makes sense to me except the sleeve length of the field shirt being shorter. Although tradition demands that shirt cuffs peek out from the sleeves of a suit jacket or sport coat, to my mind, that norm doesn't exist for an overshirt or casual workweary jacket. I'd expect a jacket of that sort to have sleeves at least as long as what's under it. Am I wrong?

Edit: Per your point, I suppose that for some wearers, the shirt would have lesser or equal effective length than the field shirt due to the tighter cuff.
You are overthinking this, my man
 

sehkelly

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That all makes sense to me except the sleeve length of the field shirt being shorter. Although tradition demands that shirt cuffs peek out from the sleeves of a suit jacket or sport coat, to my mind, that norm doesn't exist for an overshirt or casual workweary jacket. I'd expect a jacket of that sort to have sleeves at least as long as what's under it. Am I wrong?

Edit: Per your point, I suppose that for some wearers, the shirt would have lesser or equal effective length than the field shirt due to the tighter cuff.

If the field shirt had sleeves as long as a dress shirt, given the width of those sleeves and the thus the almost entirely untrammelled way they traverse the (meagre) meat of my arm, they would extend over my wrist and onto my hand.

Likewise if the shirt had sleeves the same length as the field shirt, given how slim they are, they would ride up every time I bent my arm, and might disappear from view when worn under a jacket, and so necessitating that awful constant half-blind yanking to bring them back into place which I'm sure we've all suffered wearing a shirt with sleeves a bit too short. And that's before the shirt is machine-washed a few times.

It's really just one of those situations when in practice on the body it just works, but when set into words seems complicated.

Maybe best to say in short — it isn't so much the length of the two sleeves measured side by side, flat, which should be compared, but as often with clothing, the finished length on the body.
 
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nbm

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If the field shirt had sleeves as long as a dress shirt, given the width of those sleeves and the thus the almost entirely untrammelled way they traverse the (meagre) meat of my arm, they might well extend over my hand, with just the ends of my fingers waggling below to indicate any sign of life.

Likewise if the shirt had sleeves the same length as the field shirt, given how slim they are, they would ride up above my radius every time I bent my arm, and would readily disappear from view when worn under a jacket and so necessitating that awful half-blind yanking and tugging to bring them back into place, again and again, which I'm sure we've all suffered wearing a shirt with sleeves too short.

It's really just one of those situations when in practice on the body it just works, but when set into words seems complicated.
I just want to say that the level of time and consideration you put into comments from both current and potentially future customers on this forum is unmatched. It's really remarkable to hear you explain WHY you make certain decisions and trade offs. I honestly don't understand how you do it and run a business at the same time, but it is appreciated and has had significant impact on how I look at garments today.
 

sehkelly

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I just want to say that the level of time and consideration you put into comments from both current and potentially future customers on this forum is unmatched. It's really remarkable to hear you explain WHY you make certain decisions and trade offs. I honestly don't understand how you do it and run a business at the same time, but it is appreciated and has had significant impact on how I look at garments today.

Thanks very much.

I enjoy doing it. We put a lot of thought into every aspect of every garment and strive to do our best. The inevitable, inescapable effluence (!) of that process is what I write here in answer to the questions and comments everyone is kind enough to post.
 

Csus2

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Someone is having a fire sale of SEH Kelly trousers over on grailed. They’re all size 32 so they are too big for me, but I figured someone here would be interested.
 
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