regimental tie- disbanded regiment

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by globetrotter, Apr 15, 2005.

  1. Dakota rube

    Dakota rube Senior member

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    I'm interested in the dynamics of this discussion: is it breaking down on "military/non-military background" lines, or is it something else. I'm thinking I'm seeing a respect-for-the-uniform kind of thing going on here. Is that the case gt?

    I'm of the mind that I, as one who never served, can't fully appreciate a uniform as something more than clothing.
     


  2. LondonCalling

    LondonCalling Member

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    My Marine Corps color is red; to show the world the blood we've shed... ...but I digress. The United States Marine Corps tie; stripe runs from the right shoulder to the left hip. I wear this proudly and will assume you're a Marine if you're wearing one as well. Ties That Bind Us
     


  3. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    that may be it, DR, my feeling falls on two issues - I don't like the idea of adult men "dressing up" wearing clothes that are designed and decorated specifically for group or task or field that they are not part of - for instance "cowboy clothes" or a "firemans coat" etc.

    the other is definatly a pride thing - a regimental tie/hat/shirt is something that is earned and should be worn by somebody who has either earned it or, in rare exeptions, a close family member of same. I worked very very hard for the right to wear my red beret, and won the right to wear my lapel pin by putting myself in harms way. I would take offence if I saw somebody who didn't have the right to wear either wearing them.

    but I think that this has some flexibility - I recently bought an antique aviators watch. it has no insignia on it, but part of the reason that I bought it is the idea that it's history was cool. no body would see me and think that I may be a wwii pilot, and 99% of the people who see me won't register it as a pilots watch (the only way that I know it is a pilots watch is that an old RAF pilot friend of mine told me). I also have several ex-communist artifacts, minus the insignia, and what might have been an official issue french navy peacoat in wwii, minus insignia.

    but these are all things that in no way indicate membership in an organization. I was a little borderline about a regiment that had been disbanded 50 years ago, but I still feel that that is not "me".
     


  4. dah328

    dah328 Senior member

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    So the red in the tie symbolizes something different than the red stripe down the trousers on the dress uniform?  That's from Chapultepec, right?

    dan
     


  5. Mr Checks

    Mr Checks Senior member

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    My good man:

    Please don't wear it.  My grandfather was in that regiment, serving King and country out amongst the provincial folk.

    If you had it on in my presence, we'd have to engage in a duel at 30 paces, weapons of your choice (suitings a solid country brown).

    My second, Smedley (of the Lancashire Smedleys), would take up my cause if I were felled by your musketball.

    You are on notice.
     


  6. LondonCalling

    LondonCalling Member

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    Dah328,
    You're correct in the sense that after the battle, in which Marine Officers and NCO's represented 90% of the casualties, the blood stripe was reintroduced as part of the uniform (and called so). But trousers on earlier versions of Marine uniforms had scarlet piping.
    The lyrics to a running cadence were a way to make a point that military symbols represent more than (in this case) clothing. That said, the scarlet on the tie, along with the gold represent the colors of the Marine Corps; the field of green "enjoys semi-official standing."
     


  7. JLibourel

    JLibourel Senior member

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    "Musketball"????... No gentleman would duel with a musket.
     


  8. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    (esquire. @ April 15 2005,11:06)
    Honestly, I think it's sort of a marketing gimmick by Ben Silver in some respects that they include the info on what college or regiment the tie is from-- since after all Brooks Brothers etc sell similar designs with no description except what colors they are.
    The key difference is that most American regimental ties including Brooks Brothers will have the lines slanted in one direction, opposite of the british reg. ties so as not to confuse the two.
    Ok. Â Well I guess you have me curious about this now-- the Ben Silver ties are "authentic regimental" ties and presumably B.S. is doing a decent business selling these ties in the U.S.-- but not to former members of these regiments or graduates of the universities and clubs in their magazine?? Am I off base on this?
    true, most people do not mind wearing authentic regimental or club ties.
     


  9. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    I believe that the Robert Talbott company got its start by making "authentic regimentals" back in the 60s, the only difference being that the stripes went the other way.  They sold them at their little store in Carmel, California and at California "Trad" shops like Cable Car Clothiers, Carroll & Co., George J. Goode, and Patrick James.  As the company grew, they came to rely less on these old patterns and more on flashier stuff.  Then Talbott, Sr. died and his widow and one of his sons took the business in a different direction.  I always assumed that Ben Silver stepped in to meet the demand, as the timing seemed right.  Only, of course, Ben Silver's stripes go in the correct direction, and they are always made in the right width.
     


  10. Nonk

    Nonk Senior member

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    I would never wear it, no matter how much I liked the colour/design etc, it is not my Regiment. Why anyone would want to in those circumstances is beyond me.
     


  11. alchimiste

    alchimiste Senior member

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    In this case we know it corresponds to an actual regiment. What if you just see a striped tie you happen to like? Do you research first whether it belongs to something already or assume it may and stay clear?
     


  12. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    The Italians make a ton of striped ties that are not tied to any regiment or school. It is usually quite easy to find a color palate similar to whatever regimental tie you may be lusting after, though the stripe pattern is not likely to be identical. The nice thing about Italian stripes is that the silk tends to have some surface interest, as opposed to plain, boring, run-of-the-mill repp silk. (Not that there's anything wrong with it.)
     


  13. Nonk

    Nonk Senior member

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    The only striped ties I wear are of the regiments etc I am entitled to wear, so it is not an issue for me although I appreciate your point. Wearing a regimental tie without entitlement could be excused if through ignorance, but in this case we have already established the connection, so why do it?
     


  14. NoVaguy

    NoVaguy Senior member

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    well, i wouldn't wear a regimental in england (if ever - the only one i have is a red and blue tie), but then, i am not in england.
     


  15. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    In this case we know it corresponds to an actual regiment. What if you just see a striped tie you happen to like? Do you research first whether it belongs to something already or assume it may and stay clear?
    The only striped ties I wear are of the regiments etc I am entitled to wear, so it is not an issue for me although I appreciate your point. Wearing a regimental tie without entitlement could be excused if through ignorance, but in this case we have already established the connection, so why do it?
    actually, Nonk, I was most interested in your opinion - I was wondering if there was any type of "exception" for regiments that had been disbanded, or some such rule. But intuitivly I figured there wasn't
     


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