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regimental tie- disbanded regiment

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by globetrotter, Apr 15, 2005.

  1. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    I saw a tie in the new Ben Silver catalogue - page 10. this is for an authentic regiment, but one that has been disbanded 50 years ago (an Indian regiment in the british army). I am very much against wearing somebody elses regimental tie, but I liked the colors a lot. this is a little bit of a moral slippery slope for me - anybody have any thoughts on this?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 4, 2011
  2. dah328

    dah328 Senior member

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    I'm with you -- I wouldn't wear it. I would try to find the same colors in a different tie, but obviously, that's easier said than done.

    dan
     
  3. Manton

    Manton Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I think you can wear it in the US with absolutely no concern at all. Probably in the UK too. If, that is, you can satisfy your own conscience.
     
  4. STYLESTUDENT

    STYLESTUDENT Senior member

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    You'd be breaking my rule: if you doubt an item sufficient to post about it, you shouldn't buy it. As you're an ex-military man and appear to avoid self-indulgence (e.g. another man's regimental tie, whether disbanded 50 years ago or not), you'd probably question the tie every time you put it on.
     
  5. Charley

    Charley Senior member

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    I would not run my horse in someone else's silks.
     
  6. aybojs

    aybojs Senior member

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    I think it's pretty pointless to be hung up about it. Just because an old regiment happened to have its stripes in a certain color pattern, does that somehow mean that nobody else can ever wear stripes in those colors? It seems unreasonable to expect that idea to be upheld in principle or in practice, and especially in the U.S., where the average person a) won't recognize the stripes as "belonging" to a certain group or b) doesn't believe in adding artificial weight to something just because a bunch of old guys did it a long time ago, you shouldn't have any reason to be concerned.

    The only scenario I could see regimental patterns being an issue is wearing a group's colors when you're around people of that group but not part of it (say a blue and white striped tie to a party filled with Yale alumni), but otherwise I don't get what the fuss is over.
     
  7. FIHTies

    FIHTies Senior member Affiliate Vendor

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    But if you get scalped dont blame anyone but yourself... [​IMG]
     
  8. alchimiste

    alchimiste Senior member

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    What if Beau Brummell or the duke of Windsor had decided that the clothes they invented were their own? Your wardrobe would look very different nowadays.

    This issue is a lot like companies trying to trademark dictionary words and then consider these words as their property.

    If you show up with a regimental tie at a military thing or with a tie corresponding to some university association at one of the meetings you pretend you are one of them when you actually are not. Rest of the time why should they own that design?

    If you wear a dinner jacket you imply that you are rich/educated/ a gentleman/other. Are you? Should you avoid wearing one?

    Should all American wear sack suits because doing otherwise would be akin to pretending they are British/Neapolitan/Roman?

    Mathieu
     
  9. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    thanks all. I think that stylestudent and Manton hit it on the head - it is perfectly acceptable, and there is no chance that it would offend anybody, but I get the feeling that I wouldn't wear it very much as it would always make me a little uncomfortable - I don't know if I could get it past my consience.
     
  10. JLibourel

    JLibourel Senior member

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    Hmmm...my wife has a couple of Ralph Lauren jackets in the Black Watch plaid and I have had various garments in the past with the Black Watch plaid, but neither of us have ever served in the "Auld Forty-Twa." I have owned several plaid shirts in the Black Stewart and Ancient Hunting Stewart plaids over the years although I have no affinity with that house of princes. On the other hand, I suppose that a regimental tie is a mark of membership in a way that a plaid shirt or jacket is not. As to a regiment that had been disbanded for 50 years, I would probably second the opinion of wearing it stateside but not in the UK. Lord knows, I have seen enough "Balliol" ties over the years here in the USA that I don't even bother questioning the wearer if he had been, in fact, a Balliol man.
     
  11. dah328

    dah328 Senior member

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    While I don't think it would be an egregious breach of propriety to wear that tie in the US, the dinner jacket/suit silhouette analogy just doesn't hold.  Those items imply, at most, a certain lifestyle or background and make no other statement about the wearer.  On the other hand, the design of that particular tie was specifically intended to represent military service in a very definite regiment.  Knowing that was the case would be enough to deter me from wearing it.

    dan
     
  12. StagRaven

    StagRaven Well-Known Member

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    whatever, guys. I'm wearing this one, and there's nothing anyone can do about it. [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  13. esquire.

    esquire. Senior member

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    The key difference is that most American regimental ties including Brooks Brothers will have the lines slanted in one direction, opposite of the british reg. ties so as not to confuse the two.
     
  14. FIHTies

    FIHTies Senior member Affiliate Vendor

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    Regarding the direction of the stripes
     
  15. NoVaguy

    NoVaguy Senior member

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    don't regimental ties have to be slanted in a certain direction?  wouldn't simply getting the mirror image of that tie suffice for avoiding wearing someone elses tie?

    edit: looks like everybody else is bringing up this point....
     
  16. Dakota rube

    Dakota rube Senior member

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    I'm interested in the dynamics of this discussion: is it breaking down on "military/non-military background" lines, or is it something else. I'm thinking I'm seeing a respect-for-the-uniform kind of thing going on here. Is that the case gt?

    I'm of the mind that I, as one who never served, can't fully appreciate a uniform as something more than clothing.
     
  17. LondonCalling

    LondonCalling Member

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    My Marine Corps color is red; to show the world the blood we've shed... ...but I digress. The United States Marine Corps tie; stripe runs from the right shoulder to the left hip. I wear this proudly and will assume you're a Marine if you're wearing one as well. Ties That Bind Us
     
  18. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    that may be it, DR, my feeling falls on two issues - I don't like the idea of adult men "dressing up" wearing clothes that are designed and decorated specifically for group or task or field that they are not part of - for instance "cowboy clothes" or a "firemans coat" etc.

    the other is definatly a pride thing - a regimental tie/hat/shirt is something that is earned and should be worn by somebody who has either earned it or, in rare exeptions, a close family member of same. I worked very very hard for the right to wear my red beret, and won the right to wear my lapel pin by putting myself in harms way. I would take offence if I saw somebody who didn't have the right to wear either wearing them.

    but I think that this has some flexibility - I recently bought an antique aviators watch. it has no insignia on it, but part of the reason that I bought it is the idea that it's history was cool. no body would see me and think that I may be a wwii pilot, and 99% of the people who see me won't register it as a pilots watch (the only way that I know it is a pilots watch is that an old RAF pilot friend of mine told me). I also have several ex-communist artifacts, minus the insignia, and what might have been an official issue french navy peacoat in wwii, minus insignia.

    but these are all things that in no way indicate membership in an organization. I was a little borderline about a regiment that had been disbanded 50 years ago, but I still feel that that is not "me".
     
  19. dah328

    dah328 Senior member

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    So the red in the tie symbolizes something different than the red stripe down the trousers on the dress uniform?  That's from Chapultepec, right?

    dan
     
  20. Mr Checks

    Mr Checks Senior member

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    My good man:

    Please don't wear it.  My grandfather was in that regiment, serving King and country out amongst the provincial folk.

    If you had it on in my presence, we'd have to engage in a duel at 30 paces, weapons of your choice (suitings a solid country brown).

    My second, Smedley (of the Lancashire Smedleys), would take up my cause if I were felled by your musketball.

    You are on notice.
     

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