Recent Sartorialist Looks

[TheFoo]

Originally Posted by barims

I don't find the jacket particularly cropped - it seems to be more of a short sizing. It's pretty near to his hands as laid by his sides. The sleeve length appears fine to my European-biased eye, and allows for a neat layering technique with his other sleeves. The colour mix is good, though it seems inadvertently(?) influenced by Tom Baker's Doctor, right down to the scarf. I concur with your explanation for his jacket pull

I don't see what's particularly 'European' about too-short jacket sleeves. At the length they are, the jacket is unwearable unless you wear it with a sweater like he is (and whether that looks good is another issue). Imagine if he were just wearing a shirt under it; he'd be showing more than three inches of cuff! My European tailor would not let me walk out the door with sleeves like that.

The colors are okay, I suppose. Other than the scarf. Brownish jacket, brownish pants, brownish scarf: two out of three may have been fine, but three out of three implies he doesn't know how to match colors. Honestly, I see a dozen people dressed more or less the same as this guy on the NYC subway every day.

 

[barims]

^ 'Ello, foof. I live in London and see this length of sleeve constantly on the natives, the Euro guys and even myself, so my familiarity with this look is what led to that statement

What colours would you have mixed in? I thought he was smart enough to keep the presentation reasonably minimal. I looked at the scarf in isolation because he isn't actually wearing it, nor should he on an ensemble that lightly coloured (cardie aside)

 

[TheFoo]

Originally Posted by barims

^ 'Ello, foof. I live in London and see this length of sleeve constantly on the natives, the Euro guys and even myself, so my familiarity with this look is what led to that statement

What colours would you have mixed in? I thought he was smart enough to keep the presentation reasonably minimal. I looked at the scarf in isolation because he isn't actually wearing it, nor should he on an ensemble that lightly coloured (cardie aside)

You see too-short sleeves and generally ill-fitting jackets all over the world. It isn't necessarily a favorable fashion or 'European' in any good way just because it may be seen with frequency in Europe. Anyway, like I alluded to already, I doubt a Savile Row tailor would cut you sleeves like that if he were were doing his job. So, which is more European, the way he'd tailor you a jacket, or the way this guy is wearing his?

As for colors: I would ditch the shirt and the scarf. A blue or white shirt would look better with the red sweater he's got on. I'd make the scarf blue, dark plum, or orange.

 

[Nicola]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

My European tailor would not let me walk out the door with sleeves like that.

Your tailor knows he is working for an American. I routinely get handed things the locals would consider normal and have to hand them back.

 

[barims]

^ Easy now, I gave you an explanation of something I'm accustomed to, not an invitation for an e-debate Of course, an example of a Savile Row tailor is far more specifically English than the generalised examples I cited, so that's not exactly the same thing. It also hinges on an implied supposition that everyone with this "issue" has had some sort of direct experience of Savile Row tailoring or patronises one and should therefore not have such sleeves by default Point being - this isn't my bugbear, dude

 

[TheFoo]

Originally Posted by Nicola

Your tailor knows he is working for an American. I routinely get handed things the locals would consider normal and have to hand them back.

Okay, find me a reputable European bespoke tailor that cuts sleeves like that for the locals, preferring to show three inches of cuff, and I'll eat my words.

Originally Posted by barims

Of course, an example of a Savile Row tailor is far more specifically English than the generalised examples I cited, so that's not exactly the same thing. It also hinges on an implied supposition that everyone with this "issue" has had some sort of direct experience of Savile Row tailoring or patronises one and should therefore not have such sleeves by default

I think you're conflating popularity with rightness. You may not think the latter exists in any meaningful way, but it's not the same as the former in any case. Even if the 'default' sleeve length in Europe is this short (a point I was questioning earlier), why does that make it any easier on your eyes in and of itself? Americans wear a lot of crap, too. This forum would be a lot less interesting if every discussion was capped off with: "Well, that guy's sweatpants and stained college T-shirt look fine to my American eyes."

Point being - this isn't my bugbear, dude

Okay, you lost me

.

 

[TRINI]

A lot of what's considered 'sprezzatura' could also be viewed as being 'wrong' - unbuttoned button-down collars, for example.

Why not shorter sleeves?

 

[TheFoo]

Originally Posted by triniboy27

A lot of what's considered 'sprezzatura' could also be viewed as being 'wrong' - unbuttoned button-down collars, for example.

Why not shorter sleeves?

An unbuttoned button-down collar isn't sprezzatura. At least, it doesn't have to be. It's just not buttoning something that was made to give you the option of buttoning it. What would the point be of a button-down collar if you couldn't choose whether to button it down?

The shorter sleeves are silly because, even if they look okay in the current application, they would not look okay in any other. You'd have to always wear a long sleeve sweater under the jacket. When a thing is wrong, it's hard not to see it as looking wrong as well.

 

[TRINI]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

What would the point be of a button-down collar if you couldn't choose whether to button it down?

Exactly - if you didn't plan on buttoning down the collar, you'd buy a regular shirt.

Originally Posted by mafoofan

The shorter sleeves are silly because, even if they look okay in the current application, they would not look okay in any other. You'd have to always wear a long sleeve sweater under the jacket. When a thing is wrong, it's hard not to see it as looking wrong as well.

Maybe that's exactly what he does. Maybe he always wears sweaters with his jackets and likes the look.

Weirder affectations have been known to exist.

 

[Kuro]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

An unbuttoned button-down collar isn't sprezzatura. At least, it doesn't have to be. It's just not buttoning something that was made to give you the option of buttoning it. What would the point be of a button-down collar if you couldn't choose whether to button it down?

The shorter sleeves are silly because, even if they look okay in the current application, they would not look okay in any other. You'd have to always wear a long sleeve sweater under the jacket. When a thing is wrong, it's hard not to see it as looking wrong as well.

I think you may be going insane with all the stalking....

 

[TheFoo]

Originally Posted by triniboy27

Exactly - if you didn't plan on buttoning down the collar, you'd buy a regular shirt.

But the point is that you may want a shirt with a collar you can sometimes button down and sometimes not. If you played polo, you'd understand.

 

[elgreco]

How many hours billed to this debate?

 

[TheFoo]

Originally Posted by elgreco

How many hours billed to this debate?

I have to pro-rate the total for each poster in this thread after my first post. You'll be getting a PM from me shortly.

 

[elgreco]

I'm sure your supervising partner is going to have to write off all your time. Unless, he too has an affinity for Rubinacci..

 

[Fuuma]

Originally Posted by mafoofan

You see too-short sleeves and generally ill-fitting jackets all over the world. It isn't necessarily a favorable fashion or 'European' in any good way just because it may be seen with frequency in Europe. Anyway, like I alluded to already, I doubt a Savile Row tailor would cut you sleeves like that if he were were doing his job. So, which is more European, the way he'd tailor you a jacket, or the way this guy is wearing his?

As for colors: I would ditch the shirt and the scarf. A blue or white shirt would look better with the red sweater he's got on. I'd make the scarf blue, dark plum, or orange.

The way most people wear it?