my JM is wayyy under my bench. depends on "what" jm form you use, the tate way has you dropping your elbows way low and doing more of a bench press whereas jm form has you keeping your elbows high. i like the jm way, you can really feel it in the tri's near the elbows. i feel like its helped my lockout as i can really feel where i have to drive through the sticking point when i do the jm. give them a go, i'll probably never do a skullcrusher again.