Random fashion thoughts - Part II (A New Hope)

Discussion in 'Streetwear and Denim' started by LA Guy, May 15, 2015.

  1. Parker

    Parker Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Gibson didn't factor in those who actuallly like fake Rolexes precisely because they will appall the people who view real Rolexes as impressive status symbols.
     


  2. DLester

    DLester Senior member

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    some people just like fine things just because they appeal to them, and they are not trying to impress anyone. not everyone is trying to outdo the trust fund kids and ibankers. that is hopeless anyway.
     


  3. zissou

    zissou Senior member

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    Halp. I cannot resist the knitwear!
     


  4. nineohtoo

    nineohtoo Senior member

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    Do you mean that own them or, simply people who appreciate the fakes? Does fashion have an equivalent of that?

    I'd suggest that people who buy fast fashion copies of designer things might be it, but I have my doubts that they're trying to appall the people who do find value in the original designer pieces.
     


  5. KaleidoscopicK

    KaleidoscopicK Senior member

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    You can count on me being there. A little nervous, yet excited.

    Thanks for the recommendations. I'll try to check them out.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2015


  6. Find Finn

    Find Finn Senior member

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    As little as I like Rolexes, people like that are generally idiots, the same goes for people who buy replica anything actually.


    999 times out of a 1000 they can't argument for they are different, than all the other people who buy fakes.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2015


  7. Parker

    Parker Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I didn't mean people who buy fakes because they think others will actually think it's a real one. But rather in a subversive way -- buying a 25$ Chinatown version ironically, or as a joke. Taking the symbol of the elite and fucking with its meaning/context. I guess either way (real or fake -- trying to impress or not) still reinforces the symbolic meaning that Rolex = status/power/wealth.

    I think my point was that the "signal" effect of Gibson's theory depends a lot on an audience who bring meaning to the object. A lot of people will be impressed by the luxury watch or italian sports car because those things are expensive and exclusive, but there will be others who just think "douchebag". But then those people (like me) have their own values and stuff they are impressed by (vintage Citroën @mbaum , cheap timex watch). I'm with Gibson on being ant-anti luxury though. Luxury stuff is not the problem in and of itself. It's the Balmain H&M mayhem mob mentality.

    I agree. It's funny I've been looking for some new dining chairs recently and can't believe how many replicas there are of all the famous mid20c stuff. You can buy a new Prouvé side chair on eBay for like 100 bucks. Part of me thinks, sure why not? But I can't bring myself to do it.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2015


  8. g transistor

    g transistor Senior member

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    Dude, I can barely tolerate standing in line for brunch at my favorite brunch spot. This is like, I dunno, 30 minutes of standing so that I can probably have the best meal of my day and it still makes me want to just go home and scramble some eggs myself.

    I can't imagine standing in line at an H&M to stampede through the store and drop money on shitty-feeling polyester barf. The SAs better be handing out eggs fuckin' benedict while givin' handjobs in the changing room, because I can't imagine any universe where it's fun to run through a store for the privilege to give them your money.

    I mean, it's Balmain. It was already shitty and ugly. Except now you have people who are broke as fuck wearing ugly shit that tries to make them look luxurious but everyone knows it's not because it's H&M, which is like Gap for people who drink cappuccinos.

    Maybe I'm dumb as fuck and I'm just simple as hell or something but like, wouldn't going to a museum of gems and minerals be more fun? Or a puppet show? Dude, spend all that time and money at H&M on cocaine and go to a puppet show, not a $550 pleather jacket with embroidered Rasta imagery
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2015


  9. thewho13

    thewho13 Senior member

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    [​IMG]

    @Ken P and I dropped off beers at the event, and now we're enjoying pumpkin spice lattes. #blessed
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2015


  10. Find Finn

    Find Finn Senior member

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    Every time people bring up buying replicas especially if it's because they can't/won't afford the genuine piece. I always make the same point, get something from a living designer instead, you will support someone trying to make a living, have something not everyone has and the ergonomics are better and hey it might end up becoming a future classic and worth $$$$$$$$$$.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2015


  11. nineohtoo

    nineohtoo Senior member

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    I got the subversive part. I was just wondering if you meant people who appreciate their existence for that reason, or people who actually buy them ironically. Because I don't think I've encountered very many of those who would purchase fake luxury items ironically, but I do run into the former one often enough. Also wasn't sure if fast fashion buyers was it, like I said, I didn't their reasoning for buying was to upset fans of the real thing. But I'm still curious if there is an equivalent. But I think fashion trolls are less about owning fakes and are more the types who try to speak with some sort of authority about things they have no clue about.

    And I totally agree about the whole individual values thing. Part of why I posted that link was because I like how the writer (not Gibson btw, he just posted the link) pointed out that there are many other reasons why people participate in conspicuous consumption that are outside of just showing off wealth. The sensual part made me think of how some people here are total fabric/texture junkies. Didn't @VitaTimH just start a blog writing awesome shit about highlighting that in his favorite clothes? Personally though, I liked how history's role was noted as reason why we like/buy certain things. I'm sure part of the reason why I prefer the brands and types of clothes that I wear today, is from the trips down to San Diego to see my grandparents as a kid and wandering the tables of old surplus and vintage shit at swap meets. Part of it is childhood nostalgia, and the other part is due to what I might have learned about how or why these garments exist (or at least the ones that inspired the ones I have now).
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2015


  12. Fuuma

    Fuuma Franchouillard Modasse

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    That article is a little messy but suffers from a misunderstanding of what (non-stupid) class/status based theories of luxury consumption do not overlook: that an object can be both appreciated for its intrinsic qualities and its various social implications. It is not one or the other, someone like Bourdieu could explain how his enjoyment of classical music was both a way of reinforcing his status but also a personal passion. Article also fails to discuss (or maybe I missed it) how two subjects can enjoy the same thing but not get the same status out of it: i.e. I buy dropcrotch pants cause I'm a follower and you buy some and ypou're cool. Consumption of objects plays as a note in a totality of narrative and symbolic display of the person you are. Anyone who has thought about our enjoyment of music knows that without the memory of the notes that came before, each individual note would be meaningless.
     


  13. Fuuma

    Fuuma Franchouillard Modasse

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    The problem with contemporary furniture is that people are so afraid of how their taste will be judged and there is very little around to ensure their judgment is a safe one, in this case it is really a fine display of status at play.

    "It was a summer in which the more hopeful members of the society wanted roller skates, and stood in line to see Woody Allen’s Manhattan, a picture in which, toward the end, the Woody Allen character makes a list of reasons to stay alive. “Groucho Marx” is one reason, and “Willie Mays” is another. The second movement of Mozart’s “Jupiter” Symphony. Louis Armstrong’s “Potato Head Blues.” Flaubert’s A Sentimental Education. This list is modishly eclectic, a trace wry, definitely OK with real linen; and notable, as raisons d’être go, in that every experience it evokes is essentially passive. This list of Woody Allen’s is the ultimate consumer report, and the extent to which it has been quoted approvingly suggests a new class in America, a subworld of people rigid with apprehension that they will die wearing the wrong sneaker, naming the wrong symphony, preferring Madame Bovary."
     


  14. Find Finn

    Find Finn Senior member

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    My personal belief is that the magazines are at fault for that, as most of them are horrible on a good day at showcasing new design and its easier to show a Wegner chair.

    A fine mixture of bandwagon/snob is also at play, as at least around here people like their friends to know what they have and more importantly what they paid and most can't tell the difference between a real and a fake DSR.

    You already know this, but I love contemporary design and really wish it would get more attention.
     


  15. Baron

    Baron Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Good contemporary furniture isn't exactly cheap either. Certainly not in the $100/side chair range Parker was discussing.
     


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