question for Kabbaz.

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by jamesbond, Mar 12, 2005.

  1. jamesbond

    jamesbond Senior member

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    i was wondering what the typical shirt length is for someone thats around 5'10 -5'11 and how is shirt length measured? from the top of the shoulders or under the arm pit or neither? typically how much length should you have tucked into your trousers - from where your shirt enters your trousers to the slit in the side of your shirt. 4 -5 inches? thanks.
     


  2. Alexander Kabbaz

    Alexander Kabbaz Senior member

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    A good rule of thumb (no comments please, Manton) is that the tail should end around the tip of your thumb. Quantitatively, that is usually between 29" and 31". The shirt should be measured from the point where the front, yoke, and collar all meet (under the collar leaf in front, either side is fine) down the front to the tip of the tail. Many R-T-W shirtmakers cheat on this, measuring from there, over the shoulders, and down to the end of the rear tail. I've even see some measure from the top of the collar to the tip of the tail. I cannot be more precise with my answer because the exact measurement depends upon the length of your torso, a measurement not directly proportional to height.
     


  3. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    I like mine pretty long, about as long as the suit coat. Maybe a little less. If find they stay tucked in better if they cover my seat, at least. And if they have a real waist.
     


  4. jamesbond

    jamesbond Senior member

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    Alex - would the 29-31 measurment be down the front to the front tail or down the front to the back tail, if you get what i mean. because isnt the back tail usualy slightly longer 1-2 inches then the front. i assume you meant to the front.
     


  5. Alexander Kabbaz

    Alexander Kabbaz Senior member

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    The front. You are correct. And the back tail is longer than the front only because the R-T-W manufacturers are skimping on the front cloth.
    [​IMG] OMG Allow me to RAIL. Untucked shirts are quite attractive when worn by your POSSLQ as pajamas and acceptable for members of law enforcement who must conceal a holstered firearm. Furthermore, I should have no problem if those who work with non-functioning toilets used them to hide that sartorial showpiece known as plumber's butt. Other than that, to call an untucked dress shirt "recent fashion" is to acknowledge heresy as acceptable pragmatic reality ... and cries out for immediate exorcism at the hands of Father Manton. I do make many shirts to be worn outside the trousers. The blue, so-called Italian Collared shirt depicted elsewhere in this forum is a prime example. Cut with (or without) side vents and a wider, "flat" hem, this shirt is cut a bit shorter than a dress shirt. [​IMG] Still in shock, I now retire for a hot cup of Celestial Seasonings' TensionTamer.
     


  6. WJTW

    WJTW Well-Known Member

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    Sometimes untucked shirts can be quite stylish, in my humble opinion, if they are the right length and tailess (or at least have just a bit of tail). Unfortunately, most of the shirts people wear are too long, so, when untucked, it diminishes their legs. There are some shirts, like those oriental shirts (kung-fu shirts, they are also called) which should be worn untucked and no other way. Still, I don't think untucked shirts will ever be as tasteless as tucked suit jackets. [​IMG] [​IMG] WJTW
     


  7. jcusey

    jcusey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Alex, have you ever made a guayaberra shirt?
     


  8. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    What about a barong?
     


  9. Alexander Kabbaz

    Alexander Kabbaz Senior member

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    Yes, I have made a couple of the Cuban shirts back in the day. I would venture to guess that it would not fit well with the present size of my studio staff.
    No, but then again I have no Philipino clients either. It wouldn't be too difficult, but again, I would opt out due to staff size. Before you ask, I have made a number of dashikis and remain willing to craft Hawaians, but in both cases an artist would be needed to render the designs on my 2x2 170s. Ummm - Is this a coordinated, or coincidental, pile-on? [​IMG]
     


  10. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    I saw an opening, and charged on through.
     


  11. jcusey

    jcusey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    (Jcusey) Alex, have you ever made a guayaberra shirt?
    Yes, I have made a couple of the Cuban shirts back in the day. I would venture to guess that it would not fit well with the present size of my studio staff.
    Either I'm slow on the uptake (probably a given), or this is a non sequitur. Why would the one have any impact on the other?
    Coordinated. Manton and I were both scheduled to ask questions at the same time. We'll also be asking questions at 3:00 PM today.
     


  12. Alexander Kabbaz

    Alexander Kabbaz Senior member

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    The pleating on commercially available guayaberras is machine-made ... or sweatshop-made. Although I do not frown upon machine-made pleating which, in and of itself is quite the art in the hands of a skilled practicioner, my last such artisan retired to Arizona almost two decades ago. His work was phenominal, but required a certain quantity to be economically feasible. If one were willing to pay $1200 or more for a shirt available ready-made for much under $100 - or if I still had a staff of 52 - I would immediately remake my studio into a little Havana without question. Now, I am on a hard-deadline for an overdue catalogue. If you'll promise not to be late with the 3pm questions, I'll leave that cavernous 'slow on the uptake' opening well alone ... at least for the nonce. [​IMG]
     


  13. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    While I agree that a proper *dress* fine poplin shirt should not be left untucked, and that a lot of guys abuse this (a Borrelli untucked just looks stupid, for example, and I've seen this) a lot of casual shirts are designed to be worn this way over jeans, and the shirt tail is deliberately *very* short for this very reason (Costume National was on of the first designer to really do this.) The shirt front, untucked, should be short enough to leave the jeans pockets exposed, and just cover the belt buckle. The best shirts for this purpose are probably made by Costume National and Band of Outsiders (as recently featured in the latest Vitals). Dries van Noten and Martin Margiela also make great example of such shirts, as does Unis, Steven Alan, Helmut Lang, and even the purist Jil Sander in her earlier menswear collections.

    The truth of the matter is that unless you are both remarkably thin and good looking, tucking your shirt into your jeans makes you look remarkably stupid.

    Manton doesn't wear jeans, and so should not comment on this matter.
     


  14. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    Is this a rule?

    No, seriously. Not that I pay careful attention, but my recollection is that some siginificant percentage of men who wear jeans tuck in their shirts.
     


  15. amirrorcrackd

    amirrorcrackd Senior member

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    (LA Guy @ Mar. 13 2005,15:04) The truth of the matter is that unless you are both remarkably thin and good looking, tucking your shirt into your jeans makes you look remarkably stupid.
    Is this a rule? No, seriously. Â Not that I pay careful attention, but my recollection is that some siginificant percentage of men who wear jeans tuck in their shirts.
    I wouldn't call it a rule so much as a matter of fact. You should never tuck anything into a pair of jeans. You'll look like a fool. Dan
     


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