Price differences between suits - what makes a good suit?

[Sean94]

hello,

I'm totally new to this, so please be gentle.
I was wondering what makes a good suit.

Is it just the fabric?

Are the Calvin Klein suits they sell at Macys any good? What distinguishes them from other more expensive non Macys Calvin Klein suits?

How do I know when a suit fits well?

Thank You

 

[AcuraNSX]

I'm new to this too, and would love some info as well. Especially when it comes to fabrics(what's better than another and what is one type over another do differently, ect.). I've read wool, silk, other blends, but not sure about the heirarchy and whatnot.

 

[iroh]

the mark up

 

[DocHolliday]

It's not just the cloth but how the suit is made. Better suits are fully canvassed, meaning their innards are stitched in place. This is the traditional method, and it helps the suit mold to the wearer's body over time. Less expensive suits are fused, meaning their guts are essentially held in place with glue. When done poorly, this can make the suit stiff and unpleasant. Such suits also can "bubble," which refers to unsightly bumps in the cloth caused by the cloth coming loose from the glue. This is less common than it used to be, but it can still be an issue on cheap suits. And it generally means the suit is heading to the trash can, as it can't be fixed.

Beyond that, there's also the amount of time and handwork that went into the suit. Many suits are churned out entirely on machine, then shoved in an oven to set the fusible. But better suits have handstitching, which slows down production and adds to the cost. The sleeves, for example, should be handset, to add a little give at the armhole. Some top-tier suitmakers even hand stitch the buttonholes. Some guys develop quite the fetish for handstitching.

Then, as you mention, there's the cost of the cloth, along with other factors, such as the cost of manufacture in the country where it's made. And we can't forget to factor in the markup for the brand name and, for large companies, to pay for the advertising budget. Ultimately, the price tag is no real guide to quality -- you can pay a fortune for a shoddy suit. Good ones don't usually come cheap, but you can learn to find pretty nice ones on sale starting at $300-$400 or so.

 

[Lel]

Originally Posted by Sean94

hello,

I'm totally new to this, so please be gentle.
I was wondering what makes a good suit.

Is it just the fabric?

Are the Calvin Klein suits they sell at Macys any good? What distinguishes them from other more expensive non Macys Calvin Klein suits?

How do I know when a suit fits well?

Thank You

The thing with suits at Macys, Menswear House, and other "mall brand" type stores is that they are cheap suits mass produced in third world countries to sell as cheap as possible. This means that the makers don't care about how good or bad their suits turn out. They just want to keep the production costs as low as possible in order to turn out a profit. Imagine them like the fast food part of the food industry.

A good suit should last you years, if not a life time. That's my opinion.

How can you tell of a suit fits good? Well, if you know then you know. If you don't get this "Wow" factor almost immediately when you look in the mirror, then chances are it fits bad or just "ok".

A lot of suits out there fit "bad" but even more fit "ok". Ok being very bland and unflattering, meaning that instead of standing out you'll just be blending into a sea of boring.

 

[Golf_Nerd]

Originally Posted by Lel

The thing with suits at Macys, Menswear House, and other "mall brand" type stores is that they are cheap suits mass produced in third world countries to sell as cheap as possible.

Sorry, I don't want to bother, but: Brands are not sold as cheap as possible. Brands are sold as expensive as possible to maximise profit.

Important is (IMO in this order):

- the fit
- the balance
- the style
- the fabrics

To get started with learning more about suits (Read more about it at SF. It is all written in several threads.) make a MTM suit (made to measure).

 

[Sean94]

thank you for the replies.

Are there any differences in styles too? Are some suits just more fashionable or is a brand name when it comes to suits really just about the quality?
All this hand stitching stuff is nice, but I don't really care unless it adds significantly to the overall look.

How can you tell of a suit fits good? Well, if you know then you know. If you don't get this "Wow" factor almost immediately when you look in the mirror, then chances are it fits bad or just "ok".

well, here is the thing. If you've never worn a perfectly fitting suit, one might be impressed by just ok fitting suits. Also, it's hard to see the little details if you don't know what to look for.

I've noticed that about dress shirts for instance. The first couple I bought are now unacceptable for me to wear. This doesn't mean they fit me poorly or anything. In fact, people complimented me on them (they obviously had no idea either

), but after a while I was able to see the little details here and there and I'm now able to select much better fitting shirts.

I'd like to avoid this learning curve when it comes to buying a suit.

 

[Sean94]

Originally Posted by Golf_Nerd

- the balance
- the style

can you elaborate on those too? What do you mean by "balance"?

 

[academe]

Originally Posted by Sean94

thank you for the replies. Are there any differences in styles too? Are some suits just more fashionable or is a brand name when it comes to suits really just about the quality? All this hand stitching stuff is nice, but I don't really care unless it adds significantly to the overall look. well, here is the thing. If you've never worn a perfectly fitting suit, one might be impressed by just ok fitting suits. Also, it's hard to see the little details if you don't know what to look for. I've noticed that about dress shirts for instance. The first couple I bought are now unacceptable for me to wear. This doesn't mean they fit me poorly or anything. In fact, people complimented me on them (they obviously had no idea either

), but after a while I was able to see the little details here and there and I'm now able to select much better fitting shirts. I'd like to avoid this learning curve when it comes to buying a suit.
You may want to take a look at Will's helpful blog when thinking about the fit of your suit: http://asuitablewardrobe.dynend.com/...t-of-suit.html There is really quite a lot of discussion on the board about what is or isn't "fashionable," etc. Many of these details are more or less subjective, depending on your build, personality, etc. For example, whether you prefer a suit with more or less waist suppression, a high or low gorge, narrow or broader lapels, etc. etc. A good way to get an idea of what you like and what would suit you (no pun intended

) would be to look at the what are you wearing now threads (and ensuing discussion). Brand names vary tremendously in terms of fit, sizing and quality. Generally, the mainlines (read: most expensive lines; e.g., Marc Jacobs Collection, Valentino, etc.) are the best quality, while the diffusion lines (e.g., Marc by Marc Jacobs, Valentino Roma, etc.) are made more cheaply and more poorly constructed. Spend sometime perusing the board and using the search function to get feedback on brands you're interested. Some brands, such as Hugo Boss for example, get very little love on the board because it's thought they're not good value for money. Other members are really enthusiastic about the higher end, more handwork, etc. brands such as Kiton or Borrelli. Some of the more wealthy enthusiasts prefer to have everything custom made for them by Saville Row or Neapolitan tailors (what is frequently referred to as "bespoke"). Do a bit of research on the forum and you'll find quite a bit of information...I think the forum members are most helpful when you have more specific questions about brands or styling. Once you've got a sense of your own interests, you'll be able to make use of the expertise available here.

 

[fusherino]

well i think thats the trick, that is take your time before buying a suit and spend time looking at different suits. look at pictures online, look thru current and old forum posts. just get a feel for what you like and when you try on suits keep looking until you experience that wow moment that someone referred to.

Originally Posted by Sean94

thank you for the replies.

Are there any differences in styles too? Are some suits just more fashionable or is a brand name when it comes to suits really just about the quality?
All this hand stitching stuff is nice, but I don't really care unless it adds significantly to the overall look.


well, here is the thing. If you've never worn a perfectly fitting suit, one might be impressed by just ok fitting suits. Also, it's hard to see the little details if you don't know what to look for.

I've noticed that about dress shirts for instance. The first couple I bought are now unacceptable for me to wear. This doesn't mean they fit me poorly or anything. In fact, people complimented me on them (they obviously had no idea either

), but after a while I was able to see the little details here and there and I'm now able to select much better fitting shirts.

I'd like to avoid this learning curve when it comes to buying a suit.

 

[Lel]

Originally Posted by Golf_Nerd

Sorry, I don't want to bother, but: Brands are not sold as cheap as possible. Brands are sold as expensive as possible to maximise profit.
I would argue that mall brands try to keep their suits as cheap as possible (to a reasonable degree) in order to attract the widest audience. I meant this as in literally keeping their prices low, but also the materials used, the quality of the clothes, etc. I'm not talking about designer brands or quality brands but stuff you'd find at Mens Warehouse.

 

[Golf_Nerd]

Originally Posted by Sean94

can you elaborate on those too? What do you mean by "balance"?

If it is fit only, the suit could look like a sausage casing.

The balance is when all proportions are harmonic (the proportion of head, shoulder, body, arms, legs and feet). If one is big/ small the proportion is ruined.

Let me quote an example: Is the jacket short the legs and arms look long. Is the jacket long the legs and the arms look short.

So "balanced" means everything is in the right proportion.

The style:

Let me quote an example:

- one or two button jacket: sporty, young, modern
- three button jacket: standard
- four button jacket: egghead

 

[Golf_Nerd]

Originally Posted by Lel

I would argue that mall brands try to keep their suits as cheap as possible (to a reasonable degree) in order to attract the widest audience. I meant this as in literally keeping their prices low, but also the materials used, the quality of the clothes, etc.

I'm not talking about designer brands or quality brands but stuff you'd find at Mens Warehouse.

Yes, you are right!

But creating a brand and advertising it costs money. And money is put into that to make a profit. So with buying a brand you are paying the brand, too.

 

[Sean94]

Originally Posted by fusherino

well i think thats the trick, that is take your time before buying a suit and spend time looking at different suits. look at pictures online, look thru current and old forum posts. just get a feel for what you like and when you try on suits keep looking until you experience that wow moment that someone referred to.

which brings up another question. Where do you guys shop for suits?

 

[Sean94]

Great discussion

Can anyone comment on the following suit: I really like the look of it, but I'm not sure why. Is there anything special about it? What kind of style is that? It's sort of the type of suit I'm looking for. Thank You