Official Sales Alert thread - sales, coupon and discount codes

[Regg]

A few nice things in this sale. But I'm frustrated by the trend of the larger UK retailers to make US customers (and I assume all other non-UK customers) shop items in their own currencies, with the VAT (or VAT-equivalent markup) still included alongside a premium on the exchange rate. And then, on top of that, Liberty also charges US sales tax. And I don't mind paying the latter, of course, but it feels excessive on top of paying a markup equivalent to the UK tax, which likely goes to the retailer.
In short, a 175 GBP item, which is just over 145 GBP without VAT (currently about 180 USD) works out to nearly $260 after everything. And then I'm hesitant to pay that markup on principle.

can't blame you, that is crazy

 

[whorishconsumer]

A few nice things in this sale. But I'm frustrated by the trend of the larger UK retailers to make US customers (and I assume all other non-UK customers) shop items in their own currencies, with the VAT (or VAT-equivalent markup) still included alongside a premium on the exchange rate. And then, on top of that, Liberty also charges US sales tax. And I don't mind paying the latter, of course, but it feels excessive on top of paying a markup equivalent to the UK tax, which likely goes to the retailer.
In short, a 175 GBP item, which is just over 145 GBP without VAT (currently about 180 USD) works out to nearly $260 after everything. And then I'm hesitant to pay that markup on principle.

Let me preface this by saying that I am not a tax lawyer, nor do I have the patience for the obfuscations of wealth management.

I've generally been of the position that the significant differential in pricing that US customers incur from European vendors is the result of greedy opportunism given poorly-understood and inconsistently-enforced import and export regulations. However, I've more recently come to allow for a more nuanced explanation.

VAT and local US tax are only two of several points of potential taxation with import/export. VAT only applies to EU member countries and so, as a US citizen, you are exempt from this tax. But the reality is there's no enforcement arm performing due diligence to see if a vendor has waived this tax in the appropriate contexts. Therefore there are undoubtedly EU vendors who sell to overseas customers at a markup. You'll note that in most cases these vendors state in their terms and conditions that VAT is deducted outside the EU. Liberty London states just that. (I might add that the UK is no longer a member of the EU, although the terms of their economic disentanglement is still pending).

Outside of VAT, however, are the import and export duties that either the vendor or customer are potentially responsible for. As I believe is widely understood, customers in the US are supposedly not subject to duties on clothing imports from EU countries below a value of 800 USD. However, it's not that clear-cut, as this only applies to certain categories of clothing. Eyewear, for example, is subject to a duty regardless of amount, as I understand it. Further complicating matters is a recent ruling by an international trade commission allowing the US to start gouging the EU on the import of items across a swath of categories, namely clothing manufactured in the UK. This is a potential 25% duty added on top of any duties clothing in these categories was already subject to, which must be paid by either the vendor or the customer. At this time it's unclear if these added duties respect the $800 threshold. It's also unclear if they are being enforced, as there are continued negotiations between the EU and US on this matter.

Putting aside these examples, the schedule by which import fines on clothing import is determined is littered with loopholes resultant in a 37.5% duty. Which means that if you order an article of clothing from the EU that falls through one of these loopholes, you will be stuck paying near-40% markup on that item. In this case, however, I believe the $800 threshold does apply.

Also to be considered is the cost of import and/or export upon return of an item to the vendor, should you choose to return. Here, again, you'll find vague policy and enforcement, as it is supposedly the case that if you clearly mark an item as a return on the customs documentation you fill out, then no one should be charged any additional duties, yet it has been relayed to me by EU vendors that this is not the case. I will of course grant they may just be screwing me, but I have certainly experienced this when returning items to countries outside the EU (Malaysia, specifically).

I highlight all this to make this point: generally where EU vendors are charging notably more to US customers than their EU counterparts, it is because they ship items via Delivery Duty Paid (DDP). This means the vendor foots the bill on the cost of import or export upon delivery to you, as well, in some cases, return. I don't know the details of the policies vendors tend toward to handle this. You would think there are third party services that maintain tax tables and target vendors for this precise purpose. At least in at least one case, through conversation with the vendor, it appeared that they preserved VAT for US customers as a mechanism to cover the cost of DDP. In any case, the value of this is that you do not end up paying as much as 40% additional upon delivery.

Here I will again acknowledge the $800 threshold, since, where that threshold applies, you the customer are in fact losing money with DDP. And I think this is where most of the frustration derives, because as long as you are keeping below this threshold, you don't expect to be subject to any duties. Here the only counter-argument may be that the vendors are offsetting other costs, such as the cost of duties paid for purchases above $800, given they may not collect the full potential amount from those customers. If true, of course, this doesn't do much to impart a sense of justice. I will add, however, that for purchases I have made above this threshold, I am happy to have not had to pay duties on top.

Finally, concerning state tax, I believe this is the result of legislation in certain member states of the US, such as California, that require online vendors to collect this.

 

[zenosparadox]

Let me preface this by saying that I am not a tax lawyer, nor do I have the patience for the obfuscations of wealth management.

I've generally been of the position that the significant differential in pricing that US customers incur from European vendors is the result of greedy opportunism given poorly-understood and inconsistently-enforced import and export regulations. However, I've more recently come to allow for a more nuanced explanation.

VAT and local US tax are only two of several points of potential taxation with import/export. VAT only applies to EU member countries and so, as a US citizen, you are exempt from this tax. But the reality is there's no enforcement arm performing due diligence to see if a vendor has waived this tax in the appropriate contexts. Therefore there are undoubtedly EU vendors who sell to overseas customers at a markup. You'll note that in most cases these vendors state in their terms and conditions that VAT is deducted outside the EU. Liberty London states just that. (I might add that the UK is no longer a member of the EU, although the terms of their economic disentanglement is still pending).

Outside of VAT, however, are the import and export duties that either the vendor or customer are potentially responsible for. As I believe is widely understood, customers in the US are supposedly not subject to duties on clothing imports from EU countries below a value of 800 USD. However, it's not that clear-cut, as this only applies to certain categories of clothing. Eyewear, for example, is subject to a duty regardless of amount, as I understand it. Further complicating matters is a recent ruling by an international trade commission allowing the US to start gouging the EU on the import of items across a swath of categories, namely clothing manufactured in the UK. This is a potential 25% duty added on top of any duties clothing in these categories was already subject to, which must be paid by either the vendor or the customer. At this time it's unclear if these added duties respect the $800 threshold. It's also unclear if they are being enforced, as there are continued negotiations between the EU and US on this matter.

Putting aside these examples, the schedule by which import fines on clothing import is determined is littered with loopholes resultant in a 37.5% duty. Which means that if you order an article of clothing from the EU that falls through one of these loopholes, you will be stuck paying near-40% markup on that item. In this case, however, I believe the $800 threshold does apply.

Also to be considered is the cost of import and/or export upon return of an item to the vendor, should you choose to return. Here, again, you'll find vague policy and enforcement, as it is supposedly the case that if you clearly mark an item as a return on the customs documentation you fill out, then no one should be charged any additional duties, yet it has been relayed to me by EU vendors that this is not the case. I will of course grant they may just be screwing me, but I have certainly experienced this when returning items to countries outside the EU (Malaysia, specifically).

I highlight all this to make this point: generally where EU vendors are charging notably more to US customers than their EU counterparts, it is because they ship items via Delivery Duty Paid (DDP). This means the vendor foots the bill on the cost of import or export upon delivery to you, as well, in some cases, return. I don't know the details of the policies vendors tend toward to handle this. You would think there are third party services that maintain tax tables and target vendors for this precise purpose. At least in at least one case, through conversation with the vendor, it appeared that they preserved VAT for US customers as a mechanism to cover the cost of DDP. In any case, the value of this is that you do not end up paying as much as 40% additional upon delivery.

Here I will again acknowledge the $800 threshold, since, where that threshold applies, you the customer are in fact losing money with DDP. And I think this is where most of the frustration derives, because as long as you are keeping below this threshold, you don't expect to be subject to any duties. Here the only counter-argument may be that the vendors are offsetting other costs, such as the cost of duties paid for purchases above $800, given they may not collect the full potential amount from those customers. If true, of course, this doesn't do much to impart a sense of justice. I will add, however, that for purchases I have made above this threshold, I am happy to have not had to pay duties on top.

Finally, concerning state tax, I believe this is the result of legislation in certain member states of the US, such as California, that require online vendors to collect this.

Thanks for taking the time to write such an informative reply! This usefully organizes much of the information I had known partially or informally.

And your points here are well-nuanced in recognizing that the transaction I refer to above would likely not be a case that merits surcharges, despite the fact that surcharges are often mandated in other, similar transactions, depending on the classification and value of the goods being sent internationally.

I think the key distinction to be mindful of, then, is that between businesses whose models imagine their customers in the aggregate, and those (often smaller) businesses that can afford to treat each transaction separately. And I don't mean to make this a moral distinction. I don't think Liberty is acting in bad faith. They're declaring a clear price in my currency, entirely separate from what they've listed for their UK customers, and I can choose whether to buy or not. I also understand, for instance, why Mr. Porter disabled US customers from purchasing VAT-deducted items from their UK site at the end of last year in order to push them to the US site. But it also helps me to more fully appreciate those businesses that discount my purchases when possible, at no loss to their margin on the individual item versus a home customer, and in accordance with all relevant treaties and tax laws. And this isn't exclusive to businesses like SF's own SEH Kelly and Exquisite Trimmings, but also includes more mid-tier sites like End and The Rake, which (like Mr. P. and Liberty) localize pricing for US customers, but generally discount those prices to take into account at least a partial VAT reduction.

 

[whorishconsumer]

Thanks for taking the time to write such an informative reply! This usefully organizes much of the information I had known partially or informally.

And your points here are well-nuanced in recognizing that the transaction I refer to above would likely not be a case that merits surcharges, despite the fact that similar surcharges are often mandated in other, similar transactions, depending on the classification and value of the goods being sent internationally.

I think the key distinction to be mindful of, then, is that between businesses whose models imagine their customers in the aggregate, and those (often smaller) businesses that can afford to treat each transaction separately. And I don't mean to make this a moral distinction. I don't think Liberty is acting in bad faith. They're declaring a clear price in my currency, entirely separate from what they've listed for their UK customers, and I can choose whether to buy or not. I also understand, for instance, why Mr. Porter disabled US customers from purchasing VAT-deducted items from their UK site at the end of last year in order to push them to the US site. But it also helps me to more fully appreciate those businesses that discount my purchases when possible, at no loss to their margin on the individual item versus a home customer, and in accordance with all relevant treaties and tax laws. And this isn't exclusive to businesses like SF's own SEH Kelly and Exquisite Trimmings, but also includes more mid-tier sites like End and The Rake, which (like Mr. P. and Liberty) localize pricing for US customers, but generally discount those prices to take into account at least a partial VAT reduction.

That is a pointed distinction to add here. I do wonder as to the operational conditions that would lead to lumping customers as such, as I can imagine a small shop, on the one end, not having the infrastructure in place to handle variability across an international customer base, but can also see a very large shop deciding on blanket policies to keep their operational costs down. But in either case, I again think there must be software-as-a-service outfits whose value proposition is just this. Maybe not, though. And maybe we're just being fleeced.

 

[Regg]

That does put things in perspective. Liberty does say that purchases are DDP and shipping is free, so combined with making things simpler, it's probably pretty close to fair.

In terms of smaller shops, I've been asked after placing an order to pay more for shipping, which is probably more annoying than if the prices were just higher to begin with

 

[MarkWinter]

 

[Zamb]

Hello Friends and Customers

Over the last 2.5 months our focus has been exclusively on 5MMASK. However as you know Zam Barrett-Dialogue has to continue.
Over the next two days we are having a clear out to make way for New clothing at Zam Barrett Dialogue.
Additional 60% off in Items in our webstore at: shop.zambarrett.com

Also, a BIG thank you to all our supporters who allowed us to get 5MMASK up and running and has done all the tremendous things we have done and continue to do. We will continue to produce some of the best face masks, and to create masks that are both safe + stylish. we are showing our appreciation to all our supporters. From today until Sunday at Midnight, we are having 25% off all items at 5MMASK. this is our way of saying THANK YOU to everyone who has made this journey possible.
please use code: 5MTHANKYOU25 at checkout to apply your discount.
We thank everyone who has supported both our companies and all its products, not just this year and through this pandemic, but since the inception of Zam Barrett - Dialogue


Please also know that the INSPIRATIONAL MASKS, and PROTEST TEE AND MASKS are now available for sale and can be seen and purchased in the SUPPORT, section of our webshop:

Support Products

Miscellaneous products offered by 5M Mask Making Militia, including accessories for our masks.

5mmask.com

 

[LuxGentleman]

Luxgentleman live your summer WITH STYLE
extra 20% discount on our assortments



USE THE COUPON CODE: SUM20


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** the discount code is not valid on the products with ribbons OUTLET

​

 

[ike_hiking_boots]

When does the Mr Porter (UK) Sale start?

 

[Regg]

this guy

 

[LA Guy]

NeedSupply - www.needsupply.com - SPRING SALE: Now Up To 60% Off

 

[LA Guy]

FWRD - www.fwrd.com - 20% off with code HOMEWITHFWRD

 

[LA Guy]

Brooks Brothers - www.brooksbrothers.com - Catch the wave: Enjoy 30% off swimwear & tees

 

[LA Guy]

SARTORIALE - www.sartoriale.com - SALE Extended - Extra 30% OFF! - Ending Monday with code EXTRA30

 

[grayishghost]

FWRD - www.fwrd.com - 20% off with code HOMEWITHFWRD

Code applies to full price items only