Nicks Boots

[sleepy94]

here are a couple that i've posted on instagram

the first shows my white's retro oxfords as well.
I did order the baker's oxford from Nicks.

 

[jrosenthal]

here are a couple that i've posted on instagram


the first shows my white's retro oxfords as well.
I did order the baker's oxford from Nicks.

I love the retro in tan! Had I not ordered SD's in the tan, that would have been my next oxford. The Nick's looks roomier than the White's and that retro ox is plenty roomy. How would you compare the fit, particularly across the toes and in the heel?

James

 

[misterjuiceman]

Well, exactly my point. Some of the things people say on this board makes it sound like a certain manufacturers might use a leather that is less likely to crease. They all are dealing with the same tanneries. White's will make a boot out of anything you want.

That link is great, thanks! Hadn't seen it.
I'm really kind of baffled by the discussion on this board that makes it sound like break is a sign of cheapness. It's just not. High quality full-grain leather still breaks.

I don't think the tannage of the leather is making that creasing unavoidable, but I think White's does a better job of avoiding what's typically referred to as "loose-grain creasing," whereas it seems much more common with Nick's. On the other hand, White's isn't really putting the same effort into fit and finish. I don't think it's a quality control issue, but I'd imagine it's just not a goal for them. This album (http://imgur.com/a/zB1wF) shows what I'm talking about.

Horween has every reason to say those examples of leather creasing are acceptable. With all of the relatively lower-end makers putting out boots with leather like that, they can't just throw them under the bus. But I'd be surprised if the worst of those examples were acceptable by, say, Viberg, who is present in that album. I'd imagine they're not acceptable to White's, given that I've never seen anything like that from White's, which tells me they select their leather to avoid that.

I think if someone goes into this expecting a perfect boot, they'll be disappointed. At that price-point, you just need to figure out what's more important to you. Like I said earlier, pick your poison.

 

[sleepy94]

They fit very close in size, the sole on the nicks and the lack of toe reinforcement on the whites gives the illusion that the nicks are roomier. I think size variation comes more from the socks i wear, thinner with the whites and heavier with the nicks so the nicks feel a little tighter. i tend to believe sock choice is very under rated when having sizing issues and is often left out when people talk about the way shoes fit on the internet which can have a significant impact on the way shoes actually fit. When I lived in Eugene and was sized at bakers I wore the socks I normally wear and have never had any sizing issues since then.

 

[meso]



I don't think the tannage of the leather is making that creasing unavoidable, but I think White's does a better job of avoiding what's typically referred to as "loose-grain creasing," whereas it seems much more common with Nick's. On the other hand, White's isn't really putting the same effort into fit and finish. I don't think it's a quality control issue, but I'd imagine it's just not a goal for them. This album (http://imgur.com/a/zB1wF) shows what I'm talking about. 

Sorry, what is that album showing? Minor flaws in stitching? If you crawl the web I'm sure you'll find minor QC issues with every manufacturer. You should check in on the Alden thread

Horween has every reason to say those examples of leather creasing are acceptable. With all of the relatively lower-end makers putting out boots with leather like that, they can't just throw them under the bus. But I'd be surprised if the worst of those examples were acceptable by, say, Viberg, who is present in that album. I'd imagine they're not acceptable to White's, given that I've never seen anything like that from White's, which tells me they select their leather to avoid that. 

Part of it is certainly selection. Wolverine 1000 mile boots in particular uses inferior CXL. But I do think we are mostly talking about properties of the leather. I am wearing a pair of 1 year old CXL White's right now that has a similar break pattern as the pair of Nick's posted earlier. It takes a while to develop. And yes, even Vibergs. Just for kicks, here's a pair of chromepak service boots posted on the VIberg thread earlier that shows similar break to that feared pair of Nick's....

Wanting to avoid break is just not a priority I've heard of before. But then again, a lot of posters here see issues I just don't care about, like the edges of CXL leather not being dyed through These are naturally occurring properties of leather. The only way you avoid break is to go with shell cordovan, which ripples at the vamp instead, which is another type of effect that you might like (or not).

Do you want to start a thread to talk about leather issues or something? Feel like this is getting off-topic from Nick's specifically.

 

[jrosenthal]

I don't know how this conversation turned into that of "break", I see that as a part is the evolution of good leather and how it shapes to the user over time. In fact Wesco gives instruction on how to pre-break their knee high motorcycle boots so you get the desired fold above the front of the ankle.
My concern was just about the wrinkled leather at the toe along the welt on a brand new pair of boots, but I understand now about the thickness of leather Nicks uses and the different flexing that the flesh and outer skin do when being turned at a 90 degree to stitch down. It is logical and although not desirable to me, I guess comes with the territory. This has been educational.

James

 

[gfloridafan93]

I too have learned a lot from this conversation. In my opinion there is a fine line between quality control issues and "that's just the way leather is". Yeah it all comes down to personal opinion, but I would be really upset if I bought a pair from any of these guys (Viberg, Nicks, Whites, Alden) and they had flaws right away that other boots years older do not. Again though, where do you draw the line? It's an interesting debate really.

 

[jrosenthal]



I too have learned a lot from this conversation. In my opinion there is a fine line between quality control issues and "that's just the way leather is". Yeah it all comes down to personal opinion, but I would be really upset if I bought a pair from any of these guys (Viberg, Nicks, Whites, Alden) and they had flaws right away that other boots years older do not. Again though, where do you draw the line? It's an interesting debate really.

It is, and is truly subjective and requires restraint of bias to have a rational conversation about it. We saw from this thread that tempers started to flair at the idea of QC vs. the nature of a work boot. For someone who buys $1k+ dress boots, they may be able to forgive cosmetic issues in a work boot because they see it as a utilitarian purchase. But to someone who never spent more than $150 on a pair of boots, to buy a $450 pair is a huge step up and the same cosmetic flaws will be scrutinized because they expected more for 3X the money. I think we would all agree that blatant errors like heels of different heights (which we saw on the White's forum not long ago) or mis aligned hardware are glaring issues, but I admit that wrinkles in toe leather or patters of break move into the realm of trivial....but it does come down to individual perspective.

James

 

[meso]

Did we just have a balanced, adult conversation on styleforum?

 

[jrosenthal]



Did we just have a balanced, adult conversation on styleforum?

With points, counter-points, educational links and illustrations, and a much better understanding of the subject and opinions being considered. Nobody got flamed or suspended from the forum and we all come away with a soft fluffy feeling...I think I'm gonna cry now.....let's all celebrate and buy some Nicks boots!

James

 

[linafelt]

... But then again, a lot of posters here see issues I just don't care about, like the edges of CXL leather not being dyed through...

This is the single best thing about CXL!

Love the way it looks with an undyed leather edge (not sole edge), which is why I don't understand why sometimes (like Sixteen's "Stealth" boot) they go ahead and dye the leather edges. You get the worst qualities of CXL, but lose the best thing.

 

[misterjuiceman]

Sorry, what is that album showing? Minor flaws in stitching? If you crawl the web I'm sure you'll find minor QC issues with every manufacturer. You should check in on the Alden thread

Those mostly weren't QC issues. That was just a demonstration of how they terminate the welt/out-turned upper on White's. It's much sloppier than Nick's. I don't think it's out of spec for White's—it's just one of their goals to finish it nicely, while it seems to be more of a priority for Nick's. I have another album for Alden, too. It's worse.

 

[misterjuiceman]

This is the single best thing about CXL!

Love the way it looks with an undyed leather edge (not sole edge), which is why I don't understand why sometimes (like Sixteen's "Stealth" boot) they go ahead and dye the leather edges. You get the worst qualities of CXL, but lose the best thing.

And then they went and left the midsole un-dyed for that stealth boot. What a mess.

 

[Beane]

This is a new brand for me, they look great

 

[Chris Tran]

6" Robert in stock. If you don't want to wait 6-10 weeks, I'm pretty sure this would please 90% of everybody.

These things smoke my Alden Indy and at $429, that is a savings compared to the $515 that my Indys in CXL command today. The eyelets on my two year old pair of indys are starting to come together because the leather is oilier and thinner than that used on NIcks and White's boots. I probably have less than a 1 finger spacing now compared to the 2 or so I had when I bought them.

Also I'd like to comment that the stock 10" black Hot Shot also looks really good and all the boots can be used as an indicator of how another can fit since the Hot Shot, Ranger, and Robert are the same boots +/- a sole or a leather option. For example if you asked for a 6" Robert in their stock Chocolate leather and a Vibram 430 sole, you'd be getting a 6" Ranger. Whereas if you were getting a ranger in Olive CXL and a Western Comp sole, it'd basically be a Robert. Both have the #3 toe and the same construction if I'm not mistaken.

For those of you dropping in custom orders, I'd just honestly tell them what you want without fussing with the naming convention. Their "dogger" block heel is also superior to the other company's offering.

Also I think if you mention Reddit, they're giving 10% off. My local dealer is giving 10% off (still gotta pay 9% tax) just as a gesture of kindness so I have no real motivation to call up HQ unless I had leather-specific questions.

I have a Ranger in Walnut coming, and I'm thinking if the Teton Tan option might be a touch loud to get on a matching pair, but with a structured toe and medallion cap.