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New Raphael suit (not mine)

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by mafoofan, Jan 10, 2010.

  1. Film Noir Buff

    Film Noir Buff Senior member

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    I understand what you're saying. But my contention is that a workhorse suit has a purpose: utility So if you gain that utility through RTW + competent tailoring, why go bespoke? For the "process??" I mean I've heard some silly things on this forum, but the argument to drop $5k for partaking in the "process" of creating a utility workhorse suit is just absurd to me. That's probably just my upbringing getting the best of me, but that's the way I see it.
    Although I don't believe custom suits need be either work suits or partay suits, for the record, Nino Corvato suits are practically indestructible when compared to rtw options. Also, Nino fixes and alters his suits for no charge (except if he needs to reorder fabric). We all rationalize at some level. Many of my tailor's clients get a dozen suits made in the same fabric and then forget them. Many others get one or two suits a year and just feel special wearing them. I am certain a few must come up with other justifications including superlatives concerning the merit of custom over ready to wear. I suppose that's all it is really, some people who dont or cant spend the money on custom want to poo poo its worth and some people who get custom want to assure themselves that they've made a wise investment.
     
  2. George

    George Senior member

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    FWIW, here is my most recent Raphael coat:

    [​IMG]

    It lacks the waist issue spotted by me and others, and denied by foof, on the coat in the OP.


    Do you always have such a high notch?
     
  3. itsstillmatt

    itsstillmatt Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I'm wearing a DeBoise suit in a windowpane today, with a jacket that is a bit shorter and that has more open quarters than my older numbers:

    [​IMG]

    [click for supersize]

    Anyway, the way that the quarters fall (use the windowpane to see how its configured) will be more what jefferyd and Despos would expect compared to Nay's Breanish.


    - B

    The waist and quarters appear very problematic. Please retake the picture so that I know the suit does not actually fit that way. Thanks.
     
  4. voxsartoria

    voxsartoria Senior member

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    The waist and quarters appear very problematic. Please retake the picture so that I know the suit does not actually fit that way. Thanks.

    It's not the suit...I am just lumpy all over.


    - B
     
  5. itsstillmatt

    itsstillmatt Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    It's not the suit...I am just lumpy all over.


    - B

    Seriously? It just looks lopsided. The shoulders and collar are spot on, but look at where the left and right quarter lines point (where they reach the center of the leg,) the distance from the pant crease of each at the bottom of the coat, and the funkiness above the button. I think you might have the jacket on crooked. Please retake, or I will post my artwork in the WAYWN thread. [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  6. DocHolliday

    DocHolliday Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Only the right leg left to go. Vox, don't guess the next letter wrong.
     
  7. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    So you're telling me the awkward jutting in > < marks at his waist are a stylitic preference of his?

    All I can say is that it doesn't appear wrong to me--but then, an underlying premise of my assessment has always been that the cut of the suit is not to my own personal taste to begin with. Obviously, I choose something very different stylistically for myself. From what I've seen, non-drape, military-inspired suits often have waist profiles that looks more > < than ) ( . However, in this case, it is quite possible that the effect is exaggerated in the Bergdorf photo due to perspective, stance, lighting, etc. If you look at the fitting photo I posted, the pinching in appears much reduced.

    I think it's fair to say that when I critique things on the forum for fit, I account for two things: (1) there are many different styles and cuts that I might not personally prefer, but which aren't objectively bad, and (2) movement and stance can cause what appear to be irregularities in fit, but which really aren't.

    I'm looking at this from the perpective of the analyzing you did in the Reeves bespoke thread wrt shoulder divots too - because this waist issue here seems almost as prominent.

    I disagree. I don't think divots or sleeve torquing could possibly be right or stylistically preferable. They don't pass either of the two considerations above that I try to regularly apply: (1) nobody, not even the maker or the client, was willing to state that the irregularities were matters of style, and (2) the irregularities were not subtle and appeared in every photo in one form or another.

    FWIW, the waist looks fine in the fitting picture. I think most of us were willing to say that the issues were due to the pose or picture, but it's frustrating that Foo wouldn't acknowledge it in the first place.

    Keep in mind that this is a suit I have seen numerous times in person. Thus, it is entirely possible that what you see as a problem in one photo simply doesn't strike me the same way.
     
  8. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I'm wearing a DeBoise suit in a windowpane today, with a jacket that is a bit shorter and that has more open quarters than my older numbers:

    [​IMG]


    I don't know, Vox. I like your older stuff better. The shorter length works, but I think something is wonky with the quarters. I can't speak to their technical correctness, but it looks like they are pulling away starting too close to your middle button.
     
  9. teddieriley

    teddieriley Senior member

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    Wait, you smell that?
    I do think the trousers in TR's suit are too low waisted. I have this problem on one of my favorite RTW suits. I think if and when I go bespoke I'll get pants waisted at my navel. I hate seeing shirt below the button of a closed jacket.

    My suit pants are pretty similar in fit to slimmer fitting incotex trousers. I don't know if this is "incorrect" for a business suit, but I like it. I grew up in the decades of baggy pants. This is my revolt to that trend as my mother predicted would happen when I was 16.

    Not sure if the trousers are low waisted as cut or whether they were sitting a little lower in the pic due to my failure to adjust them, as I could have pulled them up easily another inch. The waist is about 1/2 inch too big, so it's likely they slipped from my natural waist line prior to the photo. My torso is relatively long compared to my legs, as I have a short inseam. I definitely would not want the inseam to be any longer.

    My taste might come full circle when I'm older where I'd be getting trousers cut more like AP, and maybe even pleats! I'll check back in in about 20 years.
     
  10. CDFS

    CDFS Senior member

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    I don't know, Vox. I like your older stuff better. The shorter length works, but I think something is wonky with the quarters. I can't speak to their technical correctness, but it looks like they are pulling away starting too close to your middle button.

    [​IMG]
     
  11. zalb916

    zalb916 Senior member

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    I'm wearing a DeBoise suit in a windowpane today, with a jacket that is a bit shorter and that has more open quarters than my older numbers

    My only question is, "When is this ticket pocket fad gonna end?"
     
  12. Mr. Moo

    Mr. Moo Senior member

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    My suit pants are pretty similar in fit to slimmer fitting incotex trousers. I don't know if this is "incorrect" for a business suit, but I like it. I grew up in the decades of baggy pants. This is my revolt to that trend as my mother predicted would happen when I was 16.

    Not sure if the trousers are low waisted as cut or whether they were sitting a little lower in the pic due to my failure to adjust them, as I could have pulled them up easily another inch. The waist is about 1/2 inch too big, so it's likely they slipped from my natural waist line prior to the photo. My torso is relatively long compared to my legs, as I have a short inseam. I definitely would not want the inseam to be any longer.

    My taste might come full circle when I'm older where I'd be getting trousers cut more like AP, and maybe even pleats! I'll check back in in about 20 years.


    Teddie, I think your suit looks great.
     
  13. edmorel

    edmorel Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Teddie, I think your suit looks great.

    why do you want him to burn the suit? [​IMG]
     
  14. Manton

    Manton Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Do you always have such a high notch?

    I do, but I also think the height of the notch is exagerrated by the camera angle.
     
  15. Mr. Moo

    Mr. Moo Senior member

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    why do you want him to burn the suit? [​IMG]

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  16. mmkn

    mmkn Senior member

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    My only question is, "When is this ticket pocket fad gonna end?"

    For me, it dies when I die, I suppose.

    - M
     
  17. DocHolliday

    DocHolliday Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I do

    Why? Is there a reason other than you find it stylistically appealing?
     
  18. Manton

    Manton Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Anyway, the way that the quarters fall (use the windowpane to see how its configured) will be more what jefferyd and Despos would expect compared to Nay's Breanish.

    I dunno, looks to me like the same issue is present (not that I care). FWIW, I like this one better than I like my own Steeds. Should not have a ticket pocket, though, and I would spread the front buttons out a little more. I would also like to see the shoulder droop a bit more. Is the seam not pressed open?

    Oh, and jeffryd, if you are still tuned in, I checked my own striped coats, and just as you say, the stripes are all perpindicular to the ground despite the open quarters and my own indifference/ignorance.
     
  19. Manton

    Manton Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Why? Is there a reason other than you find it stylistically appealing?

    Do I need one?

    FWIW, that is a lower notch than I get from Solito. I don't think I ever had a notch conversation with Raphael, so either he intuited that I wanted a high notch or else he just decided on his own that it would look better on me.
     
  20. DocHolliday

    DocHolliday Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Do I need one?

    No, I didn't mean the question in an accusatory fashion. I was just curious how you arrived at that choice.
     

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