Mysterious suits - Diagnosis

[Damien2Lyon]

Hello everybody, this is my first post in here and I am writing this message because I need to buy suits to work with (for several years), and since I am almost discovering this type of clothing, I am now in need of good advice. I read some threads of this forum and find it very informative for those who want to learn fast!
I usually speak French so please excuse my vocabulary/grammar mistakes!

I have recently been visiting a discount clothes shop that sells suits for 350€ (dark brown and dark blue, many different sizes). These suits have a nice (Italian?) cut, they fit very well to me and their fabric is just extraordinary.

I asked if I could make pictures for a friend

and so here they are:

Dark brown suit:

Dark brown suit (inside) finishing:

Dark blue suit:

Dark blue suit (inside) finishing:

Trousers' finishing:

Of course the seller told me that they were made by Loro Piana, which I don't believe because of their price and the fact that this is a ready-to-wear line. The seller does not sound dishonest but I'm pretty sure he does not really know where these suits are actually made. No other brand names than those shown are visible.
I have not seen any trace of a removed tag neither on vests nor on trousers (even after a long-time research). The words "fabric by" indicate that only fabric is made by LP.
What seems strange is that the main tag (envelope with buttons inside) comes from LP itself, when the buttons are not engraved after the name LP (I believe this is the case on MTM LP suits).
Another strange thing is that on this tag (reverse side) is also written a launch number, a client number, the model name ("BIELLA/WHITE"), the type of fabric (100% wool) and the size, but all in French! So they could be made in Italy but exclusively for the French market, or made in France with Italian fabric...
Other tags (pockets' bottom) indicate that inside garment is made of viscose and precaution symbols are shown.
NB. Client number is different for each colour, while other specifications are similar.

So here are my questions:
- Has anyone ever seen or tried these suits? Do they look like quality ones?
- Do you think they are worth the price or could they be a bad surprise after a while? (I hope you can tell thanks to sewing/finishing details!)

PS: I have tried to be as precise as possible but I don't want to tell the name of the shop or show tags details to avoid any form of advertisement and respect the seller's activities. Please send an e-mail if you want to get more information.

Thanks for reading, and thank you in advance for your expert's advice!
I wish everybody a happy year 2007.

Best regards,
Damien.

 

[Sator]

Stay away!

They look cheap. My Italian tailor has a word for suits like that: Pizzas. They look flat like they were cooked (fused construction). The way the notch has been cut looks bizarre too. I would suspect they were made in China with huge mark ups. 350 Euro???? Consider them if they were for 50 Euros.

The trouble about Europe is that there is a frightful lack of legistration to force sellers to make it clear where something was manufactured. In the US and Australia they have to display that information by law. But for the European market they remove the Made in China labels. That is the reason it says "Fabric Made in Italy". True, but where is the suit made?

 

[EL72]

Salut Damien et bienvenue a SF,

Those suits look indeed to be made with LP fabric but are definitely not made by LP. I would guess they are made somewhere in Eastern Europe or maybe Asia (if they were made in Italy or France, they would be labeled as such). Regardless, they are cheaply-made no-name suits trying to live off the LP name.

To be honest, they don't look so great from the pics. The notch in the lapel looks awful (there is a name I forget for this style of lapel where the lower part of the notch extends out further than the upper one that was done on custom suits but it looks terrible here) and the cut looks boxy. Frankly, they look like suits that will look like crap after a few wearings.

I don't know what the market is like in France but 350 EUR is almost $500 and you could get something much nicer than that for $500 in the US. Sorry I can't be more helpful but I wouldn't recommend those suits. If you're looking to invest in suits for the long term, better to buy fewer good quality pieces than lots of inexpensive crap. Oh, and another thing, if these are your first suits, stick to navy and charcoal grey. Leave the brown for later. Bonne chance!

 

[mack11211]

This is a fishmouth lapel.

Looked snazzy on some nightclub people in the 60s, but not so much lately.

Badging the fabric everywhere on the suit is usually a sign that the actual construction and tailoring are not as notable.

 

[Sator]

Originally Posted by mack11211

This is a fishmouth lapel.


Yes that is the right term. Fishmouth lapels for a fishy smelling suit.

 

[Niels]

Agree these suits does not lok like they are worth the price. I guess that you would be better off wíth a Hugo Boss Suit. I own a Daniel Hechter, like Hugo Bosse it is good quality for the price.

 

[Damien2Lyon]

Wow!!!
Thanks for these answers, quick and precise...

In fact I was interested by these suits because they looked original in the way they are cut, but this time I'll stay away from pizzas and fish stuff!
As for the price, I am not really aware of what can make the price of the suit. I just thought the high price was justified by the type of fabric.

Style forum should be of public interest!

 

[whnay.]

They look very suspect to say the least.

 

[Sator]

Hugo Boss is also fused and overpriced. I would advise avoiding that over advertised label which has a poor reputation here - and quite rightly so. In the 350 Euro price range I would suggest Massimo Dutti in Europe. The construction is still sadly fused but the fabrics are much nicer than the mainstream Boss suits and prices are usually lower.

If you can find them I would really recommend trying to find some Zegna (made by Zegna not just "Fabric by Zegna"), Canali or Isaia.

 

[Teacher]

Originally Posted by Sator

Hugo Boss is also fused and overpriced. I would advise avoiding that over advertised label which has a poor reputation here - and quite rightly so. In the 350 Euro price range I would suggest Massimo Dutti in Europe. The construction is still sadly fused but the fabrics are much nicer than the mainstream Boss suits and prices are usually lower.

If you can find them I would really recommend trying to find some Zegna (made by Zegna not just "Fabric by Zegna"), Canali or Isaia.

I may be wrong, but I think Hugo Boss is much cheaper in Europe than elsewhere, so it may be a decent value over there. I certainly agree with not purchasing it at retail in North America or Australia! (Isn't it even more expensive there?

)

 

[Damien2Lyon]

I've been looking at Hugo Boss suits (in 3 different shops in Lyon) and I can tell you that the prices I've seen vary from 595 to 895 €, which left me the impression that they were overpriced and that you were paying for the name...
I don't like to have this feeling!
It also seems that the euro system does not advantage us at all since prices have been dramatically increasing since 2001, even if change rates are interesting in order to buy something from a foreign country.

This is also the reason why I was trying to find something different (not sold by a very famous brands) and the store I describe in my first post also sells Cerruti 1881 (true) suits for a little less than 400€. There is still a difference with what I posted, but I just wanted to know if that was a good oportunity or a trap!
For me, these Cerruti suits had huge shoulders!

PS: Zegna suits are hard to find in Lyon but I also believe they are a good alternative.

Thanks for all answers, best regards,
Damien.

 

[grimslade]

There are Massimo Dutti shops in France. There is one, I know, in Lille. I don't know how close to Lyon you might find one, but they do have a web site. For $350 I think you could do pretty well in Massimo Dutti, especially as it is sale season over there. I'd avoid Boss at that price point. You're paying a lot for their marketing budget, which means not so much for your clothes. Otherwise, from Lyon, you could jaunt down to Italy and find some interesting, original stuff in the boutiques down there from some brand no one's ever heard of. That's a hit-or-miss enterprise, of course. Some of that stuff is crummy. But some of it is both interesting and original.

 

[Sator]

Originally Posted by Teacher

I may be wrong, but I think Hugo Boss is much cheaper in Europe than elsewhere, so it may be a decent value over there. I certainly agree with not purchasing it at retail in North America or Australia! (Isn't it even more expensive there?

)

If Hugo Boss costs around 500 - 600 Euros in Europe you are paying similar prices to Australia ie too much for so much junk.

 

[Damien2Lyon]

I have seen that Massimo Dutti had a shop in Lyon yesterday on their website and I could not resist paying a visit this afternoon.
You were daaaaamn right : their suits are really nice for the price (285 to 385 euros) and the fabrics they use look terrific (wool/silk mix). They don't look like pizzas but still have that fishmouth thing on the back (double vents, italian style?) which I find original.
I don't know if you have extra-lucid powers, but this is exactly what I needed.
I am now just waiting for winter sales to begin (next wednesday, seems an eternity!) and I'll go for them.

10000000000 thanks for your answers, I believe I would have made a big mistake without your help.

Long life to Style forum.

Damien.

 

[grimslade]

de rien. I'm glad we could help. The fishmouth doesn't refer to the vents at the back but the lapels on the fronts of the suits you posted. I prefer double-vents as well.