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my visit to Napoli & Mina @ Napoli Su Misura

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by medtech_expat, Oct 31, 2010.

  1. Eustace Tilley

    Eustace Tilley Senior member

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    Quote:Pfffttttt - everyone on the internets knows that the top Neapolitan trousermaker (you know what, the top global trousermaker) is Ambrosi. Do you even read SF, bro?
     
    3 people like this.
  2. marcodalondra

    marcodalondra Senior member

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    Sure ...
     
  3. chogall

    chogall Senior member

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    Booya. Time to bug them again. Need to get some clarity on their future visit plans before putting in additional orders though.
     
  4. add911_11

    add911_11 Senior member

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    6t

    I hope that is meant to be a joke or a funny comment.
     
  5. Cantabrigian

    Cantabrigian Senior member

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    I was a satisfied American customer. I got a pair of suits before he disappeared so I had no problem with the customer service. I had only a forwardish fitting but I think the jacket was pretty much bang on.

    I emailed (all three addresses I could find online) when I was going to Naples last April and got zero responses so I ordered two suits from NSM instead.
     
  6. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    ^I thought you were English.
     
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  7. Cantabrigian

    Cantabrigian Senior member

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    I'm as American as obesity and SUVs. Moved to London 6 months ago for a job.
     
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  8. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Okay, to be clear, here is what is wrong with the NSM shoulder line:

    [​IMG]

    It has nothing to do with the trumpeting of the sleeve from the armhole, which--as others have pointed out--is typical of Rubinacci as well as others. Rather, it is something wrong with how the jacket is shaped or cut over the shoulders, between the neck and end points. It is clearly natural and unpadded (or lightly padded)--up to a certain point. Thus, the line follows a convex curve most of the way to the sleevehead. However, a few inches before getting there, it suddenly inverses. This is not a pagoda shoulder, but a natural shoulder with wonky execution. I doubt it is purposeful. In any event, it looks like an error and doesn't look good.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2013
  9. TheTukker

    TheTukker Senior member

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    It is actually pretty funny.
     
  10. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    In contrast, here is Mariano Rubinacci's shoulder line:

    [​IMG]

    Notice how the curve does not inverse. Also, as an aside, notice the shirt-set sleeves. It is a different style of spalla camicia--much less obvious, with little to no shirring. Mine are all like this. Raphel in NYC was fascinated and wanted to take my jacket apart with a razor blade to inspect how it was done.
     
  11. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Did you instruct Mariano on the art of the FooFold?
     
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  12. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    You can see what appears to be NSM-like wonkiness on this Rubinacci specimen:

    [​IMG]

    However, it is not as pronounced, and I can say from having seen the jacket in person, it doesn't appear in reality. Still, the important takeaway is that whnay's Rubinacci stuff is highly atypical in style and really isn't a good reference point. He has very, very sloped shoulders. Hence, I suspect Rubinacci decided to build up the jacket a bit to compensate. Whenever I've seen Bill, his jacket shoulders have followed a straight line rather than a curved one. They are not what I'd call "natural." Also, the sleeveheads on his jackets are all roped. All in all, the result is not typical of either Rubinacci or what most would associate with "Neapolitan."
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2013
  13. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Ha. It would be like trying to convince a fish not to swim.
     
  14. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Maybe the best alternative would be simply to bludgeon it until it stays still?
     
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  15. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    :foo: - is there any shoulder extension on your Rubis? On MR and whnay, it looks like the jacket shoulder might be a tad off the natural shoulder, but it's tough to tell from photos.
     
  16. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    As for this business about whether NSM makes their own pants: unless they have explicitly stated otherwise, I'd bet good money that they outsource. That is typical practice. Up until only a few years ago, Rubinacci outsourced trousermaking. Aside from the fact trousermaking is its own skillset, there is no shortage of trousermakers in Naples. Your volume must be pretty damned big for it to make sense to compensate an independent trousermaker enough to drop his own business. Maybe that's the case with NSM, but: (a) it would be atypical for Naples, and (b) anyway, there is nothing wrong with outsourcing this sort of thing.

    On Ambrosi: even though you guys all joke, Ambrosi's reputation as one of the best trousermakers in Naples is well-established. Both Solito and Rubinacci used them. That is pretty high praise. Rubinacci does not toy around--they are willing to pay what it takes for top talent.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2013
  17. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    First, to be clear: a "natural" shoulder line doesn't imply anything about whether there is extension. Not sure if you were suggesting so, but I want to put that out there.

    My shoulders are not extended. I'm just that manly. But yes, there is typically some extension on the stuff Rubinacci makes. In fact, it largely drives what we call the "drape." Luca's and Mariano's jackets both have a centimeter or two of extension on each side.
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2013
  18. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    No, didn't mean anything about naturalness. Completely separate question - thanks for the response.
     
  19. clapeyron

    clapeyron Senior member

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    have you seen his trapezius/deltoids? I'm pretty sure that's just how unpadded shoulder look on a beefcake like bill.

    [​IMG]


    I actually like the way his NSM coats look and much prefer this shoulder line over the convex shaped droopy looking shoulders on marianos coat. But then again It's not fair to directly compare the coats, given the age difference of the wearer as well as the fact, that it's save to assume, that mariano made his coat 15 years ago and it might not fit as well on him anylonger as it most definitely used to do.
     
  20. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    That weird inverse shoulder curve is not due to Vox's beefcakiness. We've seen it on other NSM jackets, not just his. It is less pronounced on some of Vox's NSM jackets versus others, and it is not at all present on his far superior Steed jackets, which are unpadded (or only lightly so, if I recall). Also, if you look closely, it really appears that the cloth itself explodes away from the shoulder on approaching the sleevehead. Like I said earlier, it's as if the armhole was either cut too wide or too tall or both. Anyway, it really is quite wrong and shouldn't be that way. If you think it's good fit, I think you need to adjust what "good fit" means to you.

    Also, if you think Mariano's jacket doesn't fit well over his shoulders in that photo, I really don't understand where you're coming from. It looks fantastic. It is also emblematic of what it means for a jacket to look "Neapolitan."
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2013

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