Mod to Suedehead

[Man-of-Mystery]

Talking about Queer Bashing, and P Bashing, over in SE London, [Woolwich has a Barracks] Skinheads would go Squaddie Bashing, When you think about it 60s Skinheads was little fcukers.

"Squaddie Bashing"went on in Guildford as well.You had the Guards Depot in Pirbright.They would come over every Friday and Saturday,to meet up with the WRACs(stationed in Stoughton-just outside of Guildford).The two Pubs where they went were both targets for the I.R.A(Horse and Groom and The Seven Stars)in the 70s.Every weekend fights would break out between Squaddies and Skinheads in the Underpass going to the Railway Station-or in the Station itself.One of the main Skinhead Pubs(The Napoleon)was right on top of the Underpass, so fun and games was always had around there.

I never went 'squaddie bashing' any more than I went bashing anyone else. I do remember walking down New Cross Road, and there was a squaddie coming the other way, and he stopped right in front of me, wouldn't let me pass. I was thinking "What the hell..." but then I saw he was grinning broadly, and I recognised one of my mates I hadn't seen for a while - he'd only gone and joined the Household Cavalry.

I'll tell you one thing, he objected to being called a 'squaddie', even though he smiled as he objected. He insisted on being called a 'Trooper'.

 

[Man-of-Mystery]



I am from a town on the North West Kent and South East London borders and the skinhead cult developed here in 1968.  We were not known as skinheads then....

Hi Aces and Eights - sorry I was late onto your original post - I have been having trouble with the site.

It sounds as though you and I might have a 'manor' in common. In 1968 my parents moved from Lancashire to the Beckenham/West Wickham area, and I came down with them. That summer I hung around with a bunch of lads from Bromley, which was before I got digs of my own in Catford SE and then Brockley and began to hang out with the crowd in Lewisham & New Cross. Whereabouts did you live at the time?

 

[Man-of-Mystery]



Um, nice image...... don't worry, I'll complete my task tomorrow if that makes it any easier?

Thanks and double thanks.

Not making a whole heap of progress myself, as you can see

 

[Lasttye]

Not sure if these have been posted before.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/fashion/news/and-so-farewell-the-ivy-shop-1568875.html

http://caughtbytheriver.net/2010/10/the-ivy-look/

 

[Gel boy]

Hi if you are talking about the skinheads walking passed hippies, it is me and my mates. What is the name of your mates brother.

 

[Lasttye]



Hi if you are talking about the skinheads walking passed hippies, it is me and my mates. What is the name of your mates brother.

Welcome to the thread Gel Boy, Was you up the hippie squat ...just before that iconic Terry Spencer photo was taken.

 

[browniecj]



Not sure if these have been posted before.
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/fashion/news/and-so-farewell-the-ivy-shop-1568875.html
http://caughtbytheriver.net/2010/10/the-ivy-look/

Interesting Roy.Both the Ivy Shop and Carnaby Street stand out as" Beacons of Change".Ok you had the Teddy Boys before,but there is some confusion where they actually started,some would say the Elephant and Castle(but then you had the Jewish Kids in the East End doing the Edwardian Style).But with the two Branches of Mod,you have the source of inspiration.I was aware of the Ivy Shop later(about late `67),Carnaby Street some time before. Both certainly left a great impression on me.

 

[browniecj]

Hello Gel Boy,welcome to the Site.

 

[Yankee]

Hi if you are talking about the skinheads walking passed hippies, it is me and my mates. What is the name of your mates brother.

Glad to see you posting here, Gel Boy, welcome!
Which one are you in the picture?
And what were you and your friends up to that day?

 

[Ed Vaughan]



Not sure if these have been posted before.
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/fashion/news/and-so-farewell-the-ivy-shop-1568875.html
http://caughtbytheriver.net/2010/10/the-ivy-look/

Great pieces but... I reckon Spencer Campbell - and with a name like that he has to have Scottish antecedents (though most Scots would never sleep well, knowing there was a member of the 'murderous Campbell clan' in the vicinity - just ask the MacDonalds!) has it wrong when he alludes to everyone 'north of Watford' living in a fashion-less, trend-free backwater... it's just not the case.

Many people, from outside London, who had gone to the City in search of fame, fortune and crushed velour flares, had grasped that donkey jackets and 'Tesco wranglers' were not all that... one of them, my cousin.

It's like saying every Londoner is a Cockney, and everyone from Lancashire had a cloth cap and whippet... though the latter may have been true.

Campbell has penned a decent enough feature... albeit it's around 600 words too short - but maybe that's not down to him.

 

[Pressure_Drop]



Pressure Drop,are there any Plans for doing a more in depth Bookabout the intermediate years, between Mod and say Skinhead-`65 to `68?

Nothing immediate, I would love to produce something about that period, it's stil a bit of a mystery to many people and it is a period which really fascinates me - all I can say is I wish I'd discovered this thread when I was researching part one of Booted and Suited. I contacted a few old boys around London through the UK Skinheads site but sadly nothing came of it so I just concentrated on the Bristol area. Even then the guys I was talking too were very reluctant to let me use some of their stories and recollections.

I did have a deadline set by the publishers so I just had to go with it - it's always the way, once the book was published, loads more people came out of the wordwork telling me 'You should have written about this, you should have said that, blah, blah' - it's not easy that's for sure, but it was a bit of a labour of love.

And then of course you have to get it published and at the moment that's a really hard task - I've been touting a novel around agents since January with no luck at the moment but I'll just keep plugging away.

Hopefully Man-of-Mystery's project will get up and running and something will come of it - a book of this sort certainly deserves to be out there, just from a historical point of view - it's a great story to be told that's for sure.

 

[Aces and Eights]

Hi Aces and Eights - sorry I was late onto your original post - I have been having trouble with the site.
It sounds as though you and I might have a 'manor' in common. In 1968 my parents moved from Lancashire to the Beckenham/West Wickham area, and I came down with them. That summer I hung around with a bunch of lads from Bromley, which was before I got digs of my own in Catford SE and then Brockley and began to hang out with the crowd in Lewisham & New Cross. Whereabouts did you live at the time?

Yes we do – I thought you were local when I had read your earlier postings. I am at Dartford and I know all the towns you mentioned quite well. We would travel to Bexleyheath, Woolwich, Sidcup areas. Beckenham and Bromley were classed as ‘posh’ areas while Lewisham and New cross were the other end of the scale and you needed to be on your guard when around those parts

Lewisham was a favourite around 1971 to see Tamla giants like Stevie Wonder, The Four tops and The Temptations to name but a few. I cannot remember the name of the venue but was like an old cinema in Lewisham High Street. The audience was mainly black but there was never any trouble as the music was the reason for being there.

We also got to the Montague Arms New Cross on a Sunday lunch time to see the comedians and strippers. This may have been 1971 / 1972. The main comedian was Jimmy Jones, who although very popular on the club circuit was never on TV because he would not change his blue routine. When he was on at the Montague you did not go to the bar or toilets because he slaughtered anyone regardless of race, creed or colour

My memory is starting to shift out of the 69/70 skinhead era now. I mentioned in a previous posting that in the 69/70 period our gang did not venture that far – just to the surrounding towns

 

[Lasttye]



 
Yes we do – I thought you were local when I had read your earlier postings.  I am at Dartford and I know all the towns you mentioned quite well.  We would travel to Bexleyheath, Woolwich, Sidcup areas.  Beckenham and Bromley were classed as ‘posh’ areas while Lewisham and New cross were the other end of the scale and you needed to be on your guard when around those parts

Lewisham was a favourite around 1971 to see Tamla giants like Stevie Wonder, The Four tops and The Temptations to name but a few.  I cannot remember the name of the venue but was like an old cinema in Lewisham High Street.  The audience was mainly black but there was never any trouble as the music was the reason for being there.

We also got to the Montague Arms New Cross on a Sunday lunch time to see the comedians and strippers.  This may have been 1971 / 1972.  The main comedian was Jimmy Jones, who although very popular on the club circuit was never on TV because he would not change his blue routine.  When he was on at the Montague you did not go to the bar or toilets because he slaughtered anyone regardless of race, creed or colour

My memory is starting to shift out of the 69/70 skinhead era now.  I mentioned in a previous posting that in the 69/70 period our gang did not venture that far – just to the surrounding towns

I had mates in Bermondsey and New Cross, around 72/75, we would pop in the Montague Arms.. then onto the Wellington in New Cross, in fact we would meet up in the Elephant then over the road to the Charlie Chaplin, then onto the Walworth road and the Pineapple, back over the Old kent road to the Dune Cow, then the Frog and Nightgown, then on to the Wellington.
We would also sometimes get in the Fox on the Hill Eltham, another haut was the Royal Oak Tooley Street , Bermondsey.

Just remembered 69/70 The Surrey Rooms which was in the Oval Cricket ground social club. Had a great Disco on a Saturday or was it Sunday night ?

 

[Aces and Eights]

I had mates in Bermondsey and New Cross, around 72/75, we would pop in the Montague Arms.. before we would get in the Wellington in New Cross, in fact we would meet up in the Elephant then over the road to the Charlie Chaplin, Over to the Walworth road to the Pineapple, back over the Old kent road to the Dune Cow, then the Frog and Nightgown, then on to the Wellington.
We would also sometimes get in the Fox on the Hill Eltham, another haut was the Royal Oak Tooley Street , Bermondsey.

Just remembered 69/70 The Surrey Rooms which was in the Oval Cricket ground social club. Had a great Disco on a Saturday or was it Sunday night ?

Yes, I remember going in the Charlie Chaplin - a smart pub in it’s the day. Also the Apples and Pears pub around Bermondsey/Rotherhithe way – possible gone now? We would travel onto at the same night– This was early 70s.

The Dune Cow, Frog and Nightgown and the Thomas A Becket down the other end of the old Kent Road – again trips out from our own town in the early 70s – all proper London ‘Battle Cruisers’ (boozers). Always a good night out enjoying a good atmosphere and the local characters.

The Fox on the Hill was very popular when the glam rock era started and we also used the Upton at Bexleyheath

This is what I like about this site being reminded of times and places that I haven’t thought about in years or even know if certain places still exist. Its also interesting to have found out that some of the contributors to the thread are in the process of working on their own books on the original skinhead perod

 

[browniecj]



Nothing immediate, I would love to produce something about that period, it's stil a bit of a mystery to many people and it is a period which really fascinates me - all I can say is I wish I'd discovered this thread when I was researching part one of Booted and Suited. I contacted a few old boys around London through the UK Skinheads site but sadly nothing came of it so I just concentrated on the Bristol area. Even then the guys I was talking too were very reluctant to let me use some of their stories and recollections.
I did have a deadline set by the publishers so I just had to go with it - it's always the way, once the book was published, loads more people came out of the wordwork telling me 'You should have written about this, you should have said that, blah, blah' - it's not easy that's for sure, but it was a bit of a labour of love.
And then of course you have to get it published and at the moment that's a really hard task - I've been touting a novel around agents since January with no luck at the moment but I'll just keep plugging away.
Hopefully Man-of-Mystery's project will get up and running and something will come of it - a book of this sort certainly deserves to be out there, just from a historical point of view - it's a great story to be told that's for sure.

Thanks for your reply Pressure_Drop.I joined U.K.Skinheads about the time of your Book,coming out.I would well imagine that some Skins were reluctant to you tell of some of the Activities,they got up to.With my Age Group(19 in `69),there were other things that we got up to other than the Aggro etc.- I have written about this,earlier in the Thread.It is only now(on some of the Mod Forums)do your read of some of the "Activities" that went on then.