Mechanical engineer wants patent law

[jpticar]

Hey guys. I have one year left of engineering school and then I'd really like to go to law school to pursue patent law. This is going to be a busy year coming up with engineering interviews, senior design, and everything else that goes on in college. I have a few general questions:

1. Out of all the lawyers in here, anyone study patent law? If so, what type of engineering is your degree in. Also, do you have a masters? Ive been busting ****** moving up classes so I could graduate with a masters as well (and for free

) and hoping that im not just wasting my time since I want to go to law school anyway.

2. How do you feel about patent law and its opportunities. I know that currently there are a ton of people pursueing law careers; however, patent lawyers are still in demand due to the fact that you need an engineering degree as well.

3. What law schools did you guys go to and how was the experience. I'd love to go to Fordham law. My gpa is dead even with their average accepted gpa, just gotta make sure I score high enough for them on the LSATs.

4. Lastly, what do you think the best way to prepare for the LSAT is. Are classes necessary? I'm sort of a do it on your own guy, so I was just going to get books and buy the old tests offline.

Any other info that you feel would be helpful would be appreciated, thanks.

 

[yachtie]

Originally Posted by jpticar

Hey guys. I have one year left of engineering school and then I'd really like to go to law school to pursue patent law. This is going to be a busy year coming up with engineering interviews, senior design, and everything else that goes on in college. I have a few general questions:

1. Out of all the lawyers in here, anyone study patent law? If so, what type of engineering is your degree in. Also, do you have a masters? Ive been busting ****** moving up classes so I could graduate with a masters as well (and for free

) and hoping that im not just wasting my time since I want to go to law school anyway.

My degrees are in physics and math , not engineering, but in any event, an advanced degree won't hurt you.( helped me actually) Taking MS or higher level classes in something a little "out of the box" for a typical ME could help down the road. Picked up a minor in NE that way

2. How do you feel about patent law and its opportunities. I know that currently there are a ton of people pursueing law careers; however, patent lawyers are still in demand due to the fact that you need an engineering degree as well.

Now the the debacle about continuation rules seems to be behind us, I think there are still a lot of opportunities in the field. Be sure to take non patent IP courses in law school ( Trademarks etc.) There are a lot more patent lawyers out there than when I started this gig, but hiring partners I know are still looking for new talent. N.B. :get set up as an intern (summer) as soon as you get into law school.

3. What law schools did you guys go to and how was the experience. I'd love to go to Fordham law. My gpa is dead even with their average accepted gpa, just gotta make sure I score high enough for them on the LSATs.

Going to a school that has a recognised IP program is pretty important. George Mason and John Marshall are two that come to mind.

4. Lastly, what do you think the best way to prepare for the LSAT is. Are classes necessary? I'm sort of a do it on your own guy, so I was just going to get books and buy the old tests offline.

Any other info that you feel would be helpful would be appreciated, thanks.

Definitely take prep classes, you'd be at a disadvantage otherwise.

Good luck!

 

[jpticar]

Originally Posted by yachtie

Picked up a minor in NE that way
What is NE again?

Originally Posted by yachtie

Be sure to take non patent IP courses in law school ( Trademarks etc.)
Definitely will do. I'd like to stay as broad as possible.

Originally Posted by yachtie

Going to a school that has a recognised IP program is pretty important.
I've actually been told the exact opposite here by a few lawyers I've spoken to in the past. I asked them which schools have good IP departments and their response was to go to the best name school you get into period. Any insight onto this?

Thanks for the help!

 

[jpticar]

Oh yea, one more question. I'm debating whether I want to go full or part time while working full or part time. I've heard from a few people that the first year is the toughest and they recommend just full time school. Each way has its pros and cons. What did you guys do and how was it?

 

[yachtie]

NE= Nuclear Engineering (did Inertial Confinement fusion for a while).

Opinions differ, but I found that actually learning some patent law was helpful. If you go to a general law school, you may have to take additional classes (Masters in IP). Since it's a pretty hot field now, you may not have to choose as more schools have IP programs.

I passed the Patent Bar my first semester of LS so I was working as an Agent. (Only took 1/2 year more to finish). It really depends on what deal you strike with the firm you're interning with.

 

[jpticar]

Originally Posted by yachtie

NE= Nuclear Engineering (did Inertial Confinement fusion for a while)..
Sounds intimidating lol

Originally Posted by yachtie

I passed the Patent Bar my first semester of LS so I was working as an Agent. (Only took 1/2 year more to finish). It really depends on what deal you strike with the firm you're interning with.
Half year more to finish what? You finished law school in a year and a half?

The other lawyers I've spoken to recommended the patent bar early as well and then working as an agent.

 

[yerfdog]

Fordham is a good enough school that you really shouldn't have trouble getting hired doing patent law out of there (it's ranked like #25 in the US news rankings, right?). Especially considering patent law (from an outsider's perspective) seems to be a really booming field and it looks like it's only going to get bigger.

My perspective is, if you go to the best school you can get into, that school will probably have the best on-campus interviewing program. I know at a lot of schools outside the top tier have restrictions for their on-campus interviews, like you have to be top 15% or top 25% or something to even do the interviews. It is way easier to get a job when the jobs come to you (not a guarantee though, I managed to screw this up and not get a job through OCI at my top 20 school - but I don't know any patent folks that didn't get a job, even with mediocre grades).

 

[jpticar]

Thanks for the info.

Hoe do you feel about dorming vs commuting for law school if going full time. People have told me its better to live there because the library is easier to get to. If i do get accepted to fordam I would love to dorm there but its about 16,000 which is alot of money.

 

[yachtie]

Originally Posted by jpticar

Sounds intimidating lol

we called it "Go BOOM physics"- lotsa fun.

Half year more to finish what? You finished law school in a year and a half?

Law school- Took me 3.5 years instead of 3.

The other lawyers I've spoken to recommended the patent bar early as well and then working as an agent.

yep. really good money for a part time job

 

[jpticar]

Originally Posted by yachtie

Law school- Took me 3.5 years instead of 3.

That sounds more like it lol

 

[Droog]

Not one myself, but my brother is. He got a physics degree from Drexel and then went to work for RCA (Philadelphia area). Just as he embarked on a patent law degree at night at Seton Hall, he got laid off (70s recession). He says it was the best thing that happened to him as he was able to double up on his courseload and get it done in 2+ years. As he was finishing up, he worked as a patent agent for a corporation that routinely took on law students temporarily. After getting his law degree (no MA), he was brought on to a 2-man firm to backfill the elder member who was retiring. One of the attractions he posed for them was his desire to stay in the Trenton area for family reasons as a lot of the young lawyers end up migrating to NYC. The other partner eventually retired from the firm, and my brother did not take on a junior partner. He's sixty now, been doing the job for 30+ years, and says the money is too good and too easy to retire. While he maintains an office, almost all his work is done virtual/remote as so much can now be done online. His secretaries just connect him to his home or cell when he needs to talk to a client. The only time he typically goes to the office is for a face-to-face meeting. About all I know.

 

[Renault78law]

Hate to derail this thread, but I have a related question for the patent attorneys. I'm a 4th year litigation associate at a mid-sized firm and am qualified to take the patent bar. My undergraduate major was a soft science, a variant of biology with an emphasis on human biodynamics/physiology. I'm considering taking the patent bar exam, but feel like it might be a waste because I don't have a hard-core engineering or biochemistry background. Any advice? My firm does not do patent law, so this question relates to my marketability to firms that practice patent litigation/prosecution.

 

[yachtie]

Originally Posted by Renault78law

Hate to derail this thread, but I have a related question for the patent attorneys. I'm a 4th year litigation associate at a mid-sized firm and am qualified to take the patent bar. My undergraduate major was a soft science, a variant of biology with an emphasis on human biodynamics/physiology. I'm considering taking the patent bar exam, but feel like it might be a waste because I don't have a hard-core engineering or biochemistry background. Any advice? My firm does not do patent law, so this question relates to my marketability to firms that practice patent litigation/prosecution.


As you probably know, passing the patent bar is not a requirement for patent litigation. It's a necessity for prosecution. If you wanted to go into a boutique practice where you'd be required to do both, then I'd say take the patent bar. It's not necessary to be in just the hardest of "hard" disciplines. I know some pharmacists for example, that are quite successful as patent attorneys.

 

[jpticar]

Originally Posted by Droog

Not one myself, but my brother is. He got a physics degree from Drexel and then went to work for RCA (Philadelphia area). Just as he embarked on a patent law degree at night at Seton Hall, he got laid off (70s recession). He says it was the best thing that happened to him as he was able to double up on his courseload and get it done in 2+ years. As he was finishing up, he worked as a patent agent for a corporation that routinely took on law students temporarily. After getting his law degree (no MA), he was brought on to a 2-man firm to backfill the elder member who was retiring. One of the attractions he posed for them was his desire to stay in the Trenton area for family reasons as a lot of the young lawyers end up migrating to NYC. The other partner eventually retired from the firm, and my brother did not take on a junior partner. He's sixty now, been doing the job for 30+ years, and says the money is too good and too easy to retire. While he maintains an office, almost all his work is done virtual/remote as so much can now be done online. His secretaries just connect him to his home or cell when he needs to talk to a client. The only time he typically goes to the office is for a face-to-face meeting. About all I know.

Cool thanks for the info. I would be one of those lawyers migrating to NYC lol. Sounds like your brothers got it nice.

 

[NoVaguy]

Originally Posted by jpticar

1. Out of all the lawyers in here, anyone study patent law? If so, what type of engineering is your degree in. Also, do you have a masters? Ive been busting ****** moving up classes so I could graduate with a masters as well (and for free

) and hoping that im not just wasting my time since I want to go to law school anyway.

I got the masters (although I paid for the extra year), headed over to the USPTO, and now do night law at GW while working at the PTO.

2. How do you feel about patent law and its opportunities. I know that currently there are a ton of people pursueing law careers; however, patent lawyers are still in demand due to the fact that you need an engineering degree as well.

Lots of opportunities in DC. Generally pays a little better than working in a regular firm. The big IP firms start at 160K, and expect 2000 billables, while it seems that regular general firms are 145K and 2000 hours (I didn't really look) . Some of the smaller IP firms have 2 or 3 tiered systems - where you can do less hours and get a correspondingly lower salary (140K, 1850 hours, 160K and 2000 hours, etc). I don't know how it works in NYC.

I'm currently applying for firms, but I haven't decided if I'll go that route, as the USPTO pays very well (although nobody has a salary equal to a first year associate and the job requires a lot of work). But it does come with the usual government benefits, including a decent amount of vacation time.

3. What law schools did you guys go to and how was the experience. I'd love to go to Fordham law. My gpa is dead even with their average accepted gpa, just gotta make sure I score high enough for them on the LSATs.

I had a friend who went to Fordham and did really well - although I think he had high LSATs and low gpa, and just sort of stopped partying heavily and killed the rest of the students at Fordham.

4. Lastly, what do you think the best way to prepare for the LSAT is. Are classes necessary? I'm sort of a do it on your own guy, so I was just going to get books and buy the old tests offline.

Any other info that you feel would be helpful would be appreciated, thanks.

I took a class, but only because I'm lazy and tend to put things off - like I'm doing with my clerkship applications right now......