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Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by dieworkwear, Aug 4, 2012.

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  1. in stitches

    in stitches Kung Joo Moderator

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    i say no, and yes.


    like weather or not a person buttons, should be studded with precious gems?

    (bb - just joshin, bro. ;) )


    a classic.
     


  2. in stitches

    in stitches Kung Joo Moderator

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    i never really ascribed it to it as ego. its not my joint exactly, but i do see the appeal of personalization in general. i think that is all its about.
     


  3. cptjeff

    cptjeff Senior member

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    There are ways to get something personalized that don't announce to the world how special you think you are.


    Though I will admit they can be a useful signifier in a town that's about equal parts sincere, wonderful people and completely self serving asses, without much middle ground.
     


  4. gsugsu

    gsugsu Senior member

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    Maybe I can see the personalization angle but when it is exposed to the world who is it for: the wearer or those beholding it? What value does it serve other than telling others I can afford to have my shirts personalized. That smacks of ego. Might as well leave the sleeve label on a suit so people don't have to guess who made it and have a better chance to guestimate how much it cost. I mean if you pick the fabric, collar and cuff style and whatever else, haven't you personalized it already?
     


  5. bourbonbasted

    bourbonbasted Cyber Eliitist

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    I'll sift through your sensationalist, inflammatory remarks and try to ask a sincere question:

    So if there is so much onus put here on owning clothes made for you, from your designs and at your discretion, then why is adding three 1/4" letters in a place that will be covered when wearing a jacket so offensive? The shirt has been made for you from your specs.

    Personally I think a monogram is much more understated than branding. Do you find RL ponies equally offensive? Do three little letters really make someone a bad person? Why does knowing someone's middle initial make them so vile and self-obsessed that you forever see monogramming as a scarlet letter (see what I did there?) I sincerely don't understand why adding a personal touch makes someone so self-obsessed. And, again, I remind you we're having this conversation on a bespoke-obsessed clothing forum.



    I don't really get this. It costs like what, $5 to add embroidery to your shirt? You could do it with any shirt. And I fear you are confusing personalization with branding. Does my name carry so much weight that someone will be impressed with my initials as if it were a RL pony?
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2012


  6. msulinski

    msulinski Senior member

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    Try this link: http://www.ctshirts.com/Default.aspx?q=aw008|||||||||||||||
    All regular shirts for $40
     


  7. dieworkwear

    dieworkwear Senior member

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    I don't mind rib monograms, but BB - just a note, I think they're best when they're handmade. Monograms, IMO, are only for the wearer's pleasure, but that pleasure is much greater when the monogram has been handsewn by a tailor. The kind of factory stuff you can order off a website, where they ask you to punch in the three letters you wish to be stamped in, don't have the same character. It's hard to describe this without showing the difference in person, though a good photo might also work. But handmade monograms are small and add a touch of beauty; machined ones just look lifeless and are often too big in size.

    Really, other people are getting way too worked up about monograms. There are some that are tasteful, some that are tacky.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2012


  8. gdl203

    gdl203 Affiliate Vendor Dubiously Honored Affiliate Vendor

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    As far as I'm concerned, it is not a matter of execution as much as it is a matter of intent
     


  9. gsugsu

    gsugsu Senior member

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    This
     


  10. dieworkwear

    dieworkwear Senior member

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    Well, assumed intent. I think most of the time, people get them purely for themselves, not for whatever message you think they're trying to project to others.
     


  11. cptjeff

    cptjeff Senior member

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    I do find RL ponies offensive, though less so, since the buyer isn't making the choice to put it there or not, they're making a choice about the garment as a whole. A fair number of people buy those shirts because they're good shirts and just live with the fact there's a logo on them. I've been known to remove the occasional logo with a pocketknife or a seam remover, but that's further than most would go, and I don't fault them for that.

    It is, as gsugsu hit on, about the intended audience. An initial does nothing for you- you know your initials and you know it's your shirt. The only real reason it's there is to announce to the world that, "Hey, I just bought a shirt that's more expensive than yours! I have money and buy expensive stuff, see how awesome that makes me?".

    I react very badly to people who try to substitute money for taste. Having clothes made for you is one thing- you get better fit and a quality garment. Tacking on a logo to show how much money you spent on something is an entirely different thing altogether- you can spend a lot of money and still have absolutely no taste or class. Really, the basic key is that you want people to react to how nice your clothes are, not how expensive they are. While those are often related, there's no inherent linkage, and it puts the value on the quality of the item, rather than the cost of it. When you emphasize the cost of the item, you're announcing that you can afford the item, and you are making the implication, however unconscious it may be, that cheaper items are lesser, as are, by implication, the people who wear them. To me, that's an incredibly nasty value system, and while it's unfortunately common today, it's often beneath the surface just enough that we take it for granted.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2012


  12. cptjeff

    cptjeff Senior member

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    People tend to be completely unaware of the values underlying what they do, especially when it comes to everyday things. Do you think that if you asked a random guy off the street what cultural signifiers he was trying to demonstrate by wearing a suit and tie he would be able to give an even slightly cognizant answer, even if he understood the question? Yet nobody here would question that the suit and tie is loaded with cultural significance, and that we use those signifiers attached to the outfit to our benefit every day.

    A lot of this stuff happens on a subconscious level, and even just asking people to start examining the values that underlie their actions, especially the mundane once that seem completely inherent to their lives, tends to make people very uncomfortable. There is a lot underlying elements in our culture that we think very little about on a conscious level, and some of the values underlying stuff you might not think much about can look fairly nasty when brought to the surface.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2012


  13. ethanm

    ethanm Senior member

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    There is a strong correlation between your avatar and your comments!
     


  14. mymil

    mymil Senior member

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    What if you just happen to have super-awesome initials?
     


  15. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Even more reason not to monogram them.
     


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