Discussion in 'Preorders, Group Made-to-order, trunk shows, and o' started by aucociscokid, Nov 10, 2015.
Ty for the info, it seemed a bit sketchy. Glad I didnt spend the money on this
This has nothing to do with Styleforum. It was a transaction off-Styleforum between Dieworkwear and Loominous.
Authentic "bleeding" madras hasn't been available for 45+ years, according to David Hodgkins, of David Wood Clothiers, in Portland, ME, who old enough to remember what it was in the 1960s and can identify the real from the faux. Also according to the Handloom and Handicrafts Export Corp. of India, an agency of the Ministry of Textiles, it hasn't been available in that long as well.
" I have joined this company in 1979 and visited almost all production unit in South India and never seen bleeding madras check weaving." - 4/17/14 email from K. Sudarsanan//Deputy Manager (Technical)/HHEC.
Others - all - are calling theirs "bleeding madras" when it isn't.
"There is little to prevent retailers from selling fabrics produced on power looms as handloom madras. Madras check, like all Indian textiles, lacks an official Denomination of Origin—a strictly monitored designation that, for example, makes it illegal to call sparkling wine produced outside the Champagne region of France champagne." - See more at: http://www.caravanmagazine.in/reportage/check-republic-madras#sthash.U6RQaFvn.dpuf
LOOMINOUS IS THE ONLY AUTHENTIC "BLEEDING" MADRAS AVAILABLE ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD TODAY. We have posted pictures of our handlooms here.
Dieworkwear ordered approximately 5 yards of madras from Loominous in the beginning of September, which, at his request, we delayed shipping from India (all our stock is in India) until the end of the month. When it arrived, he said it wasn't what he ordered. We said that, if he returned it to us, we it would be replaced. His return was received by us on October 7th, which we promptly sent back to India and which arrived in India on October 27th. The terms were replacement (and not a refund). When we can ship Dieworkwear's replacement we will. Since the end of October, Chennai (which is from where we ship), has been battered by torrential monsoons. 180 dead. 100,000 in relief camps. The entire city under hip deep water. The entire city is shut down. Nothing going in or out. When we can ship, we will.
WE STAND 100% BEHIND OUR COMMITMENTS.
My thoughts obviously go out to the people in Chennai, and in the grand scheme of things, $28 is nothing. I'm just passing a warning to those who are thinking about buying from Aleck. I think there's something fishy going on with his operation, and I'm not alone in that opinion.
Anyway, if you buy from him, I would do it through a credit card with strong buyer's protection. But if you don't, whatever he says, I can tell you Atlantis sells the same quality bleeding madras for about $5 a yard.
Dieworkwear's blog entry about Loominous.
(I believe Put This On is dieworkwear.)
(I believe Put This On is dieworkwear.)
I also beg Dieworkwear's pardon. There's nothing on AskAndy that says our operation is "fishy."
This is - in fact - what bhbecklin said about the madras situation on Ask Andy in 3/17/08 post:
I recently emailed O'Connell's and just received a response from them. Ethan informed me that these shirts are New Old Stock, and once they're gone, they're gone. That is making me want to pull the trigger even faster, so I'll probably buy some this afternoon. He also said long sleeved ones will be online shortly.
Unfortunately, they are having a difficult time finding Authentic Indian Madras, and will not have any more until they have an authentic source of Madras cloth as well as a good US shirtmaker. I really like these guys at O'Connell's. They seem like good, honest people.
All I can say is they haven't had any more since at least 2008.
VAT dyes will also "bleed." VAT dyes are environmentally harmful and carcinogenic, but nonetheless are still widely used.
I don't know whether Atlantis's fabric is genuine, authentic "bleeding" madras or not (handloomed and dyed with azo-free direct dyes). I would think not. If Atlantis (which to the best of my knowledge is no longer in business) wants to submit their fabric to an independent laboratory for testing (or if dieworkwear wishes to do it on their behalf), we have ours which is definitive. Until that time, any opinion as to what Atlantis' fabric is or is not is just that: opinion and conjecture.
An official agency of the government of India says it hasn't been produced in 45+ years. David Hodgkins, a reputable merchant with 40 years in the business says:
"We received the initial shipment of yardage in July. By August we were offering the first bleeding madras shirt for sale in over four decades. I am old enough to remember the character and comfort of this shirt (a silky hand), and I felt we had the “Real McCoy”. We sold them out in four days." http://www.davidwood.com/blog/
Here's the same pattern being offered on the GMTO.
Below is unwashed. Above is after soaking for only few minutes in plain tepid tap water.
Look, I don't want to get pulled into your crazy scheme, so don't quote me as a person who supports your project. I already told you time and time again -- over email -- that Atlantis offers the same fabric, based on the length you sent me.
I suspect you'll run off with my $28, so whatever. Just don't quote me to other people, like the way you've been pulling crazy out-of-context quotes to hype your project over the internet.
I deleted the post because, you're right, it includes incorrect information.
1. Loominous is the ONLY authentic "bleeding" madras available anywhere today. A retailer like David Hodgkins says so. Evan Huber of O'Connell's says there it has been previously unavailable despite his diligent searching.
2. Styleforum members can order in complete safety because of SFs strong buyer protection.
3. I would respectfully suggest to dieworkwear that he submit his complaint to PayPal, which I believe is the way he paid for fabric, as the most appropriate way of resolution instead of going public with it.
I support the workers there but this designs are unusable unless for a chapter or a retro tv movie based on the late 70's.
The Poet's Cloth. R. Press
In the words of Richard Press, who is Jacobi Press's grandson (J. Press was the founder of the eponymous store which was one of the big 3 Ivy League stores along with Brooks Brothers and Chipp):
"A bleeding madras that has been bled in an unforgiving wash basin can be imitated only by a poet."
"There was a moment in American history when madras cloth was the king of style. You would go to church and twin boys wore matching madras shirts, their father wore a madras sport coat, their mother a madras scarf. High school hallways were a riot of bright plaid with props given to kids with shirts that had faded, with colors that bled so the shirt became more individual, more of a work of art. Then it stopped." Fall River (MA) Herald News. 10/05/2015
SF is ground zero for it's revival.
"The challenge remains for a smart retailer who can meet the demanding craft requirements to whet the palate of a discerning niche clientele. Do it, and there won’t be any bleeding remainders left on the racks." R. Press
Those pictures make all the difference in the world. I was a bit reserved in my initial impression but once seeing the "after" shots, I'm in. Order coming presently.
I have a couple of questions. The SF market listing states:
• We can get shirts ready once we have a 20 orders.
• The pre-order period will be 2 weeks, or 40 shirts of a single pattern.
• If, that the end of the pre-order period, the minimum of 20 shirts has not been met, you will be refunded promptly, otherwise, the order will go to the factory for production. The shirts will be expected to be delivered at the end of December
The same shirt has been listed for five weeks. Was the minimum of 20 orders met? Has the pre-order period been extended? Has production started and is there a new expected delivery date?
Same question here.
If you notice, the shirt is listed, but is not available for sale. The GMTO is going forward, and I have sent the vendor 1/2 of the payments in order to cover production and shipment costs. He will receive the remainder when the shirts have all been successfully shipped.
Thanks Fok. I knew the deal but was just hoping for a status update on how the ordering was going. Thanks for your response.
Thanks for the update Fok. I feel silly not noticing that the shirt is currently unavailable. I have one more question. Is there any chance that those of us who paid $175 could receive a partial refund to match the new price? If I had known the price was going to drop $50 five days after I placed my order I would have obviously waited.
Thanks for your time
I do not make the rules of the GMTO, I merely hold funds in a sort of unofficial escrow, This is a matter you should take up with the OP. In any case, I will not have the time to process any of those partial refunds which need to be done manually, should the OP agree to them, until after the Christmas break.
Please address all questions to the OP directly from now on, guys. He will be the one to have the answers to your questions.
Separate names with a comma.