Linux users?

[Matt]

Hi guys, Curious if there are any Linux Users here. VN is cracking down on piracy, and like basically all businesses here, my software is Of Questionable Legality. In true VN fashion, they wont catch the massive state owned enterprises, with like a billion users, all running fake everything, they will catch mid size international companies, and show how bad we are...a couple of cases in point. I dont especially fancy forking out the $20k+ it would cost to license all the stuff we need company-wide, so tossing around the idea of switching over to (most likely) MEPIS or PCLinuxOS (there is a local user group that is apparently adding 'support' this, whatever that means). Those two seem to be the easiest 'out the box' option. Any Linux people here who can talk me through whether this is feasible etc. tks Matt

 

[tiecollector]

I use Linux and then run VMWare when I need to access a Windoze only application and it works fine. I used to use Slackware, but the packaging sucks for it so I switched over to Ubuntu, which is AMAZING because stuff actually works and it is easy to upgrade.

If you just need basic office productivity stuff, then Linux should be fine. I have been using Open Office more and more (also available on OS X and Windows) and it has been fine for updating documents that people send me generated from MS Office.

The only thing that is a little sketchy is the Outlook support, while there is a way to access all the Exchange stuff using Ximian, it is kinda ghetto, but works if it needs to.

Let us know exactly which programs you need and we'll let you know the best OS alternative.

 

[Matt]

thanks Tiecollector.

Our needs are pretty basic.

Very basic design and photo work (currently using Paint.net on most machines, PS on one for photo. For some reason, Vietnam prefers the godawful Corel Draw app, so have that on another - but will need to replace)

Play and burn video files, some very very very super rudimentary video and audio editing required occassionally.

Office work - OOo should do us fine there. Currently using Office 2003. One issue with this is our largest client does have very detailed templates, and they are format nazis, so I am a little concerned about compatibility with that account (and only that account), and how that formatting will carry across to OOo.

I guess Evolution is the best choice to replace Outlook. Not running exchange server (not big enough to need it).

Need a server to share documents and hold printers.

Need to scan.

Need to be on Yahoo IM (which for some reason is the VN default). I guess there is some all in one that replaces it, right?

Need to generate webalbums (currently using Webalbum Generator) and upload them (Filezilla, which I think is also available on Linux anyhow).

Need wifi.

IIRC Linux is reasonably virus-free, given that the vast majority of viruses are written with Win security holes in mind. True? Anyhow, guess I should have some kind of virus protection in place.

Need Vietnamese font support of course (which is just a unicode thing, so I am sure it exists somewhere).

I also have a Windows mobile phone (HTC620 which is a T-Mobile Dash in the US). be nice to be able to synch it, but if not, I will live.

...I guess that is about it.

Curious about peripherals too. Shared printers, digicams, scanners, projectors and so forth. Need all that to Just Work.

I am a Mac user by choice, so any distro that feels familiar to an OSX user will make adaptation quicker for me, staff training will probably take a while.

 

[tiecollector]

Originally Posted by m@T

Very basic design and photo work (currently using Paint.net on most machines, PS on one for photo. For some reason, Vietnam prefers the godawful Corel Draw app, so have that on another - but will need to replace)


Linux comes with a nice piece of software known as the GIMP http://gimp.org/ though you'll need to learn how to use it. The basics are very similar, though it has some cool features, it isn't as advanced as Adobe.

Play and burn video files, some very very very super rudimentary video and audio editing required occassionally.

Not sure about video editing, but burning is built into the OS and mplayer or VLC are great for playing them, they are also available on Windows. Here is a video on video editing: I've never used this software.

Office work - OOo should do us fine there. Currently using Office 2003. One issue with this is our largest client does have very detailed templates, and they are format nazis, so I am a little concerned about compatibility with that account (and only that account), and how that formatting will carry across to OOo.

For complicated templates, probably 97%. There is probably no way to get around MS Office conveniently. You may need to run VMWare for MS Office like me and it works great!

I guess Evolution is the best choice to replace Outlook. Not running exchange server (not big enough to need it).

Should work fine then.

Need a server to share documents and hold printers.

Need to scan.

Should be easy enough with the appropriate drivers. Setting up factory print drivers for hi-res prints might be an issue, as you'll have to use the gimp drivers. But for standard printing this should come easy.

Need to be on Yahoo IM (which for some reason is the VN default). I guess there is some all in one that replaces it, right?

gaim, now known as Pidgin (www.pidgin.com), there are numerous other ones too.

Need to generate webalbums (currently using Webalbum Generator) and upload them (Filezilla, which I think is also available on Linux anyhow).

FileZilla should work, gFTP is also available standard on Linux. All this generation stuff is available using Linux.

Need wifi.

Will work, but be careful of the chipset. Some are M$ only!

IIRC Linux is reasonably virus-free, given that the vast majority of viruses are written with Win security holes in mind. True? Anyhow, guess I should have some kind of virus protection in place.

Pretty much, just keep it up to date, which works just like MS, it will prompt you on what to download.

Need Vietnamese font support of course (which is just a unicode thing, so I am sure it exists somewhere).

Maybe not as easy as OS X, which comes standard, but should be easy enough. Never tried.

I also have a Windows mobile phone (HTC620 which is a T-Mobile Dash in the US). be nice to be able to synch it, but if not, I will live.

Looks possible, http://www.htcwizardweb.net/node/1019, though you may need to pay someone to get it working or bribe someone on SF.

Curious about peripherals too. Shared printers, digicams, scanners, projectors and so forth. Need all that to Just Work.

This all depends on the protocols. If you have a standard (preferably supports postscript) network printer, it will just work, otherwise you'll have to configure SAMBA to be able to use it over the network neighborhood.

For digicams, it is best if they support the mass storage protocol so they can be mounted as a regular usb drive, Linux will detect this and mount them as soon as you plugin. Other cams probably work too.

For scanners, I have never used one really.

For projectors, it should just work like a separate monitor or TV no? If not, you can tweak the settings in Linux, but this isn't easy.

I am a Mac user by choice, so any distro that feels familiar to an OSX user will make adaptation quicker for me, staff training will probably take a while.

You can download skins to make linux look exactly like OS X, though I haven't tried.

Also, if you NEED to use a Windoze app, you could have one machine with the software on it and then remote desktop in from your linux machine to use it on your desktop. There is also the possibility of using VMWare or wine to run windows programs on Linux and they work pretty damn well!

There are two main window managers for Linux, kde.org and gnome.org. KDE has a lot of its own stuff, it is like the Windows of the Linux world. But it will run anything, they just might not be themed in KDE. Gnome is kind of a hodge podge of all the best things around. I use gnome and I like the feel more than KDE, but most people I know like KDE. You can switch between the two though, or even use other window managers.

Here is OS X cloned in KDE:

http://baghira.sourceforge.net/OS_Clone-en.php

Same in gnome:

http://www.howtoforge.com/mac4lin_ma...ook_like_a_mac

Cloning the interface to make it super detailed takes a bit of work. If you wanted to though, you'd be better off having someone write a script to update the GUI settings or have someone hack your install CD so it comes like that by default.

 

[Matt]

thanks for that, much appreciated.

Yes, I was thinking of getting one machine (probably the oldest one here) and running a legit copy of Win2k on it. Should be able to find one of those around somewhere (I think my brother has one) and MS Office, just for final compatibility checking when in doubt.

Any other stories/battlescars welcomed from people who have given Linux a shot.

 

[nioh]

I would suggest Ubuntu for Gnome use or Kubuntu for KDE use, both with great hardware support and forums for the occasional questions one might have. Not only that but also since it the most popular flavour by new Linux users today, which means it keeps up to date.

For an office environment I would recommend Kubuntu (KDE), since to me it's more polished than Gnome, with a better integrated work flow, user interactivity and customization abilities. Font support isn't a problem whatsoever, neither is any of the other issues/questions you raised, except possibly the compatibility with various office documents which tiecollector answered soundly.

 

[Matt]

I dont really get the difference between Gnome and KDE, but Evolution seems to be the most powerful PIM, and is Gnome only, right?

 

[tiecollector]

Originally Posted by m@T

I dont really get the difference between Gnome and KDE, but Evolution seems to be the most powerful PIM, and is Gnome only, right?
Basically, there are several layers that Linux runs off of. Windows pretty much only has 2, the kernel and the GUI. The heart of any OS is called the kernel, this is, essentially, Linux. All these different companies that make Linux are able to call it Linux because they all use the Linux kernel and then add their own accessories, like a tie to a suit. By default Linux runs off the command prompt, which is no fun sometimes, so there is a way to make pretty boxes appear like in windows, X11 allows this to happen at the hardware level. On top of X11, there are window managers that basically allow you to point and click around. They all have different looks and feels and there are countless ones that people have made over the years. The two biggest ones are KDE and Gnome. You can install both of them on a test system and play around with them both, they both do the same thing in that they let you bring up a Windows Explorer type window and click files to open etc. They each have their own web browser, they each have their own standard office productivity suite (gnome comes with open office, kde comes with Koffice). Konqueror, which Safari is based off of, is KDE's web browser. The only difference is pretty much in the features that the programs offer. The window manager itself also has some unique features but they all pretty much do the same thing. You know how OS X and Windows XP GUI all kind of do the same thing but a little different? KDE and Gnome are the same way. www.kde.org www.gnome.org check out screenshots. Gnome programs and KDE programs are interchangeable. They can both run under EITHER window manager, the only difference is that if you use Evolution under KDE, it will have a gnome theme and won't have KDE themed buttons, etc. Same goes with gnome, the mail client for KDE is KMail, and if you run it under gnome, the buttons will have the kde theme, not the gnome look and feel. KDE looks more like Windows. Gnome is kind of a Windows / OS X hybrid feel.

 

[Matt]

thank you for that, yup, get it.

so, given that I am predisposed to a Mac look, Evolution and Open Office (which I now understand will run on either GUI), would it be fair to say that I am better off with a Gnome system, just for the sake of a uniform look and feel to the system?

 

[Matt]

also - just how often will my staff have to open up some kind of command line thing? (the correct answer to this is Never)

Once in a blue moon I have to open up Terminal in OSX. Wherever possible, I try to avoid such moons. Preferably my staff need never see such a moon.

 

[tiecollector]

Originally Posted by m@T

thank you for that, yup, get it.

so, given that I am predisposed to Evolution and Open Office (which I now understand will run on either GUI), would it be fair to say that I am better off with a Gnome system, just for the sake of a uniform look and feel to the system?

You should sample them both. I would use gnome but most newbies prefer KDE. You can install them both on the same system easily and test them out. Just install one version of Ubuntu and then you can install anything you can dream afterwards.

http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu:Gutsy This site will get you where you need to go.

Ubuntu is a modification of Debian, which I think is the "official" Linux flavor. Debian kinda sucked though in some ways so this guy made Ubuntu. The whole system runs off what are called packages. There is a GUI you can use to download things or you can use the command line and use the 'apt-get' command. To install kde you'd type something like 'apt-get install kde'.

And it will go out and grab everything you need and then install it seamlessly.

 

[tiecollector]

Originally Posted by m@T

also - just how often will my staff have to open up some kind of command line thing? (the correct answer to this is Never)

Never, pretty much everything can be done with a GUI to the same degree that you would want to do stuff in OS X.

 

[Matt]

the one I have been looking at mostly is Mepis - which is apparently a bastardized Debian/Ubuntu. Seems to be getting really great reviews for its look/feel/out-the-box connectivity/ability to test drive it from the CD before installing, and huge number of bundled apps. This one notes how it is one of the easiest first time Linux distros for every day use. This makes a HappyMatt. Ever played with it?

 

[tiecollector]

Originally Posted by m@T

the one I have been looking at mostly is Mepis. Seems to be getting really great reviews for its look/feel/out-the-box connectivity/ability to test drive it from the CD before installing, and huge number of bundled apps. Ever played with it?
Never heard of it, there are so many linux distros out now. Ubuntu is probably the best supported for free. If you want support then buying some other distro is a good option. It appears Mepis runs KDE, though the site is pretty ****** and doesn't even have screenshots. It appears to come with compiz though, which is the new fancy window effects thingy. I think the new version of Ubuntu supports it also. It was a pain getting to work on the old version: I'm going to install the latest Ubuntu on my new laptop. I'm using the old version to type this out.

 

[tiecollector]

My advice is to get a spare computer and install Ubuntu and see how you like it, then you'll have some idea of what you are after. If Mepis is easy and has good support, then that is a plus and maybe worth buying.