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Life in world class cities vs. everywhere else

mm84321

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Originally Posted by iammatt
That is not Italian food. That is Jersey food.

You're right. The cuisine of heavily breaded and deep fried foods, dredged in parmesan and marinara sauce, deserves to be given its own classification.

Originally Posted by Fang66
Dragon is of the opinion that Tokyo offers the best of everything. I disagree.
I gave examples that illustrate a point; I could name many other items that are not popular in Japan and thus less than readily available.

I don't craze [sic] lamb, ham or pizza I generally eat Japanese staples, the point is that Tokyo is lacking in the availability of international cuisine and produce compared to other cities.

Also I'm not American and neither is my ass, and you can eat the crotch out of Amy Winehouse's panties for all I care you lice infested turd sniffer.


I quite like you.
 

Dragon

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Originally Posted by Fang66
It may be true that the best of the best is available in Tokyo (in some cases it is) but you have to search it out.

The best of the best is available in Tokyo when it comes to restaurants or even food produce. Whether you want to pay for it or not is another story. In other major cities, even if you search it out, the best is not available. Not saying you can't find good stuff in other cities, but the variety is is not even close to what is offered in Tokyo.

Originally Posted by Fang66
Also there is little middle ground between 3 star and pizza with mayo and corn.

I hate PizzaLa as much you, and wish there was better American pizza. That is one thing I can't find in Tokyo/Japan. There are a ton of real Italian pizza places though, and you can't find these on every corner in other major cities like you can in Tokyo.

Originally Posted by Fang66
Please let me know where you do your shopping because I really don't see how you can get the best selection of produce in the world in Tokyo. Sure for some specific things like some fruit and say fatty tuna for example that may be true but in general the supermarkets are a joke and other quality shops or markets cater almost exlusively to Japanese oriented food. Walk into a random supermarket and try to buy a leg of lamb, impossible, or even a whole chicken is often problematic, try to buy something as simple as a ham bone or even a proper ham! Yes you can get anything you want in Tokyo just less easily than almost any large (or medium) sized city in the western world.

You can't just walk into a random supermarket in ANY major city in the world an find good produce. The same goes for Japan. Good produce does not equal western produce. When it comes to fruit, vegetables, meats, fish you can easily find the best quality in the world.

Whole chicken is widely available (even in random, regular supermarkets) and the quality of the chicken is far superior than anything you will find in the States. If you want the best of the best chicken (whole), you can get that too if you go to a chicken specialty shop or somewhere that would sell more high end chicken.

For something like leg of lamb, you won't find it in regular Japanese supermarkets because obviously there is no demand, but if you go to supermarkets catering to foreigners, or specialty butchers, you could easily find those things.
 

Fang66

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Originally Posted by Dragon
For something like leg of lamb, you won't find it in regular Japanese supermarkets because obviously there is no demand, but if you go to supermarkets catering to foreigners, or specialty butchers, you could easily find those things.

I concede that yes you can buy a 20,000 yen melon here and there are 3 star restaurants in abundance and some things here are always top notch like the seafood for example, that doesn't however excuse the general mediocraty.

I think we've reached an impasse but I just want to make a couple of final comments on the topic.

Firstly, availability of specialty items does not equate to catering to foreigners, we are talking about a supposedly world class city you should be able to get pretty much anything relatively easily. In N.Y., London or even a dive like Sydney you can easily get virtually any Japanese ingredient you want, perhaps not as good as here but still available, try to buy fresh red chillies here! (just another example of the many).

There are only a few large specialty butchers in the whole of Tokyo for example Hanamasa (they have been shutting many stores recently) and none of them are on par with even a local butcher in the smallest town in Australia. There are some other choices like Costco or Nisshin but the point is they are exceptions to the general dearth and even they are not great.

ps I don't consider a ritz cracker tasting base with tomato sauce some cheddar cheese and 2 basil leaves to be Italian pizza.
 

Mr Herbert

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wait, you think Sydney is a dive?

it has to be one of the most attractive cities in the world

excluding the suburban sprawl surrounding it that is, but what city doesnt have ugly fringes
 

Fang66

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Originally Posted by Mr Herbert
wait, you think Sydney is a dive?

it has to be one of the most attractive cities in the world

excluding the suburban sprawl surrounding it that is, but what city doesnt have ugly fringes


True but Sydney has otherworldly ugliness embodied in the people who live there.
 

Dragon

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Originally Posted by Fang66
I concede that yes you can buy a 20,000 yen melon here and there are 3 star restaurants in abundance and some things here are always top notch like the seafood for example, that doesn't however excuse the general mediocraty.

I think we've reached an impasse but I just want to make a couple of final comments on the topic.

Firstly, availability of specialty items does not equate to catering to foreigners, we are talking about a supposedly world class city you should be able to get pretty much anything relatively easily. In N.Y., London or even a dive like Sydney you can easily get virtually any Japanese ingredient you want, perhaps not as good as here but still available, try to buy fresh red chillies here! (just another example of the many).

There are only a few large specialty butchers in the whole of Tokyo for example Hanamasa (they have been shutting many stores recently) and none of them are on par with even a local butcher in the smallest town in Australia. There are some other choices like Costco or Nisshin but the point is they are exceptions to the general dearth and even they are not great.

ps I don't consider a ritz cracker tasting base with tomato sauce some cheddar cheese and 2 basil leaves to be Italian pizza.


They don't use cheddar on Italian pizza
A lot of the places trained in Naples and use top quality mozzarella, which also happens to be available in Tokyo.
 

Fang66

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Originally Posted by Mr Herbert
are you from Melbourne by any chance?

Nope, but I like Melb more than Sinny, not as pretty as Syd but the people are nicer. It's just a snark, Sydney has a lot going for it but it is a relatively minor city in the whole scheme of things and in many ways not as nice as Melb or Brisbane (not from there either) I also don't like the fact that Sydney people have a similar superior attitude to New Yorkers but New Yorkers actually have something to feel superior about thus making them Alpha as Fuck and Sydney Siders just wannabes.
 

Fang66

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Originally Posted by Dragon
They don't use cheddar on Italian pizza
A lot of the places trained in Naples and use top quality mozzarella, which also happens to be available in Tokyo.


So you concede that the bases taste like ritz crackers
 

Kid Nickels

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There is much to say & many opinions on this topic... stemming, of course, from different tastes, priorities, experiences, etc. I have lived in LA, Toronto, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Dubai, Taipei, Brisbane, Hong Kong and Dubai. I have spent reasonable amounts of time ( a month or more ) in Auckland, Sydney, NYC, San Diego, Bangkok, Corpus Christi, London, Nadi (Fiji) and Abu Dhabi. Of them all my faves are San Diego and Taipei. They both are large cities that still have a small town feel... at least to me. They are not oppressive and always "on" you in a way I feel in Dubai or Hong Kong (where I am at the moment). All the excitement, culture, and diversity is readily available, but so too is some peace & quiet.... the tranquility of nature very close by. When I return home to the Midwest (Ohio), it does indeed feel like the world has stopped. I can leave for years and come back as if nothing has changed. Just my 2 cents....
 

Kid Nickels

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^
uhhh... ya lived in Dubai 2x...
funny I wrote that twice b/c it seemed like forevvvvvvverrrrrrrr....
 

Canvas08

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A world class city needs good Mexican food. And not that crap that east coasters think is Mexican food.
 

Kid Nickels

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Originally Posted by Canvas08
A world class city needs good Mexican food. And not that crap that east coasters think is Mexican food.

^+1... tis true... but it's worse in Asia... much, MUCH worse my friend.
 

patrickBOOTH

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Originally Posted by Canvas08
A world class city needs good Mexican food. And not that crap that east coasters think is Mexican food.

I never understand this. Here in New York there are constantly these assholes from the southwest complaining about the Mexican food. It is the simplest food. It all pretty much tastes the same. I can't imagine it being that much better that it is a cause for a stir.
 

patrickBOOTH

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Originally Posted by mm84321
Unless, of course, you live in New Jersey.

Originally Posted by iammatt
That is not Italian food. That is Jersey food.

Brooklyn has great Italian food. A lot of the "good" Italian food joints in Jersey are owned and run by Albanians. My Italian father calls them goat herders.
 

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