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Leather Dress Shoes and Proper Fit

TheVarmint

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I'm new here so I hope I have the appropriate forum. I'm 29 and have been stepping up my shoe game lately, becoming a bit obsessed, actually.

I've read quite a bit of articles on how leather shoes should fit, however, I'm still uncertain about the spacing between the tip of my toes and the front of the shoe.

I understand that my toes should definitely not be touching the tip, however, how much space is too much space? There's about a 2-thumbs width between the front of my toes and the tip of the shoe (in the pictured double monkstraps). I can easily wiggle my toes, however the widest part of my foot feels comfortable (not too tight or too loose). From what I recall, the .5 size down was too tight.

Overall, I am walking comfortably. Am I overthinking this or is the room in front of shoe okay?

Thanks to anyone who can offer input.

IMG_8873.JPG


IMG_8875.JPG
 

GBR

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There is no rule for this at all, everyone's feet differ in width, length and it is not unusual for there to be a size difference between right and left. It is thus a balancing for what suits you.

You should be able to walk comfortably in and certainly feel as if you are wearing the boxes and not the shoes which were in them!
 

TheVarmint

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Based on that creasing pattern, I would argue they're too long.

So, assuming these are too long, and the size below was too tight. Does this mean that this brand/style of shoe will not work for me and that I should be primarily shopping at shoe stores that offer E or EE widths?
 

starro

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It's more important to get heel-to-ball right than heel-to-toe. Extra room in the toe box, while not ideal, should not be detrimental to fit so long as heel-to-ball length, and widths at ball and heel, are correct.

The questions you should be asking yourself regarding fit are:
  1. Is widest part of my foot at the widest part of the shoe?
  2. At the ball, can my foot move horizontally? Or is it too tight? or just right?
  3. Is there extra space in the mouth of the shoe, or is it too tight around the ankle and heel, or just right?
  4. After a full day of walking (3-5 miles), any problem areas?
 

DWFII

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There's truth in all these above responses...and misconceptions as well.

Starro has it correct when he says that the most important fit parameter is heel to ball. Width of the insole is important as well but only in conjunction with the girth measurement at the ball. When weight is on the foot the insole should not be felt along the sides of the foot. And there should be no excess vamp leather around the foot.

That said, there is a standard of sorts for a medium round toe there should be approximately one inch (three barleycorns) of clearance beyond the longest toe and the inside of the shoe at the toe. I say "approximately" because the more precise standard is one-eleventh of the length of the last....which equals one inch for a foot that is eleven inches long. Some contemporary shoes are built on lasts that are "extended" and are intended to have as much as one and one-quarter inches (or more) of toe clearance. Some wider toes can get away with a little less.

And of course, some people have long toe s and some have short toes...again, heel to ball is the most critical fit.

People often fit themselves widely at variance to these standards and will all too often not notice the difference when they are young or have never been fit properly. But both the shoes and the foot are poorly served in doing so. Foot problems in later years can sometimes be directly connected to improper fitting shoes when a person is young and resilient.

Looking at the creases, I would have to agree the fit is not optimal.
 

TheVarmint

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There's truth in all these above responses...and misconceptions as well.

Starro has it correct when he says that the most important fit parameter is heel to ball. Width of the insole is important as well but only in conjunction with the girth measurement at the ball. When weight is on the foot the insole should not be felt along the sides of the foot. And there should be no excess vamp leather around the foot.

That said, there is a standard of sorts for a medium round toe there should be approximately one inch (three barleycorns) of clearance beyond the longest toe and the inside of the shoe at the toe. I say "approximately" because the more precise standard is one-eleventh of the length of the last....which equals one inch for a foot that is eleven inches long. Some contemporary shoes are built on lasts that are "extended" and are intended to have as much as one and one-quarter inches (or more) of toe clearance. Some wider toes can get away with a little less.

And of course, some people have long toe s and some have short toes...again, heel to ball is the most critical fit.

People often fit themselves widely at variance to these standards and will all too often not notice the difference when they are young or have never been fit properly. But both the shoes and the foot are poorly served in doing so. Foot problems in later years can sometimes be directly connected to improper fitting shoes when a person is young and resilient.

Looking at the creases, I would have to agree the fit is not optimal.

Thank you all. This pretty much sums it up.
 

TheVarmint

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On this note, should I be using shoe trees in my Alden boots? I'm convinced it's stretching them, which I don't want.
 

TheVarmint

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Unlike the monkstraps, I feel like these fit me perfectly, however, I am noticing they're starting to get some creases.

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basu13

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Digging up a relatively old thread to as a basic query on shoe sizing. I am presently in the process of ordering my first pair of GYW dress shoes from Bridlen (they make amazing shoes at the 300 USD price point). The trial shoe they sent me for sizing (size 9 UK) has around 2 inches of length between by largest toe and the outside tip of the shoe (toe cap). The rest of the shoe including at the widest part seems comfortable enough.

Obviously the gap of 2 inches at the top is way too much. Question is, do I need to downsize by 1 size (down to 8UK) or even more? This is ordered online so getting repeat trial pairs in 8 size may be a bit of a problem. But Bridlen is good at communication and open to having pictures sent through Whatsapp etc to pinpoint the size. In any event, I would also be grateful to know views of experienced members here.

Also - attaching a few comparison pictures of a black captoe that I currently wear (a local brand from Italy, blake stiched) and the size 9 UK Bridlen trial shoe (the longer shoe in the images). In case this helps for a better understanding of my query!
 

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DWFII

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A full size is traditiopnally one-third of an inch.

So, if your shoes really and truly are two inches longer than the longest toe of your foot, a rough calculation would suggest that the shoes are three full sizes too long.

i would be careful though, it is not always easy for a tyro to accurately assess the length of his foot inside a shoe....unless the shoe has no toe stiffener. And it's inside dimensions not outside--the toe stiffener, lining and vamp could maybe account for a third of an inch.
 
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basu13

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A full size is traditiopnally one-third of an inch.

So, if your shoes really and truly are two inches longer than the longest toe of your foot, a rough calculation would suggest that the shoes are three full sizes too long.

i would be careful though, it is not always easy for a tyro to accurately assess the length of his foot inside a shoe....unless the shoe has to toe stiffener. And it's inside dimensions not outside--the toe stiffener, lining and vamp could maybe account for a third of an inch.

Thank you. The 2 inches that I mentioned is indeed an approximate measurement, and also, taken on the outside of the shoe (not the inside gap). In other words, it is the outside dimension that I was talking about. Thank you for your suggestions!
 

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