JohnBull Sewing Chops

Discussion in 'Streetwear and Denim' started by LA Guy, Oct 19, 2006.

  1. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    My assessments:

    SC001 - 501 Repro fit, similar to 47
    SC002 - 501 Repro fit, similar to 66
    SC003 - Straight leg, low-slung, slim
    SC005 - Bootcut, slim, low-rise
    SC007 - Straight leg, slim, not as low-slung as 3
    SC008 - Tapered, slim, low rise, but with normal back pocket placement.


    If the SC003 is lower slung than the SC007, then your package is showing. According to Gordon at BIG, the SC007 are considerably lower rise than the SC003, by about an inch.

    I got the SC007 today. Like the SC008, they are a cotton linen blend. Here are my assessments compared to *the* starter brand, APC New Standards, and a true premium brand, 5EP bootcuts. I'll talk about the fit last.

    Denim - the denim is significantly softer than the APC, even after the APC has been washed a few times. My initial assessment is that it is not as durable as the APC denim. It is considerable less "finished" than the APC denim, and the surface texture is more interesting. The weave is denser than the APC denim. The denim has nothing on the 5EP denim, however, which has a far more complex color, and is a much denser, more tightly woven denim. Of course, the 5EP are $100 more.

    Stitching - the stitching is not as good as either the APC or the 5EP denim. There are more dropped stitches, and more (I assume accidental) unfinished areas than the APC. Also, the inseam is not flatfelled, unlike the APC. I give this to the APC by a slight margin.

    Hardware - about the same quality as the APC, definitely not on the same level as the 5EPs. However, there are the usual Japanese details like hiddne rivets, which APCs do not have.

    Details: The Leather John Bull patch is really cool.

    Fit - here is where these jeans stand out. However, you have to be in good shape *and* slim to wear these jeans. They are low slung, I mean, really low slung - only 3 buttons, including the top button. I wear most of my jeans on the bottom of my hips, and these jeans sit even lower. The widest part of my hips is 31.5 inches. The "waist on these jeans measures 32" on a pair of 30s, and essentially sit on the top of my butt. The thighs are extremely fitted. My thighs are just under 21", and these were pretty tight when I first put them on (they subsequently loosened up a bit. The cut is about as straight as you get - 16" around from lower thigh on down.

    At $168, it's a good jean. IMO, the APC NS is a better bargain at $140 if you are looking for pure durability. However, the fit of this jean is considerably more flattering if you are slim/athletic, and the denim is has a more interesting texture.
     


  2. Arethusa

    Arethusa Senior member

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    Sounds a little strange having the distressed version more expensive; they probably factor in the extra labour required.
    The thing is that that makes sense. What's really absurd is how we've all become convinced that dry should cost more when it costs vastly less to produce.
     


  3. sygyzy

    sygyzy Senior member

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    Here is a breakdown of the different Sewing Chop styles:

    513BD - Selvage, unwashed, straight leg
    SC001 - Selvage, unwashed, straight leg
    SC002 - Selvage, unwashed, tapered leg
    SC003 - Non-selvage, one wash, straight leg
    SC005 - Non-selvage, one wash, flared leg
    SC007 - Selvage, one wash, straight leg
    SC008 - Selvage, one wash, super skinny leg
     


  4. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    The thing is that that makes sense. What's really absurd is how we've all become convinced that dry should cost more when it costs vastly less to produce.

    One wash is a $1 wash at a washhouse. A hand distressing job at a good place can cost upwards of $20.
     


  5. skalogre

    skalogre Senior member

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    My thought was that as the one wash/dry may be more of a niche market situation with more consumers willing to pay high $$$$ (afaik), they would conceivably up the prices in that section instead. Then again denim is not my specialty [​IMG]
     


  6. Saucemaster

    Saucemaster Sized Down 2

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    Fit - here is where these jeans stand out. However, you have to be in good shape *and* slim to wear these jeans. They are low slung, I mean, really low slung - only 3 buttons, including the top button. I wear most of my jeans on the bottom of my hips, and these jeans sit even lower. The widest part of my hips is 31.5 inches. The "waist on these jeans measures 32" on a pair of 30s, and essentially sit on the top of my butt. The thighs are extremely fitted. My thighs are just under 21", and these were pretty tight when I first put them on (they subsequently loosened up a bit. The cut is about as straight as you get - 16" around from lower thigh on down.
    Since waist size indicates I'd probably be buying the same size as you: assuming you're taking thigh measurements at the top of the leg, my thighs are 22". Were I to get a pair of these, do you get the sense that these'd be too snug, or do they seem like they'll stretch enough to give me a little slack in the thighs? Basically, my best-fitting pair of jeans measures right around 23.5" around in the thighs, which gives me a bit of slack but still looks fitted--do you think these would get there? I could probably also go with a 31, since I seem to have wider hips than you (I got birthin' hips, I reckon), but I'd rather pull them down and let them stretch a bit. Also, any guesses on how well they might fade?
     


  7. Brian SD

    Brian SD Moderator

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    When I say the SC003 is more low slung, Im just referring to the yoke, front and back pockets. The rise itself is higher on the SC003.
     


  8. Saucemaster

    Saucemaster Sized Down 2

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    When I say the SC003 is more low slung, Im just referring to the yoke, front and back pockets. The rise itself is higher on the SC003.

    So the 003's seem to be easier to wear a bit antifit, then? How's the denim on yours, btw? As soft as LA Guy's seems to be?
     


  9. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    Update, apparently, the denim composition on these jeans is 82% cotton, 18% hemp! Not sure exactly how the hemp changes the denim quality, and I'm hoping that ringring or someone else with that caliber of knowledge (i.e. not me) will chime in here.

    Also, after a day of use, the jeans have stretched out to become much more comfortable. The waist (or, top of butt, really [​IMG] ) has stretched out to about 33", which makes them a little loose, and more comfortable (I hate my jeans constricting around the waist). The thighs have also loosened up, and most importantly, the knee area has stretched enough that my quads are no longer on prominent display (I have fairly defined quads from intervals and sprinting. I really like the low rise (although, they will not be for everyone) and the true straightleg. And with an inseam just over 33", they fall really well over my Chucks. In natural light, the denim is really quite something. I've haven't seen any premium American or European jean that is such a true blue except in vintage stores (usually on jeans from the 70's).
     


  10. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    When I say the SC003 is more low slung, I'm just referring to the yoke, front and back pockets. The rise itself is higher on the SC003.

    Yeah, that makes sense. Not sure about the front pockets, but the back pockets on the SC007 are about the same position as those on the APC NS. However, because they have such a low rise, the back pockets sit quite low anyway. The illusion of antifit? You should get a pair of SC007. I think that you'd like them. I remember the APC hipster fitting you well. These are similar, but a true straightleg, and with sufficient room for your package [​IMG]
     


  11. ENT

    ENT Senior member

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    Does anyone know how the waist size changes over time (with wearing, washing, etc.) on the 1 wash jeans? I normally wear a 31 and was going to go with the 30's as they seem to measure 1.5 to 2 inches larger than tagged. Any thoughts?
     


  12. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    Does anyone know how the waist size changes over time (with wearing, washing, etc.) on the 1 wash jeans? I normally wear a 31 and was going to go with the 30's as they seem to measure 1.5 to 2 inches larger than tagged. Any thoughts?

    They will stretch a little, but then shrink upon washing closer and closer to the marked size. However if you are thinking about the the SC007 or SC008, remember that these are *very* low rise, so that they will sit at the bottom of your hips, which are about 1-3 inches larger than your waist, unless you have monster obliques and/or are an assless wonder (lots of white dudes in this camp.) Also, I have moderately muscular quads and thighs and pretty muscular calves. There would be no way I would fit into SC008s of the correct waist size. Even on the SC007, the first day I wore them, I felt a little like Superman because the jeans showed the definition in my quads.
     


  13. petng

    petng Well-Known Member

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    I have a pair of 508BD from a couple of years ago. Lightweight Selvage.

    Does anyone know what type of levis cut these are. To me they look like a 47 501.?
     


  14. sygyzy

    sygyzy Senior member

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    They will stretch a little, but then shrink upon washing closer and closer to the marked size. However if you are thinking about the the SC007 or SC008, remember that these are *very* low rise, so that they will sit at the bottom of your hips, which are about 1-3 inches larger than your waist, unless you have monster obliques and/or are an assless wonder (lots of white dudes in this camp.)

    I wish more people would point this out. It took me a while to understand this correlation and though I don't have it exactly down, I know now to size up when buying "low-rise" jeans. I find that even though some jeans go up to my waist, they actually sit (point of most outward pressure, holding up the jeans) on my hips. In some ways, the waist measurement doesn't even come into play since I often have 1-2 inches to spare on my actual waist. Confusing and annoying to an extent.
     


  15. Brian SD

    Brian SD Moderator

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    I love JBs, but my next pair of denim is probably gonna be Samurai or something, full selvage and slubby as shit. Gonna be using a bike as my main transportation soon, and the stitching on the JBs is simply not going to hold up to that kind of wear. Saw some pics of the S0505xx on SuFu that look great... [​IMG] Love this look... hopefully they'll release a limited edition in the same cut... or even better, a black limited edition in the same cut. [​IMG]
     


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