Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by MilanoStyle, Mar 25, 2005.
I love this suit ... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws....6732126
Italian RLPL is St. Andrews
English RLPL is Chester Barrie
And that suit, is definitely St. Andrews, the label gives it away.
I love it too. Stunning.
what a bargain
That suits is Saint Andrews. However, not all PL clothing is Saint Andrews. The jackets with the non-working sleeve buttons are made by Cantarelli, and are priced accordingly; between $1500 and $2000. They don't make PL suits, only sportcoats.
The Saint Andrews stuff is entirely hand made; Cantarelli doesn't have that level of handwork.
Cantarelli and St. Andrews is the same company, right?
St. Andrews is owned by Cantarelli. If you can spring for it, SA is the better way to go between the two. Very high quality.
Judging by the suit's measurment, the suit may have come from an athletic. Too bad .. The suit's chest is too big for me.
Yes, but don't confuse ownership with quality. Clothes made under the Saint Andrews label has significantly more handwork. This should be evident by just looking at the garment. Clothes made by Cantarelli, while high quality, don't come close the what goes into Saint Andrews.
Saint Andrews uses horsehair canvas, and the lapels are hand stitched/rolled (one of only few makers that do this). Cantarelli uses fusing to some degree (which doesn't equal low quality, I mean... even Brioni has some degree of fusing); it also has more machine work, particularly on the canvas front.
What are you talking about???...
Which comment? About Brioni?
Yes, about Brioni.
About both Cantarelli and Brioni, but mainly the latter. I'm not sure whether Cantarelli produces some fused products, but I know that the Golden Fleece they produce have no fusing.
And I'm quite certain Brioni uses no fusing -- head up to Neiman Marcus in Boston for a first hand look (they have a sweet basted Brioni coat on a tailor's form -- you can see the canvassing and their incredible pad stitching).
How do you know for sure? You can't tell by just looking, and a "pinch test" will tell you nothing.
By fusing, I'm not talking about the chest. Brioni, RL, Cantarelli, etc... have no fusing in the chest, they are fully canvassed in the chest. Thus will qualify as a "canvassed suit." Brioni, RLPL, Oxxford, Kiton are hand canvassed, lesser priced ones are machine canvassed.
All manufacturers use *some* degree of fusing (Kiton is entirely hand made). However, on Brioni or Cantarelli, it's so insignificant that it doesn't really matter, and in places that you couldn't even tell.
On Cantarelli, RL, Zegna, etc... (suits priced from $1K to $2K), moderate fusing is used in the collar, and mostly in areas below the bottom button of the coat. Thus I said "some fusing." Again, it is pretty insignificant. If I didn't tell you this, you wouldn't even know. If you had a better trained eye, you could tell in areas below the first button.
BB Golden Fleece, while a very high quality suit, isn't entirely hand made. They would literally loose money for retailing a suit at that price if it was 100% hand made/hand stitched.
To clear things up, Brioni uses an absurd amount of handwork. I haven't seen it talked about accurately on this board, as to what it is in real life. The amount of hours that go into each coat, are the highest in the industry, next to Kiton. However, there is a bit of fusing in the collar; which doesn't make a difference.
Mike, a suit doesn't have to be 100% handmade in order to have no fusing. A sewing machine will stitch in canvas just as well as a hand, which is why a fully canvassed suit can be priced at under $1200. If you'd like to cut open a Brioni and show me the fusing in the collar, I'm all eyes. Until then, I see this thread as doing little more than spreading misinformation.
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