Is black suit an acceptable business attire?

[Manton]

I suppose I'll break the rule but break it  only so far (which admitedly doesn't make a whole helluva lot of sense).

No, no, no -- it makes perfect sense.  That's the essense of style.  A little rule-breaking looks good and adds character.  A lot ends up looking costumey.

 

[MPS]

I am no dorm-room debater and I was being more concrete than you give me credit for. What sources do you have that define rules? Crime is defined by the law. Etiquette is defined by Emily Post if you want, though I think most etiquette is common sense. Who defines the clothing rules?

Bresch,

The word "value" is defined in a dictionary: look it up.

MPS

 

[Alias]

Bresch,

The word "value" is defined in a dictionary: look it up.

MPS

You're a little late for the party there dude

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

alias

It looks like the only people who like what's going on are the people who don't like Dr. Bresch.

Either you are incomprehensibly knowledgeable about the feelings of the members who have posted here or this statement has absolutely no basis in fact and should be withdrawn. I do not in any way dislike David. I have appreciated his debating skills many times. For the third time in this one thread, I believe that his contributions have been invaluable. That being said, his most recent few posts do not merit the respect I have accorded. He has lowered himself to offering naught but an ongoing series of personal insults unbefitting both his abilities and his position as an esteemed member of this Forum. They, as well, ought be withdrawn. To reiterate: I do not in any way dislike David. I have appreciated his debating skills many times. For the third time in this one thread, I believe that his contributions have been invaluable. David's tendency to ignore calmly offered requests for a response

I do not appreciate the swipe you took in using me as the entryway to your rather nasty exit from the debate.

is rather annoying and tends to generate increased stridency, but is by no means unique on the fora. One gets used to this sort of thing although I consider it an offense I would be loathe to commit. Finally, Alias, in case you missed it: I do not in any way dislike David. I have appreciated his debating skills many times. For the third time in this one thread ... and now the third time in this single post ... I believe that his contributions have been invaluable.

 

[Steve B.]

For the evening event on march 4 I am thinking of wearing a black Oxxford suit that has a bit of a pattern to it and a subtle wine colored wide pinstripe.

Chuck:

I think we have the same suit. Should I wear mine so we can be twinners...

Manton, David:

Give it a f***ng rest...

Can't we all get along???

I AM MARC GRAYSON YOU WILL NEVER KEEP ME BANNED

Except even that's not his real name...I think we all need to chip in and send Paypal some donations to Dr. Bresch to give Mr. "Grayson" some much-needed psychotherapy. I truly think he deserves more sympathy at this point than ire.

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

Chuck - HELP... Now they're coordinating their dress for the day. I thought we were supposed to do that.

Edit:
P.S.: Oh, No. My skills must be on the wane in my old age. He didn't chastise me along with the other guys. I feel ... slighted.

 

[Manton]

It truly horrifies me to think back over all those major fashion fubars I've committed my entire professional life. Â How embarassing. Â I wear black shoes with suits at least half the time, I prefer them although I am not sure why. Â I just like them.

Your black shoes are fine. Â They are not against the rules but perfectly proper. Â In fact, according to the strictest possible interpretation of the rules, they are more correct than brown shoes with city worsted or flannel suits worn in town. I think you have confused a preference of some members with a rule. Â Many guys -- me included -- prefer brown shoes to black, all other considerations aside. Â I think brown is a more interesting color; it is "warmer" and more lively; there are so many lovely shades, as opposed to black, which has but one; and fine brown shoes can take on gorgeous patina as they age that black shoes can't match. That said, I would not wear brown shoes to a funeral, or a job interview, or with bright reds and blues (in the shirt and tie).

I don't know what kissing buttons are.

Look at the sleeve of your suit or odd jacket. Â There should be four (or perhaps three) buttons near the bottom edge, arranged in a line. Â If the edges touch, the buttons are "kissing".

Also, brown suits should only be worn in the country,

This is an old London rule that is no longer in effect. Â Americans have never honored it. Â The fashion bibles of the 1930s -- Apparel Arts and Esquire -- proselytized endlessly in favor of town brown suits. Â Even the Brits have given up on the "no brown in town" rule. Â In 1993, the Federation of Merchant Tailors in London officially declared the rule dead, and gave its blessing to brown in town.

I am not allowed to wear black trousers, and I am also not allowed to wear black suits.

Of you course you are "allowed" to wear them. Â You are allowed to wear whatever you want. Â I would not recommend them, but others would. Â Your taste is uniquely your own, and only you can decide these things.

Manton, when will this book be published?

This fall. Â Thanks for your interest.

 

[Steve B.]

P.S.: Oh, No. My skills must be on the wane in my old age. He didn't chastise me along with the other guys. I feel ... slighted.

Alex: Flog yourself 50 times with a wet Zimmerli g-string... Are you satisfied?

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

Edit: Thank you Steve. I feel so much better. End of edit.

there are so many lovely shades, as opposed to black, which has but one

As both shirtmaker and artist, I beg to differ. Although the scientific quantification of black yields only one 'color' (the absence of all color), reality is not quite so kind. In the fields of both fabric as well as paint, there are blacks of many a different hue. Four of the more common include: Blue-Black Grey-Black Brown-Black Red-Black I state this as one who has often been faced with two bolts of black fabric, same mill, same number, same this, same that ... which do not in any way match. I state this as one confronted with two black leathers for making my belts which most certainly would clash if combined. I presume, from the solitary evidence of this leather proposition, that the same phenomena must have faced a bootmaker or two. Hence, I respectfully derive my proposition, sans bibliography and with only personal experience as evidence, that there is not "but one black".

 

[Manton]

In the fields of both fabric as well as paint, there are blacks of many a different hue. Four of the more common include:
Blue-Black
Grey-Black
Brown-Black
Red-Black

I state this as one who has often been faced with two bolts of black fabric, same mill, same number, same this, same that ... which do not in any way match. I state this has one confronted with two black leathers for my belts which most certainly would clash if combined. I presume, from the solitary evidence of this leather proposition, that the same phenomena must have faced a bootmaker or two.

Well, yes, this is correct.  I withdraw my calumny against the color black.

I will say, in an attempt to crawl out of the hole that I have dug for myself, that in my experience looking at leather swatches for bespoke shoes, the differences between shades of black are often so subtle that they are hard to see.  Also, the range of black shades is much, much smaller than the range of browns.  Finally, when choosing shoes to wear with a tailored ensemble, black is black is black no matter the subtleties of its shade.  Whereas it is possible to have a range of brown shoes, some of which look better with some ensembles, and others with others.

The best looking black shoes I have ever seen are samples in the Lobb Paris showroom, which the salesman told me were more than 50 years old.  They had taken on a lovely, mottled patina this is hard to to describe.  Still somehow black, but also somehow "lighter" in parts.  I could not name that lighter color on a bet.  I hope and dream that some of my black shoes will look like that one day.

 

[oscarthewild]

Is black suit an acceptable business attire? In Transylvania, it is. Black suit, black cape. Also it is very appropriate if you are Batman and your business is catching baddies.

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

The best looking black shoes I have ever seen are samples in the Lobb Paris showroom, which the salesman told me were more than 50 years old. They had taken on a lovely, mottled patina this is hard to to describe. Still somehow black, but also somehow "lighter" in parts. I could not name that lighter color on a bet. I hope and dream that some of my black shoes will look like that one day.

I agree. The most interesting black shoe leather colors I have seen are some extremely old women's bespoke models made by either Roman Vaingauz' father or grandfather prior to their emmigration from Russia. I don't know their age, but I presume close to a century. Possibly made for the Czarina ... but that's just wild speculation. Which, given Roman's delivery time, may apply to his new shoes as well.

 

[Trilby]

Is black suit an acceptable business attire?

In Transylvania, it is.

Black suit, black cape.


Also it is very appropriate if you are Batman and your business is catching baddies.

Fantastic. Absolutely true. Is it too much to hope for that this can be the last word on this subject?

 

[Ambulance Chaser]

Quote:

Is black suit an acceptable business attire? In Transylvania, it is. Black suit, black cape. Also it is very appropriate if you are Batman and your business is catching baddies.
Fantastic. Â Absolutely true. Â Is it too much to hope for that this can be the last word on this subject?
Yes. Â We have not yet discussed which is more against "the rules": non-kissing sleeve buttons or vodka martinis. Â Even though we disagree on the former, I hope we can all agree that the latter is an abomination.

 

[Manton]

We have not yet discussed which is more against "the rules":  non-kissing sleeve buttons or vodka martinis.

If we've moved on to mixology, what about ice cubes in wine?