If You Are A Boss....

[odoreater]

Originally Posted by raclotz

Question: Would you, the manager, prefer to know immediately that you might be losing an important staff member even though the matter is not settled, or would you prefer to be unaware until you could be given clear direction by your report as to his intention, rather than with some uncertainty? How would you feel if you knew of the possibility early, but your report didn't actually leave?

I would leave the matter without letting him know.

Of course the manager would prefer to know immediately. As a manager, if my employee told me that he was planning on leaving, but was not certain, I would not wait until he was certain to begin looking for his replacement. In fact, I might even use the opportunity to have him train his replacement.

 

[JayJay]

I have had employees tell me they were thinking of leaving or were interviewing for other jobs, and then they didn't leave. I can't say that my impression of them didn't change, especially if they didn't get the sought-after job.

Although I have excellent employees who I would hate to see leave, I always have a contingency/succession plan in mind in case someone does leave. Just as everyone is replaceable, anyone can walk in any day to say goodbye.

 

[ms244]

Please say you aren't leaving the technical fields to become another ambulance chaser......

 

[gnatty8]

Originally Posted by odoreater

Definitely do not tell anyone until you are certain that you are leaving. If you tell them that you are uncertain, and then you decide not to leave, instead of them thinking of you as a "lifer" they're going to think of you as "the guy looking for a way out." Since you will no longer be a reliable long term prospect for them, it's likely that they will start looking for a replacement asap anyway (especially given the fact that it's so hard to find a replacement).

Very well put, its what I was trying to get at with my "looking for your replacement" statement..

 

[Huntsman]

Looks like the consensus is don't tell until you know. That's reasonable. There's no way I could tell my boss and have him not start the hiring machine up, in which case everyone will know, and maybe our relationship wouldn't be as cordial if I stay. That would be sad. The moment I know I'll invite him over for some Scotch.

Originally Posted by DarkNWorn

H, if you can do it financially, why don't you just let him know as soon as you're certain? Take a few months off, do some traveling, pursue a hobby, etc. Your next three (actually, 3 and a half if you factor in the bar exam and the admission process) is going to be a *****, might as well enjoy your free time now.
Whoa, bro. If I could financially take a few months off I wouldn't be going to law school. Part of the reasons I'm changing jobs is to try and find something that will grant me some freedom on my off time -- to travel and to do things like that.

Originally Posted by Kas

H, are you a researcher in the field of sensory and consumer science?
<laughs> I guess this stems from my comments about the limited number of people in my field? But no. It's similar though, in that the work is specialized, but the applications are huge.

Originally Posted by odoreater

Of course the manager would prefer to know immediately. As a manager, if my employee told me that he was planning on leaving, but was not certain, I would not wait until he was certain to begin looking for his replacement. In fact, I might even use the opportunity to have him train his replacement.
I'd love to train a replacement. I'd love to. We were supposed to get another ground-floor level guy in my field who I would train and have as an underling for awhile. This was supposed to begin this year but I've heard nothing of it yet.

Originally Posted by ms244

Please say you aren't leaving the technical fields to become another ambulance chaser......

Yeah, ms, leaving Engineering for Patent/IP law. I love engineering but I can't do things I'd like to do, and I won't have good prospects for that freedom for 10 years or so. Life has taken from me so much freedom and so much time so far -- I am so far behind and I don't want to wait ten years to get where I want to be. As it is eng is getting increasingly outsourced -- lots of firms or sending product development to 'job shops' overseas where they can throw 50 engineers, draftsmen, and analysts at a problem and deliver a customized solution. The attrition of 'old economy' jobs is catching up to professionals now; I am looking ahead. That said, if my firm would entertain a 20% bump, I'd be tempted. Strongly tempted. ~ H

 

[ms244]

When any one says something about the decline of America I will point out the pay discrepancy
between an engineer (not a person) and a lawyer (supposedly a respected person).


Let me know when you pass the bar, I have an idea for a printing press that puts out $20s. By that time printing your own money should be legal

Good luck with your endevaour.

 

[GQgeek]

Originally Posted by ms244

When any one says something about the decline of America I will point out the pay discrepancy
between an engineer (not a person) and a lawyer (supposedly a respected person).


Let me know when you pass the bar, I have an idea for a printing press that puts out $20s. By that time printing your own money should be legal

Good luck with your endevaour.

Are average salaries that different? Around here we tend to compare everything to biglaw and ibanking, but the average attorney doesn't earn a biglaw salary. What do project managers are airbus or boeing get? I can't imagine that the guy that did the a380 program didn't get high six or 7 figures and some really nice equity.

You are certainly right though. Technical types get treated/compensated poorly in general, despite the highly advanced skills and specialized knowledge required in some fields. I can't imagine how patent law won't be totally dull though. My eyes would bleed doing that for 80-90/hrs a week. Hunts, you may earn more money, but you certainly won't have more freedom if you take the tier1>biglaw track. I mean look at foo... He doesn't wear anything but blue shirts!

 

[ms244]

Project manager on a power project (according to my friend in the nuke buisiness) can earn around 150K-200k including all bonus. THATS THE TOP and probably the heighest paid in the power buisiness. And you are on the road a lot.

Supposedly you can make more if you go to Iraq or Afghanistan.

Regular engineers are in the $60-80K range from what I've seen.

Compare starting salary of a (say) MIT engineer with a master's degree vs. MIT buisiness school.

Its not just the money, its respect too. For all the ability to build and create and run important projects, in most places (with some exceptions, Apple from what I hear) you are still a disposable cog in the machine. Without going into management, one can't advance.

When you go out to a bar and chat up some girl and mention that you are an engineer, they are suprised that at not seeing some dilbert clone.

Its not a respected profession, the sterotypical engineer is some kind of ugly, social outcast with poor hygene who resents society. Think connie but with book smarts and replace post count with the ability to solve math problems.

Yet everyone bitches that its 2009 and we still don't have cheap solar powered flying cars....

 

[GQgeek]

Originally Posted by ms244

Project manager on a power project (according to my friend in the nuke buisiness) can earn around 150K-200k including all bonus. THATS THE TOP and probably the heighest paid in the power buisiness. And you are on the road a lot.

Supposedly you can make more if you go to Iraq or Afghanistan.

Regular engineers are in the $60-80K range from what I've seen.

Compare starting salary of a (say) MIT engineer with a master's degree vs. MIT buisiness school.

Its not just the money, its respect too. For all the ability to build and create and run important projects, in most places (with some exceptions, Apple from what I hear) you are still a disposable cog in the machine. Without going into management, one can't advance.

When you go out to a bar and chat up some girl and mention that you are an engineer, they are suprised that at not seeing some dilbert clone.

Its not a respected profession, the sterotypical engineer is some kind of ugly, social outcast with poor hygene who resents society. Think connie but with book smarts and replace post count with the ability to solve math problems.

Yet everyone bitches that its 2009 and we still don't have cheap solar powered flying cars....

That's disgraceful (seriously). I knew the middle guys got ****, but had no idea the top guys were so horribly paid, especially when you factor in the calamity that could ensue if someone building a nuclear plant doesn't do their job properly.

And I'm putting the conne thing in my sig.

 

[ms244]

I'm honored?

 

[Connemara]

Show me the respek I deserve!

 

[ms244]

Should I link to your facebook thread?

For all the times people have tried to help you out on this forum, you just get worse and worse.


I should have added some passing remark to the blatant alcoholism in engineering and connie as well.

 

[Connemara]

Originally Posted by ms244

Should I link to your facebook thread? For all the times people have tried to help you out on this forum, you just get worse and worse. I should have added some passing remark to the blatant alcoholism in engineering and connie as well.
I don't drink anymore. I'm glad you've never entertained the idea that I'm stringing some of you jackalopes along.

 

[DNW]

Originally Posted by Huntsman

Whoa, bro. If I could financially take a few months off I wouldn't be going to law school. Part of the reasons I'm changing jobs is to try and find something that will grant me some freedom on my off time -- to travel and to do things like that.

Whoa, bro. You think you're gonna take a vacation any time soon? 3 years of law school = little or no time off, unless you take a chunk of time in the summer to do that. Studying for the bar = no time off. First couple of years out of law school working like a slave to rack up your billables? Haha...don't think so, man.

Seriously, if you think the law business will give you a lot of time off to travel and stuff, you might want to rethink whether your expectations are too high.

 

[gnatty8]

Originally Posted by ms244

When any one says something about the decline of America I will point out the pay discrepancy
between an engineer (not a person) and a lawyer (supposedly a respected person).

Yes, very sad indeed..