I got C plus in my easiest class!!

[celery]

There's a saying for this . . . "If you want something done right, you have to do it yourself."


Seriously, there is no such thing as a group project. There is a project in which you come prepared having done everything yourself, or there is a project that fails.

Always do the work on your own, and never make it known to the other people in your "group". This way you're covered if everyone else didn't pull their weight. And if they did do their work, then oh well, at least you have a safety net.

 

[rdawson808]

Originally Posted by Orsini

Very serious.

Why not?

Because you have no legal grounds for suing. The terms of the class are laid out at the beginning of class in the syllabus (not legally binding, btw) and the appeals process is laid out in the college's rules (legallly binding). As long as proper procedure was followed, there's nothing you can do. And that "proper procedure" oftentimes means appealing to the prof, then appealing to the dept chair, then the dean or provost, then to a committee maybe. At virtually everyone of these steps they will defer to the prof unless there is a gross error. Which there wasn't.

b

 

[Orsini]

Originally Posted by Connemara

LOL. I bet most college students have a team of attorneys on retainer.
Yes, this can cost a lot real fast! I went through some rounds of legal saber-rattling a while back with a "business partner". It cost a lot of money (by my standards) but I did get my last fall-back position and, I assure you, the other party, who is an established part of the business community around here, will never forget me!

 

[kwilkinson]

Originally Posted by Orsini

Yes, this can cost a lot real fast!

I went through some rounds of legal saber- rattling a while back with a "business partner". It cost a lot of money (by my standards) but I did get my last fall-back position and, I assure you, the other party, who is an established part of the business community around here, will never forget me!

You're right, he'll always remember you as the prick that he wouldn't recommend anyone to work with. Looks like you just built a great bridge for your future.

 

[gdl203]

Originally Posted by rdawson808

As a former prof, I would suggest NOT doing the first part of (a), or (b), (c) or (f).

Do (a) present firm evidence of how you tried to lead the tean to get the interviews done (by showing emails where you were assured that interviews would be done by others and they never were) but were thwarted and present a break-down of how work was split-up, (d) show your excellent grades as evidence that something seems amiss here, (e) ask if it is possible to rewrite the existing paper (if there was one).

The first part of (a) and suggestion (b) both sound a bit whiney to me. How did you know the group wouldn't work on day 1? Everyone assumes (c). Don't expect (f) to happen. You had your assignments, I'm not inclined to develop yet another one and grade it for you.

And for the record, I also find it very important to let all members of any group project evaluate themselves and their teammates in confidence.

b

Of course I fully defer to your judgment from the other side of the table, but (f) certainly happens. Pretty often actually. Happened to me once and happened to my classmates at multiple occasions. I guess it depends on the prof...

 

[Orsini]

Originally Posted by rdawson808

Because you have no legal grounds for suing. The terms of the class are laid out at the beginning of class in the syllabus (not legally binding, btw) and the appeals process is laid out in the college's rules (legallly binding). As long as proper procedure was followed, there's nothing you can do. And that "proper procedure" oftentimes means appealing to the prof, then appealing to the dept chair, then the dean or provost, then to a committee maybe. At virtually everyone of these steps they will defer to the prof unless there is a gross error. Which there wasn't. b
All right. That is good input. I concede. You know, I did not have any legal grounds for jerking around my "business partner" that I mentioned in the other post, and my lawyer pointed this out to me. However, we agreed to do it anyway. In the end, I got what I wanted, I got my pound of flesh, my "business partner" will not forget, and I also enjoyed it.

 

[imageWIS]

Originally Posted by Connemara

LOL. I bet most college students have a team of attorneys on retainer.

What you don't?

I guess it pays to be a law student; your friends can help you write briefs and do depositions.

Jon.

 

[Orsini]

Originally Posted by kwilkinson

You're right, he'll always remember you as the prick that he wouldn't recommend anyone to work with.
Exactly. At least one not to be crossed in a business deal.

Originally Posted by kwilkinson

Looks like you just built a great bridge for your future.
What I have done works for my situation. I do not care of my business associates like me and I cannot afford to be thought of as a pushover. I need others in the local business community here to respect me, to know that I do not welch on a deal, and to know that I am not to be trifled with. What I have described in my other post has helped me do this. If you let people step on you then they will. If you do onto others plus the XVIII Airborne Corps, the word gets around...

 

[Coho]

When I was an undergrad, I hated group projects, especially those where the grade is based on the final product (presentation, final proposal, etc.) The very nature of group work defies human nature and modern theories of incentives. It's a lot like communism in practice in that there will always be those who work hard and those who coattail for a free ride when the reward is evenly distributed. Group work, therefore, is very un-American as it does not foster independence and self-reliance. Sigh....one C is not going to hurt you in the long run so just hang in there. Grad schools don't look at your individual grade but at your ***. GPA so don't worry too much at this point. Those douches will all work for you one day pal, don't worry.

Originally Posted by imageWIS

Indeed, and I have 3 group projects in 3 of my classes this semester. Sigh...

Jon.

 

[Coho]

You may be surprised what a legal counselor can do. Someone played a prank on me during Junior year by banging on my door really loud at 3 am for 4 days straight and leave opened bottles of alcohol in front of my door. This is so that when I open my door to check, I will have alcohol spilled all over the carpet. On the 5th day, I set up a camera and with the help of my legal counselor constructed a draft of disciplinarian actions demanded of the residential dean. The kid (turned out to be a ****** living on the same floor) got suspended for a whole quarter and 2 strikes by the Student Senate before full expulsion.

Originally Posted by Connemara

LOL. I bet most college students have a team of attorneys on retainer.

 

[Orsini]

Originally Posted by Coho

You may be surprised what a legal counselor can do...
This might be an angle to play...

Originally Posted by Coho

... opened bottles of alcohol in front of my door. This is so that when I open my door to check, I will have alcohol spilled all over the carpet...
Too bad that booze could not be recovered.

Originally Posted by Coho

The kid (turned out to be a ****** living on the same floor) got suspended for a whole quarter and 2 strikes by the Student Senate before full expulsion.
"All's well that ends well". I always liked a happy ending. Good for you!

 

[Piobaire]

Originally Posted by EL72

In my senior year of undergrad b-school strategy course, I bought a bottle of scotch for each of my team members as a substitute for doing any work on the group project. How's that for GPAPH?

And here is a hint for some of you: always give your presentation last and always have a notebook that can burn CDs with you. Just ******* steal and adapt the best **** from each presentation before you on the fly, burn a fresh CD (or two..or three) right there in class. That's what I always did and it also increased my GPAPH (TM).

 

[Coho]

legal counselor= my uncle, and what I did not know was that my uncle and the dean when to the same school (my school) and knew each other from Crew many years back. Yes, it was a happy ending. Although, my uncle did not tell me this at the time. He was a judicious man: you don't want people to call the arbitrator "biased"

Originally Posted by Orsini

This might be an angle to play...
Too bad that booze could not be recovered.
"All's well that ends well". I always liked a happy ending. Good for you!

 

[Dewey]

Originally Posted by Piobaire

In MBA talk, look on it as a balanced score card approach

We realized that if you were in the top 10% of your class, who gave a damn between the 99th percentile and the 89th? No one. What is means is, if I get a 93 and you get a 94, but I put in two hours and you put in 50, I win.

This is dumbass talk. Grades are one of the most overrated things. Only a dumbass would make the final grade the ultimate goal of a college course. You should invent and trademark a new formula that divides total learning by tuition dollars. Then you could brag about it and not sound like a dumbass.

 

[Piobaire]

Originally Posted by Dewey

This is dumbass talk. Grades are one of the most overrated things. Only a dumbass would make the final grade the ultimate goal of a college course.

I think what would really be dumbass is to completely not comprehend a series of posts and then think I was criticizing the poster when in fact all I did was agree with him.