How important is it to you? Nice but generic fabric vs. Loro Piana, Cerruti, Zegna,

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by acidicboy

are buyers really conscious about the exclusivity of the fabrics of the top brands?

Some people apparently think so since there are so many generic suits flashing "Fabric by Loro Piana" or what have you... and just look at ebay - for years so many unsuspecting and ignorant people purchase "Zegna Suits" when it's only got a "Cloth by Zegna" label on them. I was just asking what you guys on here thought and felt.

 

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by letmebefell

I'm more concerned about fit than fabric. Only FNB is going to notice the fabric selection; anyone can tell that the fit's off.

As always, fit is paramount, of course - that is assumed - especially in this forum!

 

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by A Guy from Shanghai

Let me play devil's advocate. In general, it looks stupid to say that fabric brand is very important, and is more important than its actual quality. In reality, because of the nature of online purchasing (one can not feel and touch), I found myself would cling to relying on the brand of the fabric. That way, at least I would know the fabric is somewhat decent. Or unless I buy Borrelli, Isaia, and etc, that I can safely assume the manufacturers wouldn't cut corners on the fabrics.

I can appreciate this point of view. Hopefully the vendor (in this case, us at eHaberdasher) has a liberal enough return policy to make the purchasing process comfortable for the customer.

 

[mack11211]

Personally, I don't care what the label is.

How will it feel?

How will it wear?

Of course, touch is the one thing lacking in the online experience. As compensation, we get detailed pix (including closeups) and the comfort of brand names.

If the mills up their promo budgets, even the ones that don't make clothing as well will continue to see their name recognition rise.

More people are using mill names lately. Labels are easier to understand than quality of make. J Crew is using mill labels on tweeds, or did last year.

Polo and a few other makers still refuse to make them, because of the suggestion that if you have to use a mill label, you are compensating for some lack of quality in the tailoring.

 

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by binge

That's the rub. If buying from someplace online, then I have no way to evaluate the quality of the fabric other than maybe guess from how it looks in a photo, or by relying on brand name. Unless of course you're willing to send out swatches to people.

The swatch idea is interesting - we will definitely consider that. We were actually thinking of offering some kind of free shipping promotion for our suits, including free return shipping - thus a risk-free transaction for the customer and the customer not only touches the fabric, but actually gets to try the garment on. After all, as it's already been well established on this forum, fit is of chief importance.

 

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by Sator

I find that they are poor value, of variable quality, and their designs sometimes of questionable taste. They lack the solidity and body I demand from a cloth, and are too lightly woven with rather loose weave settings to give them a gutless fluffiness to seduce the unwary who ooh and aah at such flimsiness, mistaking it for luxury.

I never touch their offerings. Ever.

Interesting point of view. I would argue, however, that you are in the minority. Most people today, myself included, like a garment that is smooth and silky in a higher grade wool. Yes, perhaps they are more delicate, but the feel is wonderful. Take cashmere for example (of course there are varying levels of quality) - cashmere in general is more delicate than most basic wool yarns, but when offered the choice between a shetland sweater vs. a cashmere sweater, 99% of the population would choose cashmere, no? The same seems to go for the fine suiting fabrics. While this may not be an exact apples to apples correlation, I believe this is how most people would perceive it.

 

[Sator]

Originally Posted by eHaberdasher

Interesting point of view. I would argue, however, that you are in the minority. Most people today, myself included, like a garment that is smooth and silky in a higher grade wool. Yes, perhaps they are more delicate, but the feel is wonderful.
Amongst those of us who prefer to bespeak our clothes of a tailor, you will find it is the majority view. A local tailor who posts here as Ethandesu recently mentioned that he is using H Lesser for some of the RTW coats being made for his company (an Aussie brand called Herringbone) and Aussie forum members are going crazy over it with enthusiasm. I suspect that forum members are over seeing the cheesy "Super Gazillion Cloth by Zegna" etc on RTW garments, but are usually reduced to sitting back and watching helplessly as Manton, Dopey, Will Iammatt, and others gush with enthusiasm for the Harrisons and Lessers cloths they choose for their bespoke suits (while often ridiculing super cloths). Manton writes things like this: http://www.american.com/archive/2007...ver-super-wool However, all but those of us who go the bespoke route have any chance of doing anything about it. FNB is one of the few who enthuses about super cloths but then again, he usuallys opts for the more solidly woven supers from Harrisons and Lesser. BTW I too like a smooth finish, not a cardboard like finish. It is just that I demand that the cloth have great solidity to the weave, rather than this nonsense of making spongy, tissue paper light cloths for the sake of seducing the ill informed into buying poorly woven cloth with a faux luxury feel. Also I suspect that loose weave settings mean they need to use less wool, which is cheaper for them to make. In any case, I have gone on enough. If you feel that you are under overwhelming commercial pressure to offer "Super Gazillion by Zegna/Barberis" etc like everyone else then I suggest you just ignore me and go with the flow. I have all of my coats custom made so I am not in the market for RTW anyway.

 

[Flambeur]

Haha, was just looking at $400 Nordstroms Loro Piana Super 120s suit at Nordstrom Rack.. didn't like the cut, too conservative and didn't look right at all. .

 

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by Sator

Amongst those of us who prefer to bespeak our clothes of a tailor, you will find it is the majority view.

A local tailor who posts here as Ethandesu recently mentioned that he is using H Lesser for some of the RTW coats being made for his company (an Aussie brand called Herringbone) and Aussie forum members are going crazy over it with enthusiasm. I suspect that forum members are over seeing the cheesy "Super Gazillion Cloth by Zegna" etc on RTW garments, but are usually reduced to sitting back and watching helplessly as Manton, Dopey, Will Iammatt, and others gush with enthusiasm for the Harrisons and Lessers cloths they choose for their bespoke suits (while often ridiculing super cloths).

Manton writes things like this:

http://www.american.com/archive/2007...ver-super-wool

However, all but those of us who go the bespoke route have any chance of doing anything about it. FNB is one of the few who enthuses about super cloths but then again, he usuallys opts for the more solidly woven supers from Harrisons and Lesser.

BTW I too like a smooth finish, not a cardboard like finish. It is just that I demand that the cloth have great solidity to the weave, rather than this nonsense of making spongy, tissue paper light cloths for the sake of seducing the ill informed into buying poorly woven cloth with a faux luxury feel. Also I suspect that loose weave settings mean they need to use less wool, which is cheaper for them to make.

In any case, I have gone on enough. If you feel that you are under overwhelming commercial pressure to offer "Super Gazillion by Zegna/Barberis" etc like everyone else then I suggest you just ignore me and go with the flow. I have all of my coats custom made so I am not in the market for RTW anyway.

I greatly appreciate and respect your post, and you certainly don't need me to validate your comments. I agree that the super xxx's is played to a sickening extreme. And while we will be offering some super 150's, most of the fabrics will be 120's and 140's - if you even care to see a #. Out of curiosity, any idea how much Harrisons and Lesser charges per meter?

 

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by Flambeur

Haha, was just looking at $400 Nordstroms Loro Piana Super 120s suit at Nordstrom Rack.. didn't like the cut, too conservative and didn't look right at all. .

I know Saks outlets is pedaling Zegna cloth suits for $499.99 that are absolutely horrendous.

 

[Gus]

No Name apparel often flaunts a big name cloth but it usually isn't anything special. It is as though they are trying to make up for a mediocre product by using an impressive mill name.

 

[Sator]

Originally Posted by eHaberdasher

Out of curiosity, any idea how much Harrisons and Lesser charges per meter?
The great thing about their cloths is that they usually cost less than Scabal and Zegna - or even H&S. If it is a non-super then they are even more cost effective. I would tentatively suggest that forum members here have been sufficiently educated by Manton et al about H Lesser/Harrisons that they would be happy to pay less to get a non-super suit with a label saying "Cloth by H Lesser" or "Harrisons of Edinburgh". Pay less, get more: that is what most of us bespoke costumers do with cloth, and I think the well educated RTW buyers might be willing to following us down the same route.

 

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by Sator

The great thing about their cloths is that they usually cost less than Scabal and Zegna - or even H&S. If it is a non-super then they are even more cost effective.

I would tentatively suggest that forum members here have been sufficiently educated by Manton et al about H Lesser/Harrisons that they would be happy to pay less to get a non-super suit with a label saying "Cloth by H Lesser" or "Harrisons of Edinburgh".

Pay less, get more: that is what most of us bespoke costumers do with cloth, and I think the well educated RTW buyers might be willing to following us down the same route.

I briefly took a quick look at Harrisons' website:

http://www.lbd-harrisons.com/

Is Huddersfield under the Harrison umbrella (note the photo with Huddersfield cloth)? Just curious as we have had several Brioni suits made with Huddersfield fabrics.

 

[Sator]

Huddersfield is where a lot of the cloth merchants and mills are based. It doesn't necessarily mean they are owned by a larger group called "Huddersfield". J&J Minnis are also Huddersfield/West Yorkshire based, as are Edwin Woodhouse.

http://www.hfw-huddersfield.co.uk/hardyminnis/index.asp

 

[eHaberdasher]

Originally Posted by Sator

Huddersfield is where a lot of the cloth merchants and mills are based. It doesn't necessarily mean they are owned by a larger group called "Huddersfield". J&J Minnis are also Huddersfield/West Yorkshire based, as are Edwin Woodhouse.

http://www.hfw-huddersfield.co.uk/hardyminnis/index.asp

My understanding was that Huddersfield was the name of a town, but I thought it was also the actual name of a cloth manufacturer. So, just to clarify, just because a cloth will say "Huddersfield", it doesn't necessarily mean it is from the Huddersfield mill? That doesn't make much sense to me... perhaps I'm simply too obtuse.