Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by doughboysc, Oct 3, 2004.
Excellent, we have confirmation.
While I also believe that it is very important that everyone behave in a civil and courteous manner, we should not extend that goal to the hyperbolic extreme that it overshadows our common sense (e.g. the sanctimonius newbie who just had to sign up and post to shake his head at our uncouth ruffianism).
There are a lot of strange behavioral traits of this poster that make his legitimacy questionable:
1. He posts the same creepy, exaggerated picture in every thread, regardless of whether it has any relevance.
2. He starts threads with extremely simplistic questions that any legitimate user could have found the answer to by reading this forum for 4-5 minutes (e.g. the Darren's prices thread).
3. Also note the total randomness of his thread topics, which seem to come out of left field when compared to the last. On one hand he's a high school kid who wants to pay only $150 for a suit (the mysuitshop thread), and then he claims he's trying to turn his wardrobe into Saville Row.
4. He only starts threads and runs; he doesn't reply in other threads or respond to replies in his own ones, even to the ones that call into question his legitimacy.
5. The need to keep reminding us of his real name, age, and his alleged autism. Sorry, but I've seen my fair of autistic people posting on the larger message boards I frequent, and none of them writes like an inept idiot in their posts. I'm not claiming to know anything about autism, but my impression is that the behavioral traits associated with it are much more linked to face to face settings rather than detached forms of communication like the internet.
I think something clearly is amiss here, which is why Mike C. and others have been suspicious of this guy almost right away after he started posting. His comments may be hostile, but he's a great poster and a forum veteran, and I have to say that I sympathize with him here.
I don't mean to be rude now, but even if, by some chance, this guy is legit and not a gimmick account (which I don't think the South Carolina IP answers entirely), I still don't think that gives him carte blanche to act like a bumbling fool and make content-void posts that are akin to spam in their disruptiveness. Would it be all right if one of us started posting in caveman talk or ran our posts through a jive-talk filter? I'm not trying to backseat moderate here, but I think there are pretty understandable reasons why a good deal of members here have found this guy annoying and suspicious, and it would be appreciated if this guy were at the very least asked to take the time and learn the minimal basics of message board use before subjecting us to his posts.
So I'm a "sanctimonius newbie"? I can live with that. However, I've been following the Style Forum for some time now so I have a pretty good sense of the tenor and substance of this forum. I initially came across the Style Forum and Ask Andy about the same time and had to make a decision about where to participate. I've been a regular over at Ask Andy for about a year because the topics there were a better fit for me. I do know that many Ask Andy members cross post here so I thought I would check out the Style Forum and perhaps start contributing what little I could and to see how the answers to some of the cross posted questions differed between the forums.
My point is this: if Spencer Karter is such an annoyance, don't bother to open up his threads, and if you do, don't bother to respond. I don't think the appearance of one of his topics should cause any more agita than the drone of messages asking if a particular item on Ebay is a fake or which suit is the "best" or whether or not to wear cowboy boots or any of the other threads that come up with surprising regularity without any apparent effort put into a simple archive search.
Furthermore, while I think it is fine to question whether or not a person is in fact a troll, personal attacks have a chilling effect on forums. That Dr. Bresch has continued to post given some of the attacks he has weathered is a testament to both his character and his interest in the subject. So why make it any more difficult for a person to feel welcome and to ask questions? Finally, say I wanted to post a picture of myself wearing a suit and tie I particularly liked? What's my motivation? To gain maybe a little constructive criticism mixed with personal invective? These forums aren't supposed to be Candyland but they also shouldn't be carte blanche to say things that you would never dare say to a person's face. To my knowledge, Spencer Karter has never personally insulted anyone in a forum and deserves the same respect in return.
Well said. To the poster who believes Spencer's picture came from www.uglypeople.com - trust me, he's not half as ugly as the mean-spirited attitude you've shown each and every time Spencer posts.
Not trying to be a jerk, but to put it this way: if you're going to act melodramatic and make some sweeping claim about the forum and its members, you have to have some sort of standing here to be taken seriously. No offense, but I just don't think anyone here is going to be shaken to change his behavior radically by the revelation that someone who has never posted or participated in any threads here before has decided that he doesn't like the forum and will never post again. I respect your right to voice your displeasure, but I object to your apparent attempt to lecture all of us here and insinuate that just the threat of your leaving should scare us straight, so to speak. I see your point, but I think your expression of it was more inflammatory than informative.
As to "Spencer's" behavior, I don't think it matters whether or not he is malicious, his posts are just content-void and irritating. It's not just that he posts pictures and asks previously answered questions, it's his whole "village idiot" act that is distracting and annoying. To take your example of Dr. Bresch, the difference is that he a) takes the time to write his posts articulately and intelligently, b) starts threads and posts pictures on different topics each time instead of starting 4-5 threads on the same basic question (and using the same old pic again and again), and c) actually responds and gets involved with his posts instead of just starting empty threads and abandoning them.
Pretty much every established forum has some sort of rules asking for a minimal level of competence in posting so as to prevent noise from clogging the boards. For example, one large forum I frequent has a strict policy of banning users who post excessively in AOL-speak or start "HEY GUYS LOOK AT ME IM NEW" threads, and it has significantly helped improve the content of the boards. As I said earlier, would it be ok for me to post threads in caveman-speak or run through a novelty language filter if I didn't insult anyone? I hardly think "don't write like an idiot" is an unreasonable or dangerous prerequsite for posting.
I hate to get involved in threads like these, but I think that despite Mike C.'s visible annoyance and hostility, he has a valid point, and it's frustrating to see people gang up on him because of an obsession with decorum that does seem to be overriding common sense.
Unfortunately, I'm probably more familiar with the behavorial traits of autistic individuals than most of you, and find Spencer's admittedly random and repetitive posts consistent with autism. Autistic individuals simply can't properly adapt their communications to their milieu-rigidity and lack of empathy are very common and obviously prove irritating to others. Although it's tempting to play detective (to make the "problem" go away because it's a fake), it's probably more appropriate to either adhere to the genteel code of conduct that Huntsman wisely espouses or, if you don't want to handle the interaction, not to reply at all.
And lets not forget that he first started posting that "eerie photo" when prompted to do so, being told that "we couldnt help him unless we saw what he looked like". Once you start that with an autistic individual its not that easy to stop.
I am with Huntsman and stylestudent. You dont like him as with authentic trolls, just ignore.
I apologize for the lecture and the melodrama. I don't humor myself that my "threat" to leave would change anyone's conduct. My larger concern that how forum members treat people they disagree with or treat people that some members, for whatever reason, choose not to like, has an influence on whether or not others will want to participate in a forum, remains in effect. It is a sad day when criticism of boorish behavior and a plea for respect is discounted because someone hasn't posted enough to a forum to be taken seriously, especially in a forum that occasionally expresses concern over the decline in manners and respect.
I'm going to lock this thread. J and I will come up with a policy for Spencer, but he has violated no rules...So why ban him?
Whilst I can understand Mike C.'s frustration and cannot negate his positive involvement on the forum, there are better ways of dealing with problems than blatant insults. Point / counterpoint is the best way to explain ones thoughts without lowering the level of oneself to the lowest possible denominator.
Regarding posts that infuriate you, there are two other viable options to consider: ignore the post or PM Steve B and / or J and let them know about the post.
Ok, so I was a bit harsh. However my initial gripe was that some other new posters on here have gotten a hard time when they didn't deserve it (@riss, and the guy on the "shoe color with navy suit thread", and this Spencer Karter guy hasn't gotten any flack even though his posts are ridiculous.
Just because his posts do come from SC dosn't mean he's real. I'm sure Kalra's posts came from London as well. And that picture in EVERY thread he posts... come on.
He reminds me of Josh on MM forum, except Josh was funny, this guy is annoying. Aybojs also brought up valid points. I throughly back everything he says in this thread.
PS. I didn't intend to insult anyone. I've NEVER gotten into a flamewar on this board and don't intend to do so in the future. So let's end it here. It's up to J and Steve to decide from here on in.
thanks for the recognition, mike c. i thought this thread was locked so i ended up starting a different one instead of first trying to respond here. anyway, i personally agree that spencer karter has got to be a fake and it would make everybody look kind of foolish to seriously give him advice on how to save for a suit, lol. i was just reading the helmut lang/ tom ford thread and it was hilarious when one member complemented the "designer", telling him one of his favorite suits was a 2-button lang he picked up at marshal's or some such place. it is asking alot to tell somebody to suspend judgment and respond to such posts earnestly.
I have a real problem with poking fun at a member who has told you that he has a disability.
I was going to avoid this thread at all costs, though before I did, I just did a simple google search on Spencer. Turns out, he posts on a lot (and I mean A LOT) of message boards. He's a big fan of the television program "Dark Shadows." Matter of fact, he's a big fan of a lot of older tv shows. He gets a lot of enjoyment out of bulletin boards (as do we all) and has a very unique posting style. The guy has a good memory for detail, as evidence by his posts on other boards. His birthday, apparently, is coming up in November. He'll be 19.
I also was able to find his yahoo member profile site. The picture is posted there.
Gentlemen, I believe, as I did before, that Spencer is legit. I hope he doesn't leave the board, because I found his posts enjoyable and enjoyed being part of a board/community that would welcome his participation.
Where has he said that he has autism? Why won't he clarify or respond to his posts? Again Aybojs brought up very valid points.
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