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How about modern rich Russian style?

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Artisan Fan, Aug 22, 2007.

  1. RJman

    RJman Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Since the Norman invasion ,the English language has been heavily influenced by the French language....
    Not denying that, but English is a Germanic language... and French might be too if it weren't for us, Frenchie, so watch it! (j/k)
     
  2. Lucky Strike

    Lucky Strike Senior member

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    Russian phonetically is not a roman language. English is, since english is nothing but mangled French and French is roman language. Therefore anyone who sepaks roman language will have very similar difficulties learning Russian, which is not a roman language. Therefore asking :"Are you Brits have easier tiome learning Russian than us Latin?" makes no sence.
    English is patently not a latin or roman language, but germanic, albeit with a lot of words and phrases borrowed from Greek, Latin and French. I agree that learning Russian would probably be equally difficult for a Frenchman or a brit.
     
  3. dkzzzz

    dkzzzz Senior member

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    Since the Norman invasion ,the English language has been heavily influenced by the French language....
    Sorry to upset the Anglo-Saxon mindset regarding worldwide language domination but that is a fact...

    We can also point out the Roman influence during the Roman occupation and their influences on how local tribes speak and express themselves....

    My question was broader than that....If you talk grammar ,Spanish is closer to French than English is....
    My sister told me how difficult was to learn Mandarin and Russian...
    I just wanted to have an inside view on Russian from a Anglo-Saxon point of view...


    Not to mentioned French kings were ruling that island for centuries and French knights brought some sort of culture to those barbaric leftovers of Celts.
    Without French culture Britain would still speak some sort of Celtic dialect.
     
  4. Lucky Strike

    Lucky Strike Senior member

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    Not to mentioned French kings were ruling that island for centuries and French knights brought some sort of culture to those barbaric leftovers of Celts. Without French culture Briatin would still speak some sort of Celtic dialect.
    The UK is arguably still occupied by the Norman French, and has been since 1066. [​IMG] Without the French-Norman influence, the predominant language in the UK would probably be English, or to be specific, Anglo-Saxon.
    Now, can we please return to slagging off the nouveaux riches, please?
     
  5. Teacher

    Teacher Senior member

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    Are you serious? You think Anglo-Saksons use different language than Latins? It is the same Latin just more mangled.

    Huh???
     
  6. Trent Aldonado

    Trent Aldonado Active Member

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    Are you serious? You think Anglo-Saksons use different language than Latins? It is the same Latin just more mangled.

    Huh???

    I have a few friends who are Ph.D. linguists who also believe that English is a latin language. Of course, they are likely wrong as these two are about many other things. They are, however, able to come up with compelling arguments. Perhaps not compelling, but more cogent than "Huh???".
     
  7. Teacher

    Teacher Senior member

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    Russian phonetically is not a roman language. English is, since english is nothing but mangled French and French is roman language.
    Therefore anyone who sepaks roman language will have very similar difficulties learning Russian, which is not a roman language.
    Therefore asking :"Are you Brits have easier tiome learning Russian than us Latin?" makes no sence.


    Since the Norman invasion ,the English language has been heavily influenced by the French language....
    Sorry to upset the Anglo-Saxon mindset regarding worldwide language domination but that is a fact...

    We can also point out the Roman influence during the Roman occupation and their influences on how local tribes speak and express themselves....

    My question was broader than that....If you talk grammar ,Spanish is closer to French than English is....
    My sister told me how difficult was to learn Mandarin and Russian...
    I just wanted to have an inside view on Russian from a Anglo-Saxon point of view...


    Ahem. Let's look at this from a historical-linguistic point of view. Norman French (certainly not Parisian French) -- which itself was heavily influenced by Old Norse, since it was they who conquered and established Normandy in the first place -- certainly did influence English. However, only courtisans spoke Norman...the common person probably knew a few words and that's it. Because of this, the Norman influence on English was at the lexical level only, and most words introduced had to do with law/government, food, and bodily functions/parts. They were also content words, not functors. Because over 99% of the Anglo-Saxon populace did not speak Norman, English syntax, morphology, and pronunciation were completely untouched and evolved seperately. This is extremely typical of vulgates that exist in a diglossia: the "upper crust" ignores them, they take on vocabulary but nothing else, and eventually the "upper crust" switches over to them anyway.

    ADDENDUM: I forgot about lasbar's comment on Roman influence during their occupation. The Romans influenced the Celts (again, lexically, not grammatically or phonetically); there were no Germanics on the islands at that point. Some time around 350-400 AD (there is contention about the date), the Romans withdrew from the British Isles. Germanics began trickling in somewhere around that time, and in 449 AD (again, give or take), a full-scale Germanic invasion had begun. Therefore, there was no contact there. Meanwhile, the Romans never managed to conquer what they called Germania; only the Burgundians and Goths -- both extinct East Germanic languages (English is West Germanic) -- came under their influence.
     
  8. Teacher

    Teacher Senior member

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    I have a few friends who are Ph.D. linguists who also believe that English is a latin language. Of course, they are likely wrong as these two are about many other things. They are, however, able to come up with compelling arguments. Perhaps not compelling, but more cogent than "Huh???".

    Then see my answer above. Your friends are most certainly wrong. A quick Google search will give you a good start; a trip to your local university library will give you a more complete picture.
     
  9. Admiral Cod

    Admiral Cod Well-Known Member

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    I have noticed the "gangster chic" look tends to prevail among Russian men, and so I see a lot of leather car coats and buzz cuts.
     
  10. gdl203

    gdl203 Senior member Dubiously Honored Affiliate Vendor

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    Scott Storch seems to be the best American representative of Russian nouveau riche style
     
  11. lasbar

    lasbar Senior member

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    English words ,in particular ,have been heavily influenced by French....

    The list is too long to give all of them and i'm not only talking of the obvious ones...
    Linguists friends told me that latin and French were the main influence.....

    Dieu et mon droit are on every British passports,that's maybe a clue....

    The French are also originated from the Francs tribe coming from Hungary and eastern Europe.....They have been invaded and influenced by the Romans and also by the norse ,Hungarians and so on...

    I know you would like to rewrite history but sorry guys the French has very heavily influenced the English language....

    Richard Lionheart did not speak a word of English and was using the place to finance his crusades....
    He is living in the south-west part of France ,Aquitaine ,domain of his mother Alienor...

    Sorry to the American but you're somewhere speaking a language influenced by the French ..Oh horror!!!!!
     
  12. JBZ

    JBZ Senior member

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    Sorry to the American but you're somewhere speaking a language influenced by the French ..Oh horror!!!!!

    Sorry to the French, but you're somewhere eating McDonald's and drinking Starbucks..Oh horror!!!!! [​IMG]
     
  13. odoreater

    odoreater Senior member

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    Do you people ever actually use the words "nouveau riche" in real life or is it something you just like to throw around on the internet?

    I swear, if I ever heard someone say "nouveau riche" in real life...


    EDIT: Oh, and, when I hear people speak French, I can't understand a word of what they are saying even though I speak English and various Slavic languages and can understand a good deal of Spanish.
     
  14. texas_jack

    texas_jack Senior member

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    Do you people ever actually use the words "nouveau riche" in real life or is it something you just like to throw around on the internet?

    I swear, if I ever heard someone say "nouveau riche" in real life...


    The only person I've heard use it in real life was talking about her own family.
     
  15. dkzzzz

    dkzzzz Senior member

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    Then see my answer above. Your friends are most certainly wrong. A quick Google search will give you a good start; a trip to your local university library will give you a more complete picture.

    Right right. So which word in English is Anglo-Saxson?
     
  16. Trent Aldonado

    Trent Aldonado Active Member

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    Do you people ever actually use the words "nouveau riche" in real life or is it something you just like to throw around on the internet?

    I swear, if I ever heard someone say "nouveau riche" in real life...


    EDIT: Oh, and, when I hear people speak French, I can't understand a word of what they are saying even though I speak English and various Slavic languages and can understand a good deal of Spanish.

    Generaly we will just say Nouveau, but the implication is the same. A spade a spade and all.
     
  17. Lucky Strike

    Lucky Strike Senior member

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    Do you people ever actually use the words "nouveau riche" in real life or is it something you just like to throw around on the internet?
    I use the phrase, or its Norwegian equivalent, frequently. My job is a lot about introducing new money to old art, so I find it a useful expression to describe where different contacts are "coming from". It's just sociology, get over it.
     
  18. Teacher

    Teacher Senior member

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    Grand Forks, ND, USA
    English words ,in particular ,have been heavily influenced by French....

    The list is too long to give all of them and i'm not only talking of the obvious ones...
    Linguists friends told me that latin and French were the main influence.....

    Dieu et mon droit are on every British passports,that's maybe a clue....

    The French are also originated from the Francs tribe coming from Hungary and eastern Europe.....They have been invaded and influenced by the Romans and also by the norse ,Hungarians and so on...

    I know you would like to rewrite history but sorry guys the French has very heavily influenced the English language....

    Richard Lionheart did not speak a word of English and was using the place to finance his crusades....
    He is living in the south-west part of France ,Aquitaine ,domain of his mother Alienor...

    Sorry to the American but you're somewhere speaking a language influenced by the French ..Oh horror!!!!!


    Right right. So which word in English is Anglo-Saxson?

    I can see you guys know absolutely nothing about linguistics, nor about language categorization. You just insult me and Americans, but provide no substancial arguments. First, lasbar, the Franks were Germanic. Charlamagne spoke Frankish, which was a Germanic language. I already said that some -- some -- words in modern English are from French. They are, however, not a majority. There are more English words of Germanic origin than of Norman origin. Even so, having some words of French origin does not make English a Romance language. You have completely ignored what I wrote about syntax, morphology, and phonetics/phonology and attacked me, saying I'm rewriting history.

    So you won't take my word for it. How about this? Maybe you guys can actually learn something.

    http://softrat.home.mindspring.com/germanic.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanic_languages

    http://www.ned.univie.ac.at/publicat...n/germaans.htm

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language

    http://ebbs.english.vt.edu/hel/hel.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History...glish_language

    http://www.m-w.com/help/faq/history.htm

    http://www.krysstal.com/english.html

    This took me just a few minutes, and that's just from Google. For books, you can look up the likes of Pyles and Algeo's Origins and Development of the English Language, Baugh's A History of the English Language, A Cultural History of English (forget the author's name), and The Story of English. For what many consider to be the definitive work on the subject, there's the outstanding but daunting Cambridge History of the English Language (8 volumes, I think).

    Now, find me one credible source -- just one -- that classifies English as a Romance language.
     
  19. dkzzzz

    dkzzzz Senior member

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    I can see you guys know absolutely nothing about linguistics, nor about language categorization. You just insult me and Americans, but provide no substancial arguments. First, lasbar, the Franks were Germanic. Charlamagne spoke Frankish, which was a Germanic language. I already said that some -- some -- words in modern English are from French. They are, however, not a majority. There are more English words of Germanic origin than of Norman origin. Even so, having some words of French origin does not make English a Romance language. You have completely ignored what I wrote about syntax, morphology, and phonetics/phonology and attacked me, saying I'm rewriting history.

    So you won't take my word for it. How about this? Maybe you guys can actually learn something.

    http://softrat.home.mindspring.com/germanic.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanic_languages

    http://www.ned.univie.ac.at/publicat...n/germaans.htm

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language

    http://ebbs.english.vt.edu/hel/hel.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History...glish_language

    http://www.m-w.com/help/faq/history.htm

    http://www.krysstal.com/english.html

    This took me just a few minutes, and that's just from Google. For books, you can look up the likes of Pyles and Algeo's Origins and Development of the English Language, Baugh's A History of the English Language, A Cultural History of English (forget the author's name), and The Story of English. For what many consider to be the definitive work on the subject, there's the outstanding but daunting Cambridge History of the English Language (8 volumes, I think).

    Now, find me one credible source -- just one -- that classifies English as a Romance language.



    I give you one credible source: reality. The language spoken in GB or US has more French/Latin roots than Anglo/Saxon ones, thus making it Romanic/Latin based language.
     
  20. Teacher

    Teacher Senior member

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    I give you one credible source: reality. The language spoken in GB or US has more French/Latin roots than Anglo/Saxon ones, thus making it Romanic/Latin based language.

    Wow. RJman was right. You're an idiot.
     

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