HOF: What Are You Wearing Right Now - Part IV (starting May 2014)

[Betelgeuse]

A basic look with a fun surprise.

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Who makes those trousers?

 

[An Acute Style]

Who makes those trousers?

Vintage Polo Ralph Lauren.

 

[Betelgeuse]

Vintage Polo Ralph Lauren.

Nice! They fit great!

 

[Alan Bee]

In the spirit of giving and receiving critique I think that one of the major issues that some people react to when you give advice is that there is no humility, no context and not enough respect. Your views are expressed as absolute truths, usually with the same nuance that you would expect from a drill sergeant barking orders.

I count myself as one of your fans on SF. I think that your fits usually are excellent, I like your aesthetic and I also appreciate the fact that you share your journey and experience. But I would reject any notion of someone, including you, stumbling on some absolute truth for #menswear. I would dispute that such truth even exists, and if it does I haven't seen it yet. But you persist in hammering in your viewpoints in a way that I believe many people find grating. Not everyone share your aesthetic and style, not everyone have the means to design a wardrobe the way you have told us that you developed yours, and not everyone share your views on health and bodyshape.

There might be a million different reasons why a person is overweight, or a smoker, drinker or whatever we can do to hurt our bodies. But to expect that a person should (or even could) change their lifestyle because someone in an internet forum tells you to is not likely. And frankly it is disrespectful as well since you have no knowledge about the underlying reasons. That's probably why many reacted to Vic's comment, even if I'm sure he didn't mean it in that way.

Now and then someone in SF, usually a beginner, posts a fit that is just hopeless and impossible to defend. In such cases "tough love" can be a way forward. But in most cases advice is best given in dialogue and with a modicum of understanding and respect. As long as you persist in condemning everything that's not along the lines of your taste and your advice is always distributed in the form of orders, I doubt that you will find many takers of your advice. Which is a pity since you clearly have a wealth of experience and have gone through a long trial and error phase to get where you are today.

@DiplomaticTies

Thank you for your very well thought out response (and I'm not being polite).

That being said and while I'd love to engage you on a few points, we know what happens each time this subject comes up (the thread gets derailed).

Perhaps what one should really do when offering feedback on this forum is, bring along a very comfortable California King bed complete with a memory foam tempurpedic pillow. You know ...... just to ensure the subject is extremely comfortable, then proceed to feed critical feedback via a platinum plated drip-line (tongue in cheek).

As to your military drill sergeant reference, I did after all attend a boys military academy from age 12-18. I guess you can't quite take the bush out of the man ....

Thank you once more DT

Alan Bee

 

[Alan Bee]

@Alan Bee

I am an academic and debating is my trade. I even put forward a logical proposition so we could argue about it. Let me repeat it: "Here is a proposition that I could get behind and is more in line with your view: between badly cut full vs slim trousers, fullness is preferable."

Not only I was not that interested in "defending" my fit (which admittedly I did) but I wrote my comment to engage in a debate with you. I understand you choosing not to engage (maybe you found the proposition obvious or wrong) but find a bit baffling to come back and find that comment from you. But let me state that as @DiplomaticTies, I am a fan of your fits and that is unlikely to change (I am much less enamored of your choice of repeatedly go back to Naples for sartorial purposes: I keep coming back to drive around different parts of Italy because life is too short to visit Naples too many times, for whatever purpose. But "de gustibus etc etc".)

@bernoulli

What is wrong with Naples? I mean, there are so many beautiful places to see in Italy but if you want your motorcar fixed, you don't go to a barbershop.

I didn't miss your "subtle" invitation to debate your fit in the prior entry. But as I said to @DiplomaticTies above, we've been down this path before and usually it isn't long before trolls looking for a fight wade in, turning the debate into a circus for charlatans with nothing better to do.

I really do like your style, even if it is sometimes idiosyncratic (turn-back cuffs on your suit jackets and all). But when I see such an elegant figure, I can't help but wonder, "how can I make this man bring out the best in him".

Alan Bee

 

[Alan Bee]

I like learning. That's why I am still waiting to learn why belts aren't for grown men and double monks are infantile... But still no answer. ?‍♂️

@hoodog

I have taken great pains (with illustration) to acquit myself on both points. And since you raised them, please refer to the same archives.

Alan Bee

 

[Alan Bee]

If you had the balls.

@khughes44

I could have said that more succinctly but would be constrained to find fewer words.

Alan Bee

 

[Michael81]

If you had the balls.

I've gone toe to toe with Alan plenty of times in the past. But great post, good effort.

 

[Alan Bee]

Summer in the City.

Nothing like a good drape in your trousers boys ...

Alan Bee

 

[hoodog]

In the spirit of giving and receiving critique I think that one of the major issues that some people react to when you give advice is that there is no humility, no context and not enough respect. Your views are expressed as absolute truths, usually with the same nuance that you would expect from a drill sergeant barking orders.

I count myself as one of your fans on SF. I think that your fits usually are excellent, I like your aesthetic and I also appreciate the fact that you share your journey and experience. But I would reject any notion of someone, including you, stumbling on some absolute truth for #menswear. I would dispute that such truth even exists, and if it does I haven't seen it yet. But you persist in hammering in your viewpoints in a way that I believe many people find grating. Not everyone share your aesthetic and style, not everyone have the means to design a wardrobe the way you have told us that you developed yours, and not everyone share your views on health and bodyshape.

There might be a million different reasons why a person is overweight, or a smoker, drinker or whatever we can do to hurt our bodies. But to expect that a person should (or even could) change their lifestyle because someone in an internet forum tells you to is not likely. And frankly it is disrespectful as well since you have no knowledge about the underlying reasons. That's probably why many reacted to Vic's comment, even if I'm sure he didn't mean it in that way.

Now and then someone in SF, usually a beginner, posts a fit that is just hopeless and impossible to defend. In such cases "tough love" can be a way forward. But in most cases advice is best given in dialogue and with a modicum of understanding and respect. As long as you persist in condemning everything that's not along the lines of your taste and your advice is always distributed in the form of orders, I doubt that you will find many takers of your advice. Which is a pity since you clearly have a wealth of experience and have gone through a long trial and error phase to get where you are today.

Extremely well worded. Great post.

 

[EFV]

@DiplomaticTies

Thank you for your very well thought out response (and I'm not being polite).

That being said and while I'd love to engage you on a few points, we know what happens each time this subject comes up (the thread gets derailed).

Perhaps what one should really do when offering feedback on this forum is, bring along a very comfortable California King bed complete with a memory foam tempurpedic pillow. You know ...... just to ensure the subject is extremely comfortable, then proceed to feed critical feedback via a platinum plated drip-line (tongue in cheek).

As to your military drill sergeant reference, I did after all attend a boys military academy from age 12-18. I guess you can't quite take the bush out of the man ....

Thank you once more DT

Alan Bee

There are millions of acres of social wiggle room between cushioning someone and simply being a courteous person. Dig into someone's outfits as much as you like but leave everything else out. I remember you getting defensive at some point when money and personal funds were brought up in a discussion on menswear. I agreed with you there, because it's really not anyone else's business. Same thing goes for everything else that's not clothes related. Unless you have a personal connection with someone, don't bring up subjects that, in any civilized society, would be considered rude.

 

[Clouseau]

This all discussion started because a fat-phobic poster wrote an irrelevant post.
In every posts he wrote since, he has been sinking deeper and deeper. Imho, he should lie low...
Now i think it is not appropriate to fall into "Alan Bee bashing" again...
Please gents, post fits and forget the rest...

 

[samtalkstyle]

Things I have learned from the pictured outfit:

1. A wider leg pant really draws the eye to the overtightness of my jacket's fit.
2. I'm never wearing this polo under a jacket again, the collar disappears and makes it look more like a henley.

I do like the colour palette though.

 

[Michael81]

There's really no way around this: that jacket is an absolute disaster.

 

[samtalkstyle]

There's really no way around this: that jacket is an absolute disaster.

Most of mine are at the moment. I have only very recently (since joining SF) come into a proper understanding of fit in regard to tailored jackets, and my wardrobe has plenty of catching up to do.