High-quality JEANS

[Stylin-1]

Originally Posted by Bandwagonesque

My true waist is 80cm. I was going to size down to 78cm, but thought I'd play it safe incase they don't stretch out as much as I'd like. The 80s also look like they'd fit better in the thighs (mine are 22" around). I wish the hem was 8" instead of 8.4", but I'll deal with it. Grifters would crush my thighs.

Yeah I've leaned out the last couple months. Weighed myself yesterday at 159; haven't been this light in years. Waist is down to 30.75 from 31.5 and thighs are 21 from 21.75. I hope the 78's don't stretch much at all! I think I need to go eat....feeling kinda' faint.

 

[drake]

If I am not mistaken well done chainstitching uses two threads and won't unravel. On most well made jeans it will be done like this. To be quite honest it doesn't seem APC or AW are really comparable. They seem completely different beasts, constructed differently and pretty different fits/aesthetics. Just rock what looks good on you!

Originally Posted by denimdestroyedmylife

chainstitching isn't everything in fact, my sugar cane hawaiis are the best constructed jeans in my rotation and there is no chainstitching anywhere. just ultra-dense single-stitching; the yoke is done with two rows of single-stitching. the thing about chainstitches is that they can unravel. durable, but not indestructible. ande whalls use double-stitching in points of stress; beyond that the yoke construction is hardcore----can you say "bound seams"?

 

[Dick Danger]

everyone in this thread needs a swirly

 

[v84]

hell, ill throw my 2 cents in, I own some samurai and APC amongst other japanese brands, my APC do not feel half as good construction wise as my sammies, if cheap says AW are better than sammies they are probably better than APC ( My APC are my flimsiest pair in my collection ). But you dont really know untill you can hold a pair, you cant tell much from pictures, colour, hues, texture weave tightness etc are all lost in a photo and even more so on a monitor.

That said APC are still great for the price, but if you want quality jeans, get AW or something japanese.

 

[Bandwagonesque]

Originally Posted by Dick Danger

everyone in this thread needs a swirly

Sounds hot. Where do I sign up?

 

[denimdestroyedmylife]

Originally Posted by drake

If I am not mistaken well done chainstitching uses two threads and won't unravel. On most well made jeans it will be done like this.
now imagine what would happen if the red thread broke...

<----double locking chainstitch

 

[chadler]

Originally Posted by masqueofhastur

Good fit is a matter of quality. It is an indication of care taken in desinging the jeans, cutting and sewing them. If the fit is poor then they won't wear well and will be low quality because they only look at a certain aspect, like the denim, or catch phrases. I've worn a cashmere sweater where the cashmere felt nice but the fit was off and therefore I felt it wasn't good quality. Some products fit well for a lot of people, whereas other fit poorly for everyone or will only work for a few select people. If the designer hasn't taken good fit into account, they can't be considered good quality.

You're completely missing the point. Fit has to do with personal taste. Ie: Someone who likes the fit of a pair of true religions will probably not like the fit of a pair of 5ep. Would it be right for them to argue that TR's are better quality than 5ep? Because essentially, that's what you're saying (only with apc & aw). By your reasoning, all products that are good quality would fit the same way. So any jeans that you don't like the fit of you would deem "not as good quality as ande whall". That's ridiculous.

Originally Posted by masqueofhastur

Post some examples of chainstitching? (pic)

how can you argue about good quality vs. bad quality jeans when you don't even know what chainstitching is?

Originally Posted by denimdestroyedmylife

chainstitching isn't everything

in fact, my sugar cane hawaiis are the best constructed jeans in my rotation and there is no chainstitching anywhere. just ultra-dense single-stitching; the yoke is done with two rows of single-stitching. the thing about chainstitches is that they can unravel. durable, but not indestructible.

ande whalls use double-stitching in points of stress; beyond that the yoke construction is hardcore----can you say "bound seams"?

single stitching isn't indestructible either.

chainstitching isn't everything, but it does matter a lot. Here are some things to think about...

-\tChainstitching, when ripped, will more likely unravel than a single stitching, BUT single stitching will more likely break under stress.

-\tSo, why not just sew several rows of single stitches, won't that be the strongest? Well, when you're sewing any type of fabric, you want to avoid unnecessary stitches. The reason for this is because every time the needle penetrates the fabric, it leaves a hole. And when sewing denim, a thicker needle and thicker thread is used. This leaves larger holes than for instance...when sewing polyester. So if you're going over a seam 6 times, you aren't actually making it stronger, you're making it weaker. You're damaging the fabric and it'll more likely tear under stress. This is why chainstitching is used instead of multi-single stitching on the seat, outseams and inseams. The chance of the fabric tearing due to multi-single stitches is higher than a chainstitch unraveling. And plus, stitches can be redone...a torn fabric cannot.

Originally Posted by drizzt3117

Also as DDML mentioned, chainstitching can unravel. My RRDS have this issue on the hem.

-\tthis is the reason why chainstitching isn't always used at the hem. Single stitches are pretty flat on the fabric, whereas the wrong side of a chainstitch protrudes out. So imagine the hem rubbing on the ground, and on your shoes every time you take a step...after a while, it will rip, and might unravel. I say "might" because I've had chainstitched hems that have ripped and not unraveled at all. So don't think that if your chainstitching rips it's over. Some brands chainstitch their hems because their market demands for it. They like the thick look of the stitch when the hem is folded up. But in terms or durability, it really is unnecessary here.

Originally Posted by v84

if cheap says AW are better than sammies they are probably better than APC

I think cheap got a free pair from Ande so that he could use him as a model or something. If that's true, obviously he's going to rave about them. And you shouldn't go solely based on one persons opinion...LA_Guy once said apc's "are woven tight and wear like steel"

 

[chadler]

Originally Posted by drake

To be quite honest it doesn't seem APC or AW are really comparable. They seem completely different beasts, constructed differently and pretty different fits/aesthetics.


you're right, they aren't. that's what i've been trying to say from the beginning.

 

[LA Guy]

Originally Posted by chadler

...LA_Guy once said apc's "are woven tight and wear like steel"

I stand by that. I feel more comfortable jumping fences in APCs than in any other pair of jeans, including some 17-19ouncers of some other (Japanese, obviously - don't think any American or European company makes denim in that weight) companies. I wear jeans hard. They often develop rips and tears, many times before they are really worn in, in high stress areas. APCs take a lickin' and keep on tickin. Some other denims possibly have higher tensile strength, but for whatever reason, maybe because they have so much give, I've never had a pair of jeans last as long without any repair as a pair of APCs. And I've been wearing their jeans for years and years.

 

[quid]

Originally Posted by chadler

I think cheap got a free pair from Ande so that he could use him as a model or something. If that's true, obviously he's going to rave about them.


thats a hell of an assumption, though i agree entirely with your arguments otherwise.

i just wish i bought a pair of AW back when i first found him to get some custom stuff... rest assured my next pair will be grifters.

 

[Dick Danger]

Originally Posted by LA Guy

I wear jeans hard.


Doing?

 

[masqueofhastur]

Originally Posted by chadler

You’re completely missing the point. Fit has to do with personal taste. Ie: Someone who likes the fit of a pair of true religions will probably not like the fit of a pair of 5ep. Would it be right for them to argue that TR’s are better quality than 5ep? Because essentially, that’s what you’re saying (only with apc & aw). By your reasoning, all products that are good quality would fit the same way. So any jeans that you don’t like the fit of you would deem “not as good quality as ande whall”. That’s ridiculous.

Some products fit everyone poorly, like cheap dress pants or dress shirts. Pants where they have taken the time to angle the seams so that they cause the least problem will fit more people better. It isn't just a matter of preference. There might be some preference as well, but good jeans will fit more people better.

how can you argue about good quality vs. bad quality jeans when you don’t even know what chainstitching is?

I was talking about fit, not stitching.

 

[cheapmutha]

Originally Posted by chadler

I think cheap got a free pair from Ande so that he could use him as a model or something. If that’s true, obviously he’s going to rave about them. And you shouldn’t go solely based on one persons opinion…LA_Guy once said apc’s “are woven tight and wear like steel”
if i got them and thought they were **** id say it. i honestly love the jeans. i also bought a pair of apc new standards to compare to my aw, so i can, in a clear mind, continue to say that aw are better jeans. if i find that the apc are better, i will let you all know.

 

[denimdestroyedmylife]

Originally Posted by chadler

single stitching isn't indestructible either. chainstitching isn't everything, but it does matter a lot. Here are some things to think about... - Chainstitching, when ripped, will more likely unravel than a single stitching, BUT single stitching will more likely break under stress. - So, why not just sew several rows of single stitches, won't that be the strongest? Well, when you're sewing any type of fabric, you want to avoid unnecessary stitches. The reason for this is because every time the needle penetrates the fabric, it leaves a hole. And when sewing denim, a thicker needle and thicker thread is used. This leaves larger holes than for instance...when sewing polyester. So if you're going over a seam 6 times, you aren't actually making it stronger, you're making it weaker. You're damaging the fabric and it'll more likely tear under stress. This is why chainstitching is used instead of multi-single stitching on the seat, outseams and inseams. The chance of the fabric tearing due to multi-single stitches is higher than a chainstitch unraveling. And plus, stitches can be redone...a torn fabric cannot. - this is the reason why chainstitching isn't always used at the hem. Single stitches are pretty flat on the fabric, whereas the wrong side of a chainstitch protrudes out. So imagine the hem rubbing on the ground, and on your shoes every time you take a step...after a while, it will rip, and might unravel. I say "might" because I've had chainstitched hems that have ripped and not unraveled at all. So don't think that if your chainstitching rips it's over. Some brands chainstitch their hems because their market demands for it. They like the thick look of the stitch when the hem is folded up. But in terms or durability, it really is unnecessary here.
you brought up some points i hadn't thought about just to be clear i wasn't making a case for single-stitching over chainstitching my point is that you can't argue that a pair of jeans is poorly constructed because there is no chainstitching; or stated positively, jeans can be constructed well using only single-stitching. your point about six (!) rows of single-stitching weakening the fabric is well-taken, if not extreme. i don't see how a triple-row of single stitching will compromise the fabric so that it will rip more easily than if the seam were chainstitched. as i've stated before, i've got a pair of sugar canes that use only a single row of ultra-dense single-stitching everywhere, including the yoke and hems. and i've got a pair of samurais that use two rows of chainstitching on the yoke, inseam and outseam. only time will tell whose seams will reign supreme

 

[poly800rock]

i had a lock stitch on my black samurai's replace with a chainstitch at blue in green. to quote gordon &quot;your tailor has done one hell of a job, the chainstitch i put on won't hold compared to your tailors lock stitch&quot; it's all really how the do the stitching