High-quality JEANS

Discussion in 'Streetwear and Denim' started by andrewc, Jan 25, 2007.

  1. Arethusa

    Arethusa Senior member

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    apc's are selvedge denim. AW's are not.
    Gnnnnr, ow.
    Please. For the last time. Selvage is almost meaningless. Can we please put this to rest? Maybe sticky the last thread where cheap and I went over this? Anything to put this one down.
     


  2. chadler

    chadler Well-Known Member

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    Gnnnnr, ow. Please. For the last time. Selvage is almost meaningless. Can we please put this to rest? Maybe sticky the last thread where cheap and I went over this? Anything to put this one down.
    but the whole premise of most ppl's arguements is that AW jeans are made in a smaller scale production and thus better quality. if you agree with that, then you must agree under that same reasoning that selvedge denim is greater quality than non-selvedge denim. i personally don't think it makes a difference. just as i don't think it makes a difference whether one person makes the jeans from start to finish or if it takes 5 ppl to make the jeans. you have two great pair of jeans, and they are pretty much the same in terms of quality (however, one is slightly more in price) but ppl want to argue one is better than the other because of a few differences that dont reflect quality at all.
     


  3. Arethusa

    Arethusa Senior member

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    What are you talking about? The premise of the argument that Ande Whalls are better is that they're made of better denim and hardware and constructed to better standards.
     


  4. Tarmac

    Tarmac Senior member

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    Whalls have looked great on every example I have seen. If we are talking about details like rivets, selvage etc, I think hand-made + custom selected pocket lining cloth + kickass raw leather patch totally OWNZ selvage. Details are details, and Ande Whalls have better details overall, in my opinion. They beat APC hands down.

    Also, AWs are definitely comparable to any of the boutique japanese makers in terms of quality. If you are comparing AWs to US import japanese prices ($230 and up, shipped) then I would go for AWs for sure.

    If you are gonna actually be in Japan later on as one reply posted, then its arguable, because you can get "entry level" jeans in japan with all the bells and whistles (leather patch, selvage, hidden rivets, chain stitch, your choice of slubby or whatever) for Y16000 or so, which is only about $145 on current exchange rates.

    And this is coming from a very satisfied APC owner.
     


  5. GWHiZiTSPHiL

    GWHiZiTSPHiL Senior member

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    since we've covered Ande Whalls > APC. how about Ande Whalls vs 5EP?
     


  6. Ott

    Ott Senior member

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    since we've covered Ande Whalls > APC. how about Ande Whalls vs 5EP?
    it's not really a fair comparison imo. The entire aesthetic is different, and 5EPs cost almost $150 more than AWs.
     


  7. Stylin-1

    Stylin-1 Senior member

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    What are you talking about? The premise of the argument that Ande Whalls are better is that they're made of better denim and hardware and constructed to better standards.
    AW's win on the fact they have a wider range of fits alone. I haven't bought APC's because none of their fits appeal to me. I think I'll spring for a pair of Cougars though....and gladly pay $160.
     


  8. Stylin-1

    Stylin-1 Senior member

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    I was planing on getting them w/o the thumb anyways. I guess the next deciding factor would be: should I get these or wait till summer and get some Japanese Denim when I am in Tokyo.
    Buy the Whalls....you could be abducted by aliens between now and Summer.
     


  9. masqueofhastur

    masqueofhastur Senior member

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    ^ You could just try asking him to cut you a 30 inch inseam. He did say something about making longer inseams if someone really needed it, so I suppose he could make a shorter one if you asked nicely. He doesn't 'advertise' this though.

    Ah, evidently - I got the impression he expressly didn't do that. I guess if he'd be willing to make those modifications for me I'd buy a pair from him. I like getting good stuff from small personal places if possible. Also why I'm eyeing MJK's stuff (bonus for that is I've got the same build as him so I don't have to worry about fit).
     


  10. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    but the whole premise of most ppl's arguements is that AW jeans are made in a smaller scale production and thus better quality. if you agree with that, then you must agree under that same reasoning that selvedge denim is greater quality than non-selvedge denim.

    i personally don't think it makes a difference. just as i don't think it makes a difference whether one person makes the jeans from start to finish or if it takes 5 ppl to make the jeans. you have two great pair of jeans, and they are pretty much the same in terms of quality (however, one is slightly more in price) but ppl want to argue one is better than the other because of a few differences that dont reflect quality at all.


    Again, I own both pairs (actually 3 pairs of APCs) and think the quality of the AWs is better to the point that I think they're worth about twice as much as the APCs.

    If you own both pairs and would like to comment, go ahead. If you just like offering opinions to friends and relatives based on viewing pictures over the internet, we've already had plenty of that on this thread.
     


  11. chadler

    chadler Well-Known Member

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    Again, I own both pairs (actually 3 pairs of APCs) and think the quality of the AWs is better to the point that I think they're worth about twice as much as the APCs. If you own both pairs and would like to comment, go ahead. If you just like offering opinions to friends and relatives based on viewing pictures over the internet, we've already had plenty of that on this thread.
    in your previous post you talked about why you like AW’s jeans, and you mentioned…How it feels, contrast stitching, and lack of random loose strings. None of these things reflect on the actual quality of the jean. Which jean you like more is a lot different than which jean is better quality. This is where I think most of you are getting confused at. And Yes, i have seen both jeans in person. Let me just make It clear again that I was never arguing for which one was better quality. Especially since Ande is a fellow member on here and ST and i want to be completely supportive…but some arguments here don’t make sense. Lets try to break it down like this… AW vs. APC Denim: - I like apc because of it’s colour. Some of you like AW because of the feel. We can’t argue that one is superior to another because of personal preferences. Therefore, TIE. Hardware: - they are about the same. You see more cases with apc rivets coming off because A LOT more ppl own apc. Even then, there are hardly any problems with apc hardware. Therefore, TIE. Stitching: - AW’s don’t have chainstitching. But I’m actually not 100% sure on this because I didn’t look at the inside of the seams. But if i'm right, this actually makes a big difference. Outseams, and inseams should always be chainstitched. You’ll see hems without it, but areas of high stress like the legs and rear need chainstitching. If I’m wrong and AW’s are chainstitched, someone please correct me. Therefore, 1 pt for APC. Fit: - doesn’t have anything to do with quality, so why are ppl bringing this up?? Therefore, fit is not relevant. Details: - leather patch, custom pocket lining, custom stitch colours etc…again, they don’t reflect on quality…they are esthetics. Nothing more. ppl like apc because of the minimalism, but in spite of it. And vice versa for AW. Therefore, details is not relevant. …is there anything else? i can't think of anything to cover. so in conclusion, if we are judging based on quality alone (which is what this argument was about) then apc wins. Chainstitching makes the difference. But if I’m wrong and AW’s are chainstitched, then it looks like a tie.
     


  12. masqueofhastur

    masqueofhastur Senior member

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    Fit has a great deal to do with quality, I'd say it's the most important thing. Feel comes next, if it's not comfortable and doesn't fit well giving your balls some room to not kill sperm and give you decent leg movement so you can actually walk around all day and, for example; use your jeans for work, then fit is very important. If you need really durable beater jeans, then durability is more important than feel, which is where the stitching comes in, but in general I wouldn't pay more than $20 for a pair of jeans that didn't fit perfectly, and now that I have a pair that does fit perfectly, I wouldn't buy a pair that doesn't even if it's $5.
     


  13. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    in your previous post you talked about why you like AW's jeans, and you mentioned...How it feels, contrast stitching, and lack of random loose strings. None of these things reflect on the actual quality of the jean. Which jean you like more is a lot different than which jean is better quality. This is where I think most of you are getting confused at. And Yes, i have seen both jeans in person.

    Let me just make It clear again that I was never arguing for which one was better quality. Especially since Ande is a fellow member on here and ST and i want to be completely supportive...but some arguments here don't make sense.

    Lets try to break it down like this...

    AW vs. APC

    Denim:
    - I like apc because of it's colour. Some of you like AW because of the feel. We can't argue that one is superior to another because of personal preferences. Therefore, TIE.

    Hardware:
    - they are about the same. You see more cases with apc rivets coming off because A LOT more ppl own apc. Even then, there are hardly any problems with apc hardware. Therefore, TIE.

    Stitching:
    - AW's don't have chainstitching. But I'm actually not 100% sure on this because I didn't look at the inside of the seams. But if i'm right, this actually makes a big difference. Outseams, and inseams should always be chainstitched. You'll see hems without it, but areas of high stress like the legs and rear need chainstitching. If I'm wrong and AW's are chainstitched, someone please correct me. Therefore, 1 pt for APC.

    Fit:
    - doesn't have anything to do with quality, so why are ppl bringing this up?? Therefore, fit is not relevant.

    Details:
    - leather patch, custom pocket lining, custom stitch colours etc...again, they don't reflect on quality...they are esthetics. Nothing more. ppl like apc because of the minimalism, but in spite of it. And vice versa for AW. Therefore, details is not relevant.

    ...is there anything else? i can't think of anything to cover.

    so in conclusion, if we are judging based on quality alone (which is what this argument was about) then apc wins. Chainstitching makes the difference. But if I'm wrong and AW's are chainstitched, then it looks like a tie.


    I consider the variety of cuts/fits as well as the fit of jeans to be part of the quality equation. AW is substantially better than APC in that regard. I also stand by my statement regarding the quality of the denim. It's very obvious to me by touching them which denim is of higher quality. Also simply examining the attention to detail on the jeans makes it obvious which one is better made. It's the same as comparing handgrade and benchgrade shoes.

    You can persist in your fantasy that APC jeans are better made than AWs but you're probably the only person that believes it <shrug>
     


  14. ratboycom

    ratboycom Senior member

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    I consider the variety of cuts/fits as well as the fit of jeans to be part of the quality equation. AW is substantially better than APC in that regard. I also stand by my statement regarding the quality of the denim. It's very obvious to me by touching them which denim is of higher quality. Also simply examining the attention to detail on the jeans makes it obvious which one is better made. It's the same as comparing handgrade and benchgrade shoes.

    You can persist in your fantasy that APC jeans are better made than AWs but you're probably the only person that believes it <shrug>


    Dude you forgot about listening to and tasting the denim for quality. You know its the only true way to gauge quality in the fabric and dyes.
     


  15. theshonen8899

    theshonen8899 Senior member

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    Fit: - doesn’t have anything to do with quality, so why are ppl bringing this up?? Therefore, fit is not relevant.
    I feel offended, as the fit of the jeans are always how I choose my jeans and what people compliment me on.
     


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