Grenadine Ties Uncovered

[ThinkDerm]

Originally Posted by Sam Hober

Here is a photo of one of our lined 6-fold grenadines:

The 4-fold will look the same as a standard 3-fold

unlined 6 fold might be better!

 

[Sam Hober]

Originally Posted by ThinkDerm

unlined 6 fold might be better!

I am curious why do you say that?

In general unlined ties wrinkle more and do not hold their shape.

 

[ThinkDerm]

Originally Posted by Sam Hober

I am curious why do you say that?

In general unlined ties wrinkle more and do not hold their shape.

think i saw a drakes 6 fold unlined recently and it was nice - had some seethroughness that added to the majesty of it all

 

[ld111134]

These look great, David!

 

[Sam Hober]

Originally Posted by ThinkDerm

think I saw a Drakes 6 fold unlined recently and it was nice - had some seethroughness that added to the majesty of it all

ThinkDerm,

If you make a grenadine without an interlining it will be very see-through not a little.

I just took a quick look at Drake's site and they have some very beautiful silks and a small grenadine collection but no unlined 6-folds - that I noticed, perhaps you saw it on another site? Please post a photo if you see it again.

We do make grenadines without tipping and with rolled edges which appear to be unlined but are only partially unlined.

 

[BdeRWest]

Ahem, to try and salvage this...

Originally Posted by Sam Hober

BdeRWest,

We will order Grenadine Graza Fina silks in probably one week from now. So perhaps in 2 months we will have a wide selection for sale.

In our new pin dot and stripe grenadines will follow possibly a month later...

Excellent! I shall check back then!

 

[Sam Hober]

Originally Posted by BdeRWest

Ahem, to try and salvage this... Excellent! I shall check back then!

Sounds good.

An interesting point about the grenadine silk weave is that it is not an easy weave to do as it requires special warp preparation.

It is hard for me to say in words why I personally like the grenadine weave other than the obvious that it is an interesting texture.

I tend to rely on my intuition and serendipity plays a big role in our new weaves and designs. As an example Mark my father (At 82 he is still very active with our designs) and sartorial friends will often suggest weaves, designs and techniques.

An example of Serendipity is this thread which has influenced our decision to add the Fina version of grenadines to our collection.

Sometimes we move quickly and other times we spend literally years thinking and working on ideas.

When we create new weaves it is often a case of we like this weave "A" but we want more complexity in the design or perhaps straighter lines look better or so on... so we make sketches and have samples woven.

Then we take the sample weaves and leave them on a table that we walk by every day to see how we feel about the look. Noina my wife will handle the technical area of drape by simply touching the fabric - she will know how it will drape.

We use a combination of colored pencils and actual silk to create new patterns.

Shapes, colors and designs that we use tend to based off the classics. 40 or 50 years ago we used less colors each season now we have changed and tend to weave silk designs in many colors.

I have friends who went to art school and they all seem to be able to take abstract ideas and before shows write up several paragraphs carefully showing clearly how they are inspired. I think that you have all seen these narratives and when good they really can explain the thoughts that are behind their art. But sometimes they can be as abstract as the art and confusing - at least to me...

If any forum members are able to speak more clearly about the "why" of grenadine please do.

Hint Matt S. I am thinking of you....

 

[Despos]

Originally Posted by Sam Hober

Sounds good.


Then we take the sample weaves and leave them on a table that we walk by every day to see how we feel about the look.
....

My methodology as well. Amazing how much smarter I am after a week or so.

 

[Matt S]

As I am a graphic designer I am required to have a reason for everything I do. Artists aren't required to explain all the details. They can do things just because they feel like it. I was trained that "just because" is never a good reason. I first discovered grenadine ties through the original James Bond films. I didn't know what they were called but I could clearly tell they were different than knit ties. The reasons why I like grenadine ties: 1. They are solid (usually). Solid ties are versatile and easy to wear with a large variety of clothes. Simplicity is elegant and timeless (though some may feel differently). 2. Plain solids can be boring, but grenadines are not. Repp weaves are very simple, herringbone weaves are a little more interesting, but grenadine is a very complex weave which results in an interesting and unique texture. 3. The reason above is why I prefer garza grossa over garza fina. Garza grossa has a more complex weave than garza fine, which IMO results in a more interesting texture. Though the weave is so complex, being made in a solid colour means it's still subtle. To sum it up, the charm of a grenadine tie comes from taking something as simple as a solid tie and making it as interesting as possible. I really like Hober's midnight grenadine pin dot tie, as the dot seems to fit in naturally with the grenadine texture. As the only grenadine pin dot tie Hober offers, midnight and white couldn't be a better combination. However, I'm not a fan of the grenadine stripe ties. The complex simplicity of the solid grenadine is lost as I find the stripe competes with the texture. But this is just a personal preference and if you like the striped grenadine ties I don't want to be the one stopping you from getting one. Disclaimer: I only wear solid ties. I limit myself to solids so I'm not tempted to buy ever gorgeous patterned tie I come across. If I ever decide that I want to wear a patterned tie the white on midnight pin dot grenadine would be my first choice. The only exception I allow myself is for "wedding ties."

 

[Sam Hober]

Originally Posted by Despos

My methodology as well. Amazing how much smarter I am after a week or so.
Exactly - smiling....

 

[Sam Hober]

"...... I was trained that "just because" is never a good reason..." I can remember doing book reports as a small kid in school and the teacher said the same thing - we had to explain why we liked a book. "To sum it up, the charm of a grenadine tie comes from taking something as simple as a solid tie and making it as interesting as possible." Well said. "I really like Hober's midnight grenadine pin dot tie, as the dot seems to fit in naturally with the grenadine texture. As the only grenadine pin dot tie Hober offers, midnight and white couldn't be a better combination." The pin dot may have new friends in the not too distant future. It is hard to tell from the photo but the pin dot is on the reverse side of the silk. This is probably the only grenadine that we currently have like that. "However, I'm not a fan of the grenadine stripe ties. The complex simplicity of the solid grenadine is lost as I find the stripe competes with the texture. But this is just a personal preference and if you like the striped grenadine ties I don't want to be the one stopping you from getting one." A good observation which I did think of when we were designing the silks. As a result the stripes are still grenadine weave stripes and are not a satin weave or something else as other tie makers have done in the last few years.

 

[apropos]

Originally Posted by radicaldog

Interesting thread. I think I have a couple of fine grain grenadine ties then. Does anyone weave them with yarn of more than one colour?
I have a one, a vintage PRL, but am overseas and it is not with me.

AlanC has posted some photos of a couple of vintage BBs, which I hope he will not mind me reposting here:

 

[BBC]

Here's another BB grenadine stripe (mine)

Davide Cenci grenadine (also mine)

 

[tchoy]

Love the ties and David is one of the nicest guy to deal with.

 

[j]

Bunch of crap deleted... we now return to on-topic discussion.