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Good Natured Advice Thread (improving a business wardrobe)

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Claghorn, Jan 6, 2014.

  1. jfrater

    jfrater Senior member

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    How about with a solid blue vicuña Kent wang suit?
     
  2. Coxsackie

    Coxsackie Senior member

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    ^Nope. Pair with a full-length chinchilla coat, blue vicuña homburg and ivory-handled cane.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2015
  3. jfrater

    jfrater Senior member

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    Cane: check! Homburg: check! Coat: let me see what I can find on eBay :)
     
  4. EliodA

    EliodA Senior member

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  5. Coxsackie

    Coxsackie Senior member

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    2 people like this.
  6. MGD83

    MGD83 Senior member

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    A black wholecut is a great shoe option for business wear or also evening "formal" wear. I wouldn't consider them a novelty item at all. They are certainly as evening appropriate as a black captoe oxford. I don't know where the notion came from that wholecuts are from the new-school of fashion.
     
  7. Monkeyface

    Monkeyface Senior member

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    Indeed. A plain toe oxford was originally more appropriate for wearing with a worsted suit than a cap toe oxford, and a whole cut is a only a small step away from a plain toe oxford, so stop parroting Manton.

    I do agree with him that a wholecut stands out more than a regular oxford in today's world, but for some people, like jfrater, that doesn't really matter much.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2015
  8. TweedyProf

    TweedyProf Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    jfrater

    since you have half their stock in hand :)

    which ones are 5, 6, and 7? Is one the air force blue japanese wool/silk? They also have two blue donegals apparently, old and new. Natural light shot of those three a bit closer?

    Cheers.
     
  9. jfrater

    jfrater Senior member

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  10. in stitches

    in stitches Senior member Moderator

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    All fantastic shoes.
    Meh. GGs are plenty well made, and if one prefers a GG model of a Vass model there is no reason to go GG.
    Awesome.
    Not a single loser in the group.
     
  11. jfrater

    jfrater Senior member

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    5. Airforce blue with chevron: http://vandafineclothing.com/store/neckties/399-airforce-blue-chevron.html
    6. Blue silk cashmere: http://vandafineclothing.com/store/neckties/580-blue-silk-cashmere-donegal.html
    7. Navy olive plaid: http://vandafineclothing.com/store/neckties/236-navy-olive-plaid.html

    Once the sun is fully up I'll take a better shot for you :)
     
    1 person likes this.
  12. archibaldleach

    archibaldleach Senior member

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    I think a black wholecut can work fine with a suit as can something like a black monkstrap. Of course black oxfords are fine with a suit, but that goes without saying. If by putting "formal" in quotation marks, you are suggesting something like a dark navy or grey suit rather than black tie, then I think they're fine. With a dinner jacket, I'd say no.

    I think the issue I have with wholecuts is due to them standing out a bit more and being a bit more unusual (I was using "novelty" more to address this point, though I believe oxfords have been regularly worn with formal clothing much longer than wholecuts so the other uses of the word still kind of work). The shoe looks like a plain toe oxford at first, but it isn't. It is a bit more "fashion-y" even if it's been around for awhile. I think it would be strange to wear a wholecut with an odd jacket and trousers due to its sleekness (of course this can be disregarded if you are fine wearing oxfords with odd jackets), so it basically turns into a non-oxford that can only be worn like an oxford. I just wouldn't know what to do with a pair of them or why I'd want them when I could get a pair of oxfords instead.

    Add cordovan and a shoe in midnight blue instead of black and you get even stranger.


    You've captured precisely the issue that I have with wholecuts. They do stand out more, which to me suggests that they may be less appropriate in the most formal contexts. At the same time, their sleekness seems to suggest that they belong with suits rather than odd jackets (to the extent one follows the oxfords with suits rule). I sort of get why someone would want a pair if they like variety or something that is a bit fun and fashionable, but I look at them and see a shoe that is never the superior option (plain toe oxford for dinner jacket is better, stitch cap or punch cap oxford for formal suits, derbys / monks for more casual suits and odd jackets, loafers with more casual fits). I understand that not everyone looks at building a wardrobe as an optimization exercise (I don't entirely, but there's enough there that I do).

    JFrater definitely has a place in a massive shoe wardrobe for a pair of pretty much anything, though.

    Incidentally, I think that adding a stitch or punch cap to a pair of plain toe oxfords is a much smaller modification than turning an oxford into a wholecut, both in terms of the structure of the shoe and its overall look.
     
    1 person likes this.
  13. kulata

    kulata Senior member

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    IMO Whole cut oxfords > Cap toe/stitch cap/whatever cap for a sleek suit look all day and everyday. 365 days of the year and leap years

    Whole cut suede oxfords. Now that's a different beast all together.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2015
  14. PCK1

    PCK1 Senior member

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    Yeah the Rubi squares are awesome. On my last trip to Naples I snagged a bunch of them.

    Whole cuts are great with city suits...they are very formal. But Navy is kind of an odd color for a wholecut, given the formality of the style. Maybe consider having them re-painted black.
     
  15. jfrater

    jfrater Senior member

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    I actually have a pair of carmina cordovan whole cuts at Dandy Shoe Care right now being re-patinated. I really like the Navy and will keep them as they are - I just need to pair them well. I also have an amazing pair of Bonafe navy suede chukkas coming - I thought they might go nicely with a solid navy suit.

    Incidentally - if you are not familiar with Dandy Shoe Care check out his work - amazing! http://www.dandyshoecare.it
     
  16. Monkeyface

    Monkeyface Senior member

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    I think a big issue with many shoes that are a little more out there is that they look better in stand alone pictures on the internet than on your feet with an outfit.
     
    2 people like this.
  17. MGD83

    MGD83 Senior member

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    I have 2 pairs of wholecuts, one deep burgundy and one black, both from Bonafe. I won't think of wearing the black ones at all, unless I'm wearing either a navy suit or grey. I won't pair them with any odd jackets. The burgundy however, lends itself to more more casual outfits and I can see them being worn with odd trousers and sport coats.

    I like the idea of a black chelsea boot although I've yet to find one that fits properly. I think those could probably do double duty with suits in the fall / winter and sport coats.
     
  18. Coxsackie

    Coxsackie Senior member

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    This. Assuming an unlimited budget, I would be very tempted to kop these beauties:

    [​IMG]
    ...but then what would I do with them? Mount them on a pedestal in my hallway? They are basically unwearable - except maybe at Pitti.
     
  19. Academic2

    Academic2 Senior member

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    I wager that if we did a large enough survey we’d find a meaningful correlation between relative youth and the belief that whole cuts don’t look novel.

    The rate of change in classic style accelerated considerably in the last three decades of the 20th century. As a result we’re seeing bigger generation gaps, and we’re seeing the span of time that counts as a ‘generation’ get smaller.

    Cheers,

    Ac
     

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