Good Natured Advice Thread (improving a business wardrobe)

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Claghorn, Jan 6, 2014.

  1. sugarbutch

    sugarbutch Bearded Prick Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    15,901
    Likes Received:
    19,218
    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2010
    Location:
    People's Republic of San Francisco
    Iso, waist suppression, in, er, isolation, isn't feminine, but given your partner's sensitivity to being identified as female, I would recommend avoiding it. There's lots of room between extreme waist suppression and shapeless. Likewise, built-up shoulders, while not inherently feminine, are common on women's tailored clothing. A natural shoulder will help to distance your partner's look from women's clothing.
     
  2. Stencil

    Stencil Senior member

    Messages:
    196
    Likes Received:
    61
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2014
    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    Frankly, I love pleats. Single forward pleats, anyway. I think they're superior than flat fronts for a number of reasons. If they're well cut, they don't look blousy, but the extra fabric makes movement and sitting much more comfortable. They help create a nice continuous line when worn with tailored jackets (think of how jacket skirts meet trouser hips in old AA drawings). The fold of the pleat lends itself nicely to a crisp crease in the trouser leg, and cuffed trousers will help keep the pleat nice and closed at rest. My uneducated suspicion is that it is easier for pleated trousers to drape nicely, as well. My suits have single forward pleats, a high rise (around 12", near my navel), and suspender buttons. while they look extremely polished, they feel like pajamas. All my odd trousers are flat front; I wish they were pleated. Pleats go in and out of style in the mainstream, but among those in the know, they often preferred for everything but casual cotton trousers.

    I think the conventional wisdom is that flat fronts are for the young and thin, whereas pleats are for those who need more room in their trousers. I disagree. I think what matters in either case is not the pleats, but how well the trousers fit.
     
  3. Stencil

    Stencil Senior member

    Messages:
    196
    Likes Received:
    61
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2014
    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    I don't see how you guys can so definitely dismiss the possibility of suppression. The pantsuit silhouette entails an extreme padded shoulder, bust darts, lots of suppression, and a short flared skirt. The effect is an hourglass figure. But such is the case with many men's suit silhouettes. Everything from the 30's up until the reign of the Ivy sack was hugely hour-glass, but the proportions were very different and quite "masculine." The London lounge cut retains this silhouette. Shouldn't suppression be considered concurrently with the cut of the rest of the jacket? Clean chest or swelled, tight shoulders or extended, and what of the jacket quarters and the shape of the skirt? I'm uncomfortable saying that simple because one has a relatively "feminine" figure that waist suppression will inherently highlight that fact. It seems like there too many other elements of fit at play here to take such a reductionistic view.

    Regardless, I'm in total agreement with the natural shoulder comment.
     
  4. breakaway01

    breakaway01 Senior member

    Messages:
    676
    Likes Received:
    240
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2013
    Location:
    Ann Arbor, MI
    I don't think that sugarbutch is 'so definitely dismiss[ing] the possibility of suppression' at all when he writes that "there's lots of room between extreme waist suppression and shapeless." Waist suppression as strong as Iso's picture would suggest, combined with the highly structured shoulders, add up in my view to a 'feminine' jacket silhouette. Moderating both the shoulders and the waist suppression would help a lot IMO. Also agree with a previous comment about losing the hacking pockets.
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2014
  5. topos

    topos Senior member

    Messages:
    189
    Likes Received:
    26
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2012
    i think they might have passed it down. my impression of people who work in the field: they change a constant and publish a new paper; it amounts to basically what you're describing! it's why they can churn out so many papers. (i'm not an expert in the area, but it doesn't speak well that this is what first comes to mind).
     
  6. sugarbutch

    sugarbutch Bearded Prick Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    15,901
    Likes Received:
    19,218
    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2010
    Location:
    People's Republic of San Francisco

    My comment offers suggestions to reduce the possibility that *others* will see Iso's partner as looking feminine. By themselves, these characteristics of cut don't make someone "look like a woman" but if there are secondary physical characteristics which reinforce the femininity of the wearer, they will likely lead to the undesired outcome. Given his partner's sensitivity around the issue, it seems a conservative approach is the best bet.
     
  7. FlyingMonkey

    FlyingMonkey Senior member

    Messages:
    3,602
    Likes Received:
    3,107
    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2011
    Location:
    Ontario
    Haven't got much to add to the current discussion other than to say that what Stencil and Sugarbutch are saying are not incompatible and also, yes to pleats! Oh, and to echo RTC, the attitudes here are all very heartening and a credit to this forum.
     
  8. Kira

    Kira Senior member

    Messages:
    577
    Likes Received:
    48
    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2014
  9. Stencil

    Stencil Senior member

    Messages:
    196
    Likes Received:
    61
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2014
    Location:
    Oakland, CA
    I'm Sorry, sugarbutch, I was on my way out the door when I wrote that, and not reading as carefully as I should have. Your comment did indeed leave room for a lot of possibility. I don't mean to be thorny or overly assertive :embar:

    I suppose what I was really going for is that suppression, if used to a reasonable extent in conjunction with other elements of jacket cut, needn't be feminine at all, and (I feel) are unlikely to be seen as such. But I concede the point; if Iso's partner is at all nervous that the execution could still be perceived as feminine, there's no reason in to risk it. There are other styles out there that will be flattering and unfeminine.
     
  10. Kira

    Kira Senior member

    Messages:
    577
    Likes Received:
    48
    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2014
    So I'm not the only one who is attracted to women wearing menswear inspired clothing.. [​IMG]
     
  11. europrep

    europrep Senior member

    Messages:
    2,351
    Likes Received:
    2,729
    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2012
    Location:
    Boston
    Federer v. Monfils is sloppy, but very entertaining
     
  12. Betelgeuse

    Betelgeuse Senior member

    Messages:
    5,152
    Likes Received:
    6,366
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Location:
    Mexico City
  13. in stitches

    in stitches Kung Joo Moderator

    Messages:
    68,895
    Likes Received:
    31,016
    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2010
    Location:
    Charm City
    

    Rooooogggggeeeeeeeeeeeer!! :slayer:
     
  14. Isolation

    Isolation Senior member

    Messages:
    1,953
    Likes Received:
    2,110
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2013
    Location:
    London
    Actually thinking of pleats I wonder if I should consider them too, or what about have them in suits where I would always have the jacket on anyway (ie. db suits), wouldn't that make it more comfortable? I keep hearing rather heated opinions from both camps I am not sure. I know it's not trendy to wear them, but I don't care too much if they are genuinely good, but not many fits show them on WAYWRN either.
     
  15. DonRaphael

    DonRaphael Senior member

    Messages:
    1,454
    Likes Received:
    477
    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2012
    Fellow Noodlers, I'm in need of advice. I purchased this lovely SC from jrd617
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    How to combine it? I'm thinking rich dark brown pants or cream/tan pants or dark gray/charcoal, yes?
    Shirt-wise I believe simple/solid light blue would be best.
    Should one keep it simple with the choice of tie (solid but textured, say grenadine)? I guess al kinds of navy/brown/rust would work (depending on the choice of pants of course)?
     

Share This Page

Styleforum is proudly sponsored by