1. And... we're back. You'll notice that all of your images are back as well, as are our beloved emoticons, including the infamous :foo: We have also worked with our server folks and developers to fix the issues that were slowing down the site.

    There is still work to be done - the images in existing sigs are not yet linked, for example, and we are working on a way to get the images to load faster - which will improve the performance of the site, especially on the pages with a ton of images, and we will continue to work diligently on that and keep you updated.

    Cheers,

    Fok on behalf of the entire Styleforum team
    Dismiss Notice

Good Natured Advice Thread (improving a business wardrobe)

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Claghorn, Jan 6, 2014.

  1. TweedyProf

    TweedyProf Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    4,106
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2012
    Momkeyface...doing good with his steals. I'm going to be feeling that check jacket for a while. :)

    I agree with Elio about putting too much into one picture. As we all know two different shots can make a jacket appear heavenly then merely ordinary (which isn't happening here of course!). The quarters look different in the two buttoned pics, of Greg and Antonio. They might seem less open in the last pic but hard to tell. Unbuttoned on Greg, it looks great.

    I quite like the "c" in the eidos. Ok not as smooth perhaps as the liverano but at probably a quarter of the price, liverano accessible to mere mortals perhaps. Caveats from above again.

    Btw there were other differences between the two too. I'm still torn on 4 inch lapels. The Formosa look fantastic on those who have modeled it here especially that montage of Dirnelli where the superiority of
    The Formosa fit
    On him is so stark.

    I understand proportions as an argument but 4 inches is on one side of the continuum and I worry whether I will feel good About it in four years time.

    Can someone make the proportion argument clearly.. (Worry: you're not wearing 3.75-4 inch ties right? That said the thinner ties look fine on Antonio against Lorenzo).

    Or again is a wide lapel a traditional element of Napoli tailoring?
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
  2. Claghorn

    Claghorn Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    10,005
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2012
    Location:
    Texas.
    Proportionality argument: bigger head, wider lapels. Broader shoulders, wider lapels. Longer torso, wider lapels. Ordered in terms of priority.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
    1 person likes this.
  3. TweedyProf

    TweedyProf Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    4,106
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2012
    I was going to argue that larger torso and taller but not thin men should go for it. So agreement there. The first one seems to me slightly odd. But it depend on what is meant by "bigger". Small heads in size should avoid but consider long versus wide faces, vertical versus horizontal. Then I suspect the claim would be for long with wide lapels . Here the issue is not complementing but compensating or balance. Consider will a 8cm blade be balanced on the 4 inch lapel, to shift focus downward momentarily to the width if tie?

    That said 3.5 inch lapels will probably do it if 4 does. And 3.5 might be a median that weathers the passing of age contra winds of taste. But also curious about traditional characteristics of regional tailoring as explaining it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
  4. NickPollica

    NickPollica Senior member Affiliate Vendor

    Messages:
    1,447
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2010
    You guys realize that you are comparing button stances from two photos where one doesn't have buttonholes cut or buttons even applied (ethan's pic v. greg)? Look at the photo of me wearing the jacket unbuttoned in comparison to the one of Ethan and you'll note that the line of the lapel rolls in essentially the same spot. Our button stance isn't insanely low. Its all about balance and the trouser you wear has a lot to do with that (the lorenzo trouser has a 12" rise to accomodate the more open quarters).

    just a quick response in between diaper changes on a saturday morning...
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
    5 people like this.
  5. mimo

    mimo Senior member

    Messages:
    7,382
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2012
    @Coxsackie Don't get either of them. You don't like the black one, and the burgundy one is too small for your needs. You'll only end up wanting a different one.

    But if you're OK with still needing a briefcase afterwards, and just feeling the discount kop-compulsion that you're unwilling to resist, then get the burgundy one: you like it more, it has better proportions, and it helps justify your buying a bigger one later that you actually like, on purely practical grounds. [/enable]
     
  6. Claghorn

    Claghorn Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    10,005
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2012
    Location:
    Texas.
    Yah, NickP, your pictures were enough to settle any debate. Your presence was a few hours too late ;)
     
    1 person likes this.
  7. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    8,355
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2011
    Location:
    Washington, DC
    There are endless debates on what exactly are the characteristics of the Neapolitan jacket, but I think it's fair to say that they do tend to have wider lapels. Here's the window of the Attolini shop in Naples a couple of months ago:

    [​IMG]

    Formosa:

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
  8. mimo

    mimo Senior member

    Messages:
    7,382
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2012
    Is anyone else finding the prevalence of the 3r2 button arrangement rather tiresome these days? Perhaps it's just me being a young dinosaur as usual...

    This style of gorge, lapel and length is, however, a delight to me - especially in the face of the Bieberesque skinny-lapelled hipster bumfreezers of contemporary fashion emporia.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
  9. Monkeyface

    Monkeyface Senior member

    Messages:
    3,885
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2013
    Not really, if I recall correctly the only appropriate amount of buttons is one or three. I think I read it in an article on Huntsman. So a 3 roll 2 has the right amount of buttons, but the look of a 2.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
  10. mimo

    mimo Senior member

    Messages:
    7,382
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2012
    But it doesn't look like a two. The way the lower lapel bulges makes it look like an oddly-pressed three. Anyway, it's a "thing", it's popular in current iGentry and there's nothing wrong with it. I'm just surprised at how much it appears to have become a standard.
     
  11. EliodA

    EliodA Senior member

    Messages:
    3,762
    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2013
    Location:
    Jakarta, Indonesia
    Since we're talking about characteristics of the Neapolitan jacket, the 3r2 button arrangement is very much one of those characteristics. And always has been, regardless of whether it is a current prevalence.
     
    1 person likes this.
  12. Murlsquirl

    Murlsquirl Senior member Moderator

    Messages:
    8,962
    Joined:
    May 16, 2013
    Location:
    CA
    In my opinion, something just doesn't look right about a 3.5"+ lapel and a two-button. To me, nothing looks better than the Neapolitan cut 3r2.
     
    3 people like this.
  13. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    8,355
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2011
    Location:
    Washington, DC
    The 3r2 has a very long history. It's particularly popular now but not like it's some newfangled detail the kids made up.
     
  14. Cleav

    Cleav Senior member Moderator

    Messages:
    10,969
    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2009
    Location:
    English Flower Garden
    This ^ +

    3R2, what's not to like in a balanced wardrobe?
     
  15. EFV

    EFV Senior member Dubiously Honored

    Messages:
    3,212
    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2011
    Location:
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Yup, it's been around since the early 1900's (perhaps earlier?). Favoured by both American trads and Italians (and of course, iGentry).
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
  16. AJL

    AJL Senior member

    Messages:
    2,628
    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2004
    

    Looks like it's you against the SF world on this one, mimo (also a fan of 3r2).
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
  17. archibaldleach

    archibaldleach Senior member

    Messages:
    5,225
    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2006
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    

    Personally, I've never cared for it. If the lapel is rolling to the second button anyway, then the top button just seems kind of superfluous to me. Just seems like a 2 button suit with a third button on top for show. Really hard for me to imagine how this makes the suit in any way more elegant than a normal 2 button suit.
     
  18. archibaldleach

    archibaldleach Senior member

    Messages:
    5,225
    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2006
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    ^ In the interest of full disclosure, I am seriously considering getting every suit and odd jacket I order from now on with only one button. I figure if I don't like it, I can always have additional buttons / buttonholes put in.
     
    1 person likes this.
  19. AJL

    AJL Senior member

    Messages:
    2,628
    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2004
    

    Isn't there a different buttoning point for a single button jacket, therefore, wouldn't the buttoning point be off if you added a 2nd one? Never owned a single button jacket, so just a guess.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2014
  20. archibaldleach

    archibaldleach Senior member

    Messages:
    5,225
    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2006
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    

    The button that is actually being used, whether it be in a 3r2, 2 button or 1 button should be at pretty similar points I believe to preserve the fit and lines of the jacket. I may use a slightly lower buttoning point for a 1 button jacket, but we're probably talking about 0.5 inches or so. I can't imagine the difference being that dramatic.
     

Share This Page

Styleforum is proudly sponsored by