Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Claghorn, Jan 6, 2014.
Many thanks for introducing me to the world of Zilli! Never was a brand more aptly named.
Shoot! My Formosa is stuck in Batimore! It's just an hour away but they say I have to wait two more days!!!
Stitchy will wear it for you.
I have one particular yacht-owning type friend, and frankly I'd be surprised if he'd heard of Kiton: he and most I know seem to go for the ones they see in magazines in airport lounges, just like anyone. LV, Gucci, all that stuff...and in his case, my particular offence is taking to his love of Ferragamo shoes, paying top dollar with absolute willful indifference to the Studio/LO/Tramezza distinction. I've tried to explain. I don't think he cares. But I see guys in Abu Dhabi airport paying $500+ for glued together Ferragamo loafers and I feel like weeping.
A lot of rich people are smart, but they're interested in what they're interested in. That guy knows a lot about a lot of things. It just doesn't bother him that shoes are not one of those things.
Most people who wanna dress fancy will inevitably choose the nicest they can afford + the nicest they are aware of. Hence so many uber rich wearing stuff we scoff at. Thats all they know of. That is the peak of what they know is out there.
The only really rich person that I knew was very very rich with friends both in Washington and on Wall St. But I was suprised to see his secretary picking up suits from JosABanks. I mean a guy who owns a huge boat that has a landing pad for choppers, lives in the same neighborhood as the rich politicians. But he was into flying and boats.
^^ Exactly, Stitchy...plenty don't know, and don't care to know. If it's expensive and they've heard of it, it must be good.
Armani is Satan.
Armani makes some lovely stuff.
Maybe not suits that are as good as SR or Naples or some such obviously, but the other design lead outerwear and knitwear etc can be really nice. You are just not going to get those aesthetics anywhere else either.
This forum can be very snobby about fashion brands that are high end, but, if you're not wearing the logo heavy stuff, and the aesthetic suits your taste, I really don't understand the hatred on here for Armani, Gucci etc? Walk past any of those store windows and there are some very stylish mannequins often on display.
The reverse is also equally true - going high end bespoke is not going to make someone tasteful or well dressed. Other than fit of course. I have seen some truly awful expensive SR suits which scream "new money" (not that I am old money. Or new) stuff like tacky coloured stitching to indicate its bespoke, or loud linings.... Ditto.
The hate is this: as I understand it, ALL Armani suits other than their MTO and bespoke items, are fused. That means made in the same cheap, nasty way as something you'd buy in the supermarket. Sure, the shape and cloth might be nicer, but that's a bad suit for $3k upwards, when you can get a good suit for half that. I consider that dishonest, an abuse of the assumption that brands are about quality.
What I also loathe is that they put their name on such meritless rubbish that doesn't even pretend to be expensive: crap T-shirt, Chinese watches, anything.
Sure, someone might choose something of questionable taste going bespoke, but at least they'll get what they think they're paying for.
Gucci is also Satan. So there.
Prada is the devil too...but I wonder what happens to their status since the Chinese bought them.
Among my wealthier clients, one gets Kiton bespoke (big law--I've seen the suits come shipped from Italy in wooden crates), one has mostly Saville Row bespoke, and another LV, Gucci, Prada, in the template mimo suggests. Most of the others dress fairly unmemorably.
Aren't there any rich guiz here?? Or are the real titans too busy making their zilli(ons) to waste valuable time canoodling w/ the pocket square set?
I think the rich dudes are too busy on the Super car forum.
@ SF, or somewhere else? I guess "horology" threads might be another place where M's of the U might hang out ("my complication's more complicated than yours"). And big boats. And fine art appreciation (monetary not aesthetic)
The only guy who springs to mind in the Watch thread does go bespoke for suits and shirts. But he's on SF, so you'd expect him to have some standards.
Have you ever thought that these companies expand the market?
They act as the gateway drug to guys who then learn more about clothes. Years ago I only wore brands. Now,my stuff is largely all bespoke, or certainly by otherwise fairly unknown Italian brands. Do I regret buying Armani / Gucci back then? Not at all. I felt great at the time, and it was better than 99% of the stuff on the high street I saw as the only alternative. I saved for it all and never spent more than I could afford.
Let's also slay some myths.
"Armani (example brand but could choose any) suits are too dear for what they are"
Here's the truth. Armani / Tom Ford suits were never ever intended to be worn by the average salary man. As far as I know, they have always been priced basically to cater to a man who would be deemed as "wealthy" to most.
The problem I see on these forums are the guys who are average earners who run around screeming "Armani is not worth the money, I can get my local tailor to make something much better for less cost!!!!!!!"
That's probably true.
But to the man who can truly afford Armani and who doesn't have to say months to buy one of their suits, he may well prefer the convenience and quickness of just stopping by the Armani boutique and picking up a suit for a night out, or maybe because he just saw an advert and liked the look of it for his next presentation in work. This is the same action you or I might take at the Levi's store let's say when we want to try a new colour pair of jeans. It's by no means something he is planning to wear forever and ever to be judged as the absolute pinnacle of tailoring. He knows you would have to go to savile row for that. Maybe he doesn't care for that ritual. It's "good enough" for what he requires it to be, and yes, there is the prestige of the label inside for someone who is otherwise fairly ignorant about full canvassing, working cuffs, thread counts whatever. .... But the key point is, he can afford it comfortably so there is no 'risk' involved in making the purchase because it's just a nice suit to him.
He is NOT of the stylfeorum / iGent mindset, which is more about "I want to be the most stylish guy in the universe or at least the room, wearing the best quality there is, but all on my average salary and will complain when products I don't deem worthy charge a price I do not feel is worth the cost / benefit analysis when I feel it could be sold more cheaply based on the quality of fabric/construction"
Unfortunately, I feel a lot of guys are complaining about brands on here that they probably don't have the disposable income to truly afford anyway.
Like those guys who say "I don't see the point of a Lamborghini or Bentley, it's just a car". When you've truly got enough disposable income for those cars, then you can say what you would or wouldn't do in that guy's position. Until then, you're stuck in the average salary mentality which simply can't comprehend what it would be like to have the spare money available to buy such a car.
When you start with the correct mindset "Giorgio Armani, Tom ford, Gucci, Prada clothes are all basically for guys who have a lot of disposable income and who want to be able to buy something quickly which fits fairly well and is of decent quality with a high end design of the moment"
Yes. But my point is that it is no longer of decent quality, and has therefore transitioned from elitist to fraudulent. Armani went from hand-sewn to fused in a generation. Lamborghinis just keep going faster.
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