General Bike Thread (Desiderata, Questions, Pics)

[Fueco]

By ‘practice with both feet’ do you guys mean practice unclipping both feet simultaneously? Or just unclip both feet, even if it’s one at a time. I rode around the neighborhood and it’s easier if i concentrate on one foot at a time. I see what you guys mean about getting tempted to just unclip one foot - it’s easier to unclip once, as well as when you have to get going again, you already have one point of contact clipped onto the drivetrain and only have to worry about clipping one thing in…

Out for a more extensive ride, brb

Not necessarily at first, but there are times when unclipping simultaneously is helpful (I’ve done it a few times in recent mountain bike rides when I stalled out on a root or rock on the trail.

 

[otc]

Yeah, I just meant "be good at doing it with either foot"

On the road it is pretty unlikely that you would need to do BOTH at once. On an MTB, if you're bailing from a crash you certainly want to be able to unclip both feet together.

But I kinda think that would just come naturally once you have the unclipping muscle memory down on both sides alone. Probably not something you need to practice.

 

[Piobaire]

Also, don't forget you can set the force required to clip out on most pedal quite easily. My Shimano's is just a hex key at the back of the pedal. Set it as low as you're comfortable with for easy clip outs.

 

[otc]

See here at about 1:35 (he's on flats, but talks about being clipped in)


Shows a bunch of 2-foot bails from crashes (and appears to be filmed in Florida)

 

[bicycleradical]

On the road it is pretty unlikely that you would need to do BOTH at once. On an MTB, if you're bailing from a crash you certainly want to be able to unclip both feet together.

When riding The Whole Enchilada in Moab, I was at the bottom of the Burro Pass trail, riding at speed in between the aspens. Somewhere in the woods, I clipped a tree with my handlebar. Right after hitting the tree, I managed to unclip from both pedals and once and land on my feet. It was all done on instinct.

Unclipping from both pedals at once is definitely a useful skill.

 

[patrick_b]

Just have a mantra of "unclip, unclip, unclip" any time you slow to a stop. I'd go so far as to unclip one foot anytime you hit the brakes for the first few days. And always lean/weight shift to the unclipped side. That is really the worst, when your left foot is unclipped but you slowly start to fall onto your right side and forget that foot is still clipped in. It's happened to us all.

Most right hand/right leg dominant will unclip the left foot as they come to a stop. Then when you start pedaling, your dominant foot is already clipped in.

Note, if you fall on a trail in the woods and nobody is there to see it then it didn't really happen. If you fall at a stoplight, there will inevitably be dozens of cars and pedestrians around watching it happen.

 

[HRoi]

Welp…I already took one fall. One foot didn’t get unclipped and naturally my weight shifted to that foot’s side.

I’d been taking my practice stops in people’s lawns so at least it was on grass. Hopefully no one was home ?

 

[patrick_b]

So after riding MTB pedals and shoes for 20 years, I decided to give road shoes and pedals a shot. My MTB needed pedals so rather than buy new MTB pedals, I threw the XTR SPD's from my road bike back on the MTB and ponied up for [stupid expensive] S-Works shoes and Ultegra pedals.

I wore the shoes for several hours in the house on different days before I installed cleats to ensure the shoes fit. Once cleats are installed they aren't returnable. Cleat install went relatively simply. I use the method of marking the shoe at ball of foot (bony protrusion on the inside of the foot) and lining up the center of the cleat slightly behind that mark.

My MTB cleats were set up by my fit guy and are pain free. I measured the distance from center of the MTB cleat to that bony protrusion and set up the center of the road cleats to the same distance behind the ball of the foot/bony protrusion mark. I've always erred on the side of slightly farther back is better than too far forward. I raised the seat by a couple mm to make up for the difference between recessed MTB cleats.

Finally rode them this week. Took a 45 min ride and they felt OK. The added stiffness is very noticeable (TWSS). Second ride was just under 2 hours and I got terribly numb toes on both feet. Yesterday's ride was just as bad. I halved my regular 2 hour loop due to foot discomfort.

Shoes are much stiffer than my old ones. I'm fairly certain the shoe fits well but I'm less certain in my cleat setup. Any of you long term road shoe guys have any thoughts on cleat setup? Could a stiffer shoe result in toe numbness?

 

[UnFacconable]

Ugh.

Talked to Fezzari and they can get me a Large Delano Peak in 2-3 weeks. Or they can get me an Extra Large in...January or February.

I'm gonna send them my detailed measurements and see what they say, but from trying to decipher some geometry charts, I am pretty sure the answer is XL.

I can’t remember- have you looked into the new rider area distance model of MTB fitting? Long story short, as bikes have become slacker, people are ending up riding larger bikes than they should be using traditional bike fitting rubrics. I know you are an expert and probably have a pretty good feel, but just something to consider. I have always felt that getting a slightly smaller bike gives you a more nimble ride without much downside. Particularly on an MTB, and the RAD system seems to reinforce that, especially with more modern geometries.

I've always erred on the side of slightly farther back is better than too far forward.

I have some knee issues from cycling and one of the things I’ve learned is that it can be better to set your cleats farther forward for better knee positioning. Would be careful moving it back too far. Numbness could also be from the shoe being too tight - I noticed it on my shoes only after adding some shims which reduced room in the toe box. Maybe it will break in after more wear?

 

[Fueco]

So after riding MTB pedals and shoes for 20 years, I decided to give road shoes and pedals a shot. My MTB needed pedals so rather than buy new MTB pedals, I threw the XTR SPD's from my road bike back on the MTB and ponied up for [stupid expensive] S-Works shoes and Ultegra pedals.

I wore the shoes for several hours in the house on different days before I installed cleats to ensure the shoes fit. Once cleats are installed they aren't returnable. Cleat install went relatively simply. I use the method of marking the shoe at ball of foot (bony protrusion on the inside of the foot) and lining up the center of the cleat slightly behind that mark.

My MTB cleats were set up by my fit guy and are pain free. I measured the distance from center of the MTB cleat to that bony protrusion and set up the center of the road cleats to the same distance behind the ball of the foot/bony protrusion mark. I've always erred on the side of slightly farther back is better than too far forward. I raised the seat by a couple mm to make up for the difference between recessed MTB cleats.

Finally rode them this week. Took a 45 min ride and they felt OK. The added stiffness is very noticeable (TWSS). Second ride was just under 2 hours and I got terribly numb toes on both feet. Yesterday's ride was just as bad. I halved my regular 2 hour loop due to foot discomfort.

Shoes are much stiffer than my old ones. I'm fairly certain the shoe fits well but I'm less certain in my cleat setup. Any of you long term road shoe guys have any thoughts on cleat setup? Could a stiffer shoe result in toe numbness?

Toe numbness, in my experience, is caused either by shoes that are too narrow or cleats that are too far forward. I have wide feet and wear the SWORKS shoes (both road and mountain), so I doubt the former is your issue, unless your shoes are too short.

Try moving the cleats back just a little to see if that helps.

 

[Piobaire]

I've never gotten numb toes due to the stiffness of the shoe but have from bad cleat placement.

There's more than the back/fore placement too, there's rotation along the axis of your foot. I fractured my right femur when I was a young'un and that cleat needs to point in a bit vs. the left. You can get numb toes from the cleat's directional point as your natural limb rotation will cause pressure on your foot as it wants to rotate how it wants to rotate.

Two other thoughts would first be a small change in cleat position can make a large difference in feel...make small adjustments. The other is just really concentrate on how each foot feels and visualize how you think the cleat needs to be moved. Stop somewhere you can sit down and make those small adjustments on the ride for instant feedback.

 

[patrick_b]

or cleats that are too far forward

That makes sense. I'll try adjusting cleats back a mm at a time.

I too have slightly wide feet and tried on the regular and wide versions of the S-Works shoes. Ended up with a wide 45 which is snug but I can move my toes around. Their sizing chart had me in a 44.5 (11US) but my toes were cramped so I went up a half size. That's the beauty of EU sizing IMO. Much smaller increments.

Try moving the cleats back just a little to see if that helps.

The hard part is that each cleat adjustment takes an hour to see if it worked or not. My first ride was 45 min and it was fine. Pain didn't start until after being on the bike for an hour or so. I was trying to avoid using the fit guy for cleat setup (as I'm impatient and he's always booked 2-3 weeks out) but he worked wonders on my Sidi MTB shoes & SPD cleats. I had numb toes before I went to him and he solved it completely.

The other is just really concentrate on how each foot feels and visualize how you think the cleat needs to be moved. Stop somewhere you can sit down and make those small adjustments on the ride for instant feedback.

Well said. I'm surprised at the increased amount of float on the yellow shimano cleats. Way more than I'm accustomed to with the MTB cleats but I like it. Not sure I'd ever need the more fixed versions.

 

[otc]

I can’t remember- have you looked into the new rider area distance model of MTB fitting? Long story short, as bikes have become slacker, people are ending up riding larger bikes than they should be using traditional bike fitting rubrics. I know you are an expert and probably have a pretty good feel, but just something to consider. I have always felt that getting a slightly smaller bike gives you a more nimble ride without much downside. Particularly on an MTB, and the RAD system seems to reinforce that, especially with more modern geometries.


I have some knee issues from cycling and one of the things I’ve learned is that it can be better to set your cleats farther forward for better knee positioning. Would be careful moving it back too far. Numbness could also be from the shoe being too tight - I noticed it on my shoes only after adding some shims which reduced room in the toe box. Maybe it will break in after more wear?

My return to MTB is still very new, so even though I can ride some expert trails...I have no idea what I am talking about with a lot of stuff, especially FS bikes.

Someone in the fezzari thread on one of the forums actually linked to some RAD videos and I've been meaning to check them out.

Neat thing about fezzari is that even though they are DTC, they are based in SLC and build each bike to order rather than just shipping a stock build. So you give them a bunch of detailed measurements (including things like shoulder width) and they try to get the bike set up for you out of the box by choosing different stem lengths, dropper sizes, etc. Most people report the shocks even arrive dialed in to the right sag.


Need to take my current bike and see how close I am to ideal. Guessing I come up a little short as I have been pondering trying out a riser bar.

 

[sugarbutch]

After a fair amount of experimentation, I just put the cleats as far back as they'll go on the shoe.

 

[patrick_b]

After a fair amount of experimentation, I just put the cleats as far back as they'll go on the shoe.

I watched that in my research and he makes a ton of sense. In the end I decided mirroring my current setup *should* work. I'm now realizing that different shoes, type of cleat and new pedal system all make matching the old measurements a fairly tall order. He makes a great point that all the way back can do no harm. That's a pretty goo starting point IMO.

I moved them back about a mm, which seems like a lot when you look at the shoe. Headed out now for a ride. This loop is 32 miles over 2 hrs. Fingers crossed my adjustment helps but I can always stop and adjust it rearward mid ride as Piob mentioned.