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French Tailoring Thread (e.g. Camps de Luca, Cifonelli, Smalto and etc.)

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by poorsod, Apr 28, 2013.

  1. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    I think the Crompton's A&S DB also looks better than his Cifonelli DB.


    You might be right that they are the same. I was thinking about this for a while and wasn't sure one way or the other.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2013
  2. Eustace Tilley

    Eustace Tilley Senior member

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    Thanks for your reply. Would you have any pics of your CdL?
     
  3. dirnelli

    dirnelli Senior member

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    Re price-tag, it is increasingly rare that I should hear of, let alone meet, any actual French clients of Camps or Cifonelli. I hear there are some, but I'm beginning to suspect it's an urban legend... It seems like the whole business has gone international: Russians, African rulers, Gulf, Asia, etc.

    Nevertheless, for those less well-heeled, there is an abundant local offering of made-to-measure tailoring, at just about every price. It's actually a business that's on the up and up in Paris. It seems like every young kid is starting up a business selling made-to-measure shirts and/or suits, trying to capture the current menswear spending bubble. With made-to-measure prices that are now pretty much in line with what the average man is willing to pay for a ready to wear suit, most parisians are buying made-to-measure suits at the low end of the price range. The guy who seems to have cornered the market is Gambler, who sells ten-thousand €500 MTM suits a year out of a 10 m² hole in the wall at Madeleine. Close second is Handson around the corner.
     
  4. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    Last edited: May 5, 2013
  5. dirnelli

    dirnelli Senior member

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    Last edited: May 5, 2013
  6. Shirtmaven

    Shirtmaven Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I wear my fathers suits from Smalto and Feruch.
    if you saw them in person, you would understand why NSM turns me off.
    strong shoulders, fully padded canvas, but with a high armhole.
    needle work is sublime.

    i will take some photos of my father's shirts from Lanvin. these date back to the 70's/80s
    the finest shirts i have ever seen. they put charvet to shame..
    RJman sent me a recent version(last 5 years) shirt from lanvin.
    not even close in work man-ship

    .
     
    2 people like this.
  7. clee1982

    clee1982 Senior member

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  8. clee1982

    clee1982 Senior member

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    alternatively you can have Chinese making them in Italy...
     
  9. Kuro

    Kuro Senior member

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  10. YRR92

    YRR92 Senior member

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    Dirnelli:

    When you say you've had the lapels "recut" to resemble the CdL shape on your other suits, do you mean that you ordered it that way when you had them made, or are they somehow altered from a peak lapel into that Parisian shape?

    Great tumblr, BTW. I've followed you.
     
  11. gambit50

    gambit50 Senior member

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    Go all the way, made by Chinese in China.

    Caruso making garments in China is not something one should be excited about.
     
  12. Kuro

    Kuro Senior member

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    can you also repost the picture of the silk db?
     
  13. dirnelli

    dirnelli Senior member

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    The ever-astute RJMan PM's this correct from beyond the SF grave:

    "The old Chester Barrie handmade RTW was made in England.

    Chester Barrie now is made in Italy and half-canvassed. Has been for the last two or three years or so."

    Thanks RJ, I stand corrected.
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. mmkn

    mmkn Senior member

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    Good thing you clarified. Would go to CdL based on gray but not blue.

    - M
     
  15. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    Thanks. Correction added.
     
  16. mack11211

    mack11211 Senior member

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    Without going too far off-topic, let me correct this correction.

    The last good Huntsman RTW was sometimes made for them in England by the old Chester Barrie, and sometimes made for them in Italy by someone else.

    Current Chester Barrie, as RJMan notes, has little in common with the old except some intellectual property.

    Some of the old Chester Barrie staff & skill survives under the deliberately CB-sounding name of Cheshire Bespoke, still made in Crewe, England.

    Back on topic: I am searching my photo archive for other Cifonelli and Smalto bespoke I have sold in the past, So far, all I can find is this rear shot of a very bold plaid Smalto made in 1979:

    [​IMG]

    That's some color for you! But the colorway and the coat itself were all very well balanced.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2013
  17. andreyb2

    andreyb2 Senior member

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    Here is how Arnys' windows look right now:

    [​IMG]

    You can still see traces of "Arnys" name up there.

    Andrey
     
  18. ThinkDerm

    ThinkDerm Senior member

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    damn shame.

    berluti clothing is coming to Mad Ave also.
     
  19. dirnelli

    dirnelli Senior member

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    Thanks!

    Obsessed as I was by the CdL notch lapel, but equally deterred by the price, I undertook to commission several made-to-measure copies of that lapel, on the cheap. These somewhat unsucessful experiments, and their intermediate stages, are all documented on my Tumblr if you look closely.

    In one instance, I found an MTM tailor whose standard notch lapel was somewhat similar to CdL, but his fishmouth was too closed -- I had him open up the notch by a few milimeters, and it came out looking pretty close to the original (Di Castri blue suit). Another time I asked him to copy my CdL suit from scratch, but that was such a disaster that I quasi-gifted the result to a friend, just to get it out of my sight (Di Castri blue pinstripe suit).

    I also asked my tailor in Hong Kong to make a CdL copy, but it too ended up pretty far off the mark, so I had to buy extra fabric and have my alterations tailor in Paris redo the collar from scratch -- it did come out looking pretty close to the original in the end (New Kingston Fashion medium gray suit.)

    I'm currently in the process of another such copy/alteration on a Handson MTM suit, we'll see what comes of it.

    Lastly, I had asked Scavini to make a copy of the CdL notch lapel, but his attempt looked more like Guilson's notch lapel, which was to be expected since Guilson is his teacher and mentor at the Paris Tailor's School. Although Guilson's notch lapel is in line with the historical 'cran parisien', it still doesn't look like CdL's lapel and, the way it's cut, I won't be able to alter Sacavini's suit to make it more similar to CdL unfortunately.

    BTW -- I also attempted a Smalto copy by my Hong Kong tailor, but it's not satisfactory either. Not such a big deal as that particular cut is readily available in Smalto RTW.
     
  20. andreyb2

    andreyb2 Senior member

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    You haven't seen real shame yet... *This* is the shame (and as I understand, used to house a bespoke department many years ago as well).

    [​IMG]

    Andrey
     
    1 person likes this.

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