Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by poorsod, Apr 28, 2013.
Pictures from a recent Camps de Luca fitting, taken from a Chinese site:
You are talking about Cifonelli as if it were Dior Homme. I think the branding and marketing perspective of the house is fine, meaning that they offer a top bespoke offer and that for people that don't want to invest that much, they have a RTW line and alterations are made by Cifo which would already flatter/reassure/make customers happy. They've done it for a while and I don't think that it's a bad move. i'm actually convinced that it provides them with a better return on investment compared to bespoke.
Once again, the RTW models can't have high armholes and specific fits as they're made for an average man.
And I guess Berluti is the same - offering both.
I personally find it a bit of a turn off that there is a discounted line available and that it is made by different people. Takes a bit of gloss off for me. Having said that it won't stop me from getting some jackets from them when I next visit.
I'm not sure that I understand your point about the turnoff from being made elsewhere. ALL RTW is made elsewehere, except that from brands that own their factories -- e.g. Tom Ford is not made by Tom Ford, it's made for Tom Ford by some italian factory (Caruso? Zegna?), whereas Zegna is indeed made by Zegna, who owns factories and can make for themselves and for others. Very few RTW brands own factories, and most of the top RTW brands are made by a handful of italian factories such as Zegna, Caruso, Santandrews, ISAIA, Belvest, et al. So, in my view, there is nothing shocking in offering a wellmade RTW line made elsewhere. A Caruso suit made for Cifo will be a very different suit from a Caruso for RLPL or RLBL, because each brand will come to the maker with very different styling, pattern and construction specs.
PS. Cifo uses Caruso 'Gold Finsish' which is their top of the line specs.
I just think it cheapens the brand. But that's obviously just my problem.
Out of interest, do you know if Berluti make their own RTW?
Sorry to break it to you, but Berluti RTW is made elsewhere, as are 99% of luxury RTW brands. It's kind of like watches, there are only a handful of Swiss companies making the mechanisms that the other watch brands are all using.
There are other SF threads devoted to informing about who makes for what RTW brands, I suggest you have a look, to find out who's making what. Those threads will teach you to recognize the technical labels coming from each factory. Once you know the fonts of the Caruso inside label, you start to see it in alot of places.
Here are a few match-ups to get you started:
Smalto RTW = Caruso
Arnys RTW = Caruso
Hartwood RTW = Caruso
Basile RTW = Mabro
Louis Vuitton RTW = Mabro (partly)
For ties at well known French RTW brands, I would say that in 9 cases out of 10 they are being made by Boivin.
Thanks (kind of).
I think their is no real marketing at Cifonelli... They are too busy to do marketing. ; )
They are making RTW for people that can't go on bespoke, but want to have a well-fitted suit.
Like SeamasterLux and I said, Cifonelli RTW suit alterations are made in house and of course you will not have high end armholes.
Personally, I'm verry happy about my RTW Cifonelli suit, Lorenzo Cifonelli did the fitting with me, I got my suit few weeks later.
If you're doing RTW, it's seasonal. And because it's seasonal, you need a turnover in your collection.
So it's normal to be on sales !
ps : Tom Ford RTW is made by Zegna Couture standards.
Good news !
"Maison Francesco Smalto will present a Bespoke collection in 2014
Maison Francesco Smalto has a strong desire to focus all its actions on its Bespoke know-how: indeed, the House is currently creating and manufacturing in its Parisian workshop, a unique and outstanding bespoke pieces collection, which will be presented in Paris in 2014. This collection will also be unveiled during itinerant and didactic events on key markets: United States, Middle-East and Russia. Buyers and journalists will discover the uniqueness and excellence of the Francesco Smalto workshops, in the presence of the Master Tailors of the House. De facto, the Maison will be absent of the Ready-to-wear Men’s fashion week calendar in January 2014.
More than ever marked with a long-standing Bespoke know-how tradition, the Fall Winter 2014/15 Francesco Smalto Ready-to-wear collection will be presented to the buyers by appointment in the showroom of the House located at 2, rue de Bassano in Paris.
A direction as a statement: the Bespoke tailoring - a historic and rare savoir-faire, pillar of all the creations and actions taken by the House: ready-to-wear and accessories, communication, events, partnerships and commercial activities."
Just for information for those who are in Marseilles these days: there's a french tailor named Jean Rotin (an old man. Actually there is no many tailors left in Marseilles, only three as far as I know). He works only with Scabal and is very flexible regarding the desideratas (do we say "desiderata" in english?) of the customers. Starting with EUR 800 a two pieces suits (fully canevassed obviously) if you bring your own cloth. The waistcoat costs EUR 300 more.
He made me a suit for my wedding and I am starting a three pieces suit with him.
A pic of a morning jacket :
Many thanks - interesting to see the work of non-Paris based tailors!
Allez l'OM! I haven't seen that logo since I lived in Aix-en-Provence many, many years ago.
Hope you're still following the team! Allez l'OM! You were a student there?
Separate names with a comma.