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French Tailoring Thread (e.g. Camps de Luca, Cifonelli, Smalto and etc.)

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by poorsod, Apr 28, 2013.

  1. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    BTW did you finally work with Gabriel Gonzalez at Cifonelli? Does he cut differently from the others?


    Thanks for the links. In the Brano Paris gallery, he seems to be cutting the LL blue shetland with the reddish brown overcheck. Interesting. I wonder who makes with him.

    I also found the Le Monde article about David Diagne.
    http://bespoke.blog.lemonde.fr/2007...e-d’un-tailleur-de-la-nouvelle-generation-12/
    http://bespoke.blog.lemonde.fr/2009...e-d’un-tailleur-de-la-nouvelle-generation-22/
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2013


  2. fassbinder

    fassbinder Senior member

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    Although some dislike the more exaggerated style of modern Cifo, as modeled by Alexander Kraft,


    [​IMG]


    and yearn for the old lost Parisian (and perhaps equally exaggerated) drappy style of Jean Gabbin,

    [​IMG]


    there is in fact a more moderate, yet distinctly Parisian, bespoke style that one often sees worn by older gentleman of a certain means, class and/or status if one knows where to look. I believe this style is well represented by the author Jean d'Ormesson

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

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    But this is just one man's opinion based on everyday observation. Any other keen observers of Parisian bespoke want to comment?
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2013


  3. mack11211

    mack11211 Senior member

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    For those of you who want some Smalto bespoke on the cheap, I'm selling one here:

    Made for the same client as the one JefferyD dissected.

    I've sold hundreds of bespoke coats, examining them all. The Smalto really is a beautifully made garment.
     


  4. Kuro

    Kuro Senior member

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    Last edited: May 1, 2013


  5. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    This is what made me reach out to Cifonelli.

    [​IMG]
     


  6. Eustace Tilley

    Eustace Tilley Senior member

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    I have seen dozens of pics of that Alexander Kraft guy in Cifo, and he has never struck me as looking that good. Is his stuff indicative of their style?
     


  7. Kuro

    Kuro Senior member

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    in the lapels. the shoulder line definitely (the roping varies to desire). i think his look are his stylistic choices...

    my suits are a little looser and simpler (e.g. besom pockets). also my pants aren't as slim.

    they seem to be on 3 piece kick. jacket on beard guy looks too short for my taste..
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2013


  8. fassbinder

    fassbinder Senior member

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    I am also a fan of their 70s and 80s work for Lino Ventura :

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    But like Mitterand this was undoubtedly the work of Adriano Cifonelli (and not his son and nephew who are currently running the house).
     


  9. fassbinder

    fassbinder Senior member

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    yes the shoulder line and lapels of Kraft's jackets are definitely standard cifo. Also the minimal, yet clearly defined, chest and the shape of the sleeves also seem to be modern cifo hallmarks. They also seem to generally cut a close jacket, minimal/no draping, very high armhole and a defined waist. I agree that the amount of roping varies, and I find Krafts to be excessive,but the roping is part of their house look. Camps also has distinct shoulder roping. I lalso agree that the hacking pockets and extremely fitted appearance of Kraft's clothes seem to be his style choices. Unlike camps or smalto, cifo's lapel notch is less "parisian" although still somewhat distinctive. Their jackets also may have a bit of a flaired skirt. I believe a very large part of the French houses' business is for clients who demand lighter weight and luxury suitings. And I believe their style was developed for and is well suited for this type of cloth, as Mr. De Lucca postulates in RJMans essay. Unlike Saville Row the first thing presented to a new client at a French house will not be the 13oz Lesser or Smiths.

    Also as previously stated, the quality of the finishing at the major French houses is unmatched.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2013


  10. Kuro

    Kuro Senior member

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    lots of olland & sherry and drApears...

    lino's stuff is nice.

    looser please has been a comment at all my fittings..
     


  11. dieworkwear

    dieworkwear Senior member

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    This is a great idea for a thread, poorsod. Thanks for starting it.

    A few years ago, The Parisian Gentleman did a couple of short posts at Permanent Style. You can see an interview by him with Lorenzo Cifonelli here.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2013


  12. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    Thanks!

    I have been reminded that RJMan wrote an article on Will's blog regarding Smalto and the 50th anniversary book.

    Francesco Smalto and French Tailoring

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2013


  13. jefferyd

    jefferyd Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    One thing that absolutely distinguishes French tailoring is the level of attention to detail, particularly in the finishing. English finishing is generally poor to adequate, Italian finishing is generally clean yet unremarkable, whereas French finishing is generally a work of art. The garment must be as attractive inside as it is outside, and a lot of the details tend toward displays of virtuosity. It's almost obsessive for them. I studied haute couture under someone who had worked in YSL's atelier and this was definitely something that was a part of the French culture.
     


  14. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    Would you mind giving some specific examples of the French method of finishing? In your review of Smalto I noticed the buttonholes were beautiful. But what else do you see? Thanks.
     


  15. jefferyd

    jefferyd Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    The label is set into a pocket which is very laborious to make and serves no purpose other than to draw attention to the amount of work done on the garment. It's the tailoring equivalent of melisma- a "see what I can do?".

    [​IMG]

    The French are obsessed with the Boutonniere Milanaise which is also incredibly laborious and difficult.

    [​IMG]

    The pocket jets are finished by hand

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    The linings are felled by hand using a type of stitch which is at least twice as long if not three times as long to do than the usual method.

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    A few stitches would suffice to tack the lining. Instead, they embroider the "S" for Smalto
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    The cut edges, which are concealed under the lining, have been overcast by hand to prevent fraying. I have never seen this on an English garment, but is typical of couture.
    [​IMG]
     


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