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Forum feels clogged

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by lordofpi, Dec 20, 2013.

  1. Naive Jr.

    Naive Jr. Senior member

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    That's a very funny question because if one looks at the youngsters on the Filson bag thread discussing the market, one gets the impression this website is an exercise station for future economic experts in marketing. If someone wants to know how to satisfy his or her needs, this person must reflect if he or she has formulated what he or she needs so that the listener or reader understands. Here there are two assumptions: 1. Are these needs essential? 2. Why this particular listener or reader? (I transformed assumption into question.)
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2013
  2. PhiloVance

    PhiloVance Senior member

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    This is an interesting thread, although its a bit weird to see people talking about the "old" and "new" forums when most of the posters joined after 2010 (although I guess anyone can go back and read old threads, but who really does that? So I wonder if people actually appreciate how different the forum used to be). But I agree with Doc's sentiment, for the most part. When I first found SF, I posted very little but enjoyed posts from a variety of members, even members who tended to take heat from all sides like FNB. I think its also safe to say that when I first started lurking, I knew very little about clothing, shoes, etc. so arguably anyone would have seemed more knowledgeable.

    To me, the greatest difference is that before 2008-2009 (in my mind, chronologically, I think of Spoo's rise as the turning point - as I believe he was the first vendor to achieve a certain level of popularity on SF), it seemed like if I was involved in a thread about Edward Green shoes, that conversation was between a group of people who were primarily customers/fans. I think it was rare that shoemakers or retailers chimed in back then. Over time, that dynamic has changed dramatically, which isn't say its abad thing. But now, a thread like the EG appreciation thread is primarily stimulated by retailers and affiliate vendors posting images of new models for sale. There are certainly benefits to those voices joining the forum - certainly, the new Foster & Son thread has been very interesting to read, and they have embraced the idea of reaching out to their current/potential customer base - but, for me anyway, there is a difference between chatting with shoe enthusiasts who are buying shoes and shoe enthusiasts who are ultimately trying to sell shoes (this may just be a figment of my imagination).

    All of that being said, I think unbelragazzo's last post is also pretty accurate, at least for me personally. When I felt like I had nothing new to add to SF, I found other ways to continue/expand on the discussions that I wanted to have, presumably with the type of people that I wanted to connect with via blogs, books, magazines, etc.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2013
  3. archetypal_yuppie

    archetypal_yuppie Senior member

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    The most interesting threads (for me), are the deep dives. Things like jeffryd's(sp?) suit construction stuff, or StuBloom's(sp?) fabricare stuff, or AmericanGent's Matuozzo stuff or the bespoke bags or shoes pictorials. And they spawn all kinds of entertaining clusterfuck arguments.

    I would venture to guess that many members/lurkers would agree.

    If this was my forum, one of my strategic imperatives would be to incentivize these deep dives and all of their permutations. I don't know if LA Guy partners with unbelragazzo for his vendor puff-pieces or not, but that is one strategy.

    While a lot of ground has already been covered, there's plenty that has not. Finding ways to engage CEGO or JLP or Charvet etc to document the ins and outs and variations (beyond "here is their fitting room and cloths and the finished product") would provide more fodder.

    I have no idea on the economics of the site, which obviously impacts what kinds of incentives are doable.
     
  4. TM79

    TM79 Senior member

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    That's exactly what I did.

    Why? Because when I joined, I could tell who the "good" posters were but they were usually arguing with each other and talking about when the forums were better - namely Vox, Manton, and Foo but also others.

    Since classic style is just that, it's not like some threads from a year or two before I joined would be outdated. So I read them. And I appreciated those a lot more than most threads that have sprung up since I joined.

    A lot of forums adopt the whole hivemind thing so I guess it's like ... those posters were probably the creators of it or played a large part in that whereas others simply parrot what they learned so it doesn't mean as much.

    That isn't to say the brands and recommendations made here aren't good - most are. But I just don't see anyone challenging it in a good way. The only challengers are more like new posters not ready to admit they know nothing, so they'll argue that a 1" lapel and skinny tie doesn't look like utter trash.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2013
    1 person likes this.
  5. FlyingMonkey

    FlyingMonkey Senior member

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    I recognize the feeling that those complaining have, but I also think that Unbelragazzo has a point. However, members can't just remake the forum, if they ever could have done so. The decision by SF's owners to 'add value' to the site, and the deluge of affiliate vendors, has changed both the feel and structure of the site in some ways for better but in other ways for worse. Now many of the affiliates are of course members, and others become members and contribute elsewhere on the site, and those affiliates, I generally appreciate. I am far more dubious about those who are just here for the hard sell and especially if their products clearly lack the kind of quality that we are all, I hope, trying to encourage. I don't think I even need to say which ones I mean. I recognise that the site owners have every right to earn a living, but I would like to see a little more attention to quality control / vendor selection. Ideally, I'd also prefer vendor threads sectioned, but clear colour marking would be a good second choice.
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. PhiloVance

    PhiloVance Senior member

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    TM79 - that is great that you did go back. I do that as well from time to time, when searching for a particular subject. But occasionally I've come across an old thread with terrible questions posed by none other than my 2005 counterpart . . . :embar:
     
    2 people like this.
  7. Naive Jr.

    Naive Jr. Senior member

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    I think Flying Monkey and PhiloVance speak for me as naive learner when they point out that those in it for the money should be identified. If I am called a "pretentious Fuck" after I complain that affiliate vendors instrumentalise my posts simply to be able to show their advertising, I wonder who is pretending?
     
    1 person likes this.
  8. kasakka

    kasakka Senior member

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    To me the affiliate threads have gotten so out of hand that we actually need a proper subforum for them. While it's great that they get this kind of attention, they do detract from the original purpose of the forum. So how about cramming a big ass link or two on top to a subforum where all the affiliate threads would reside?

    I too really like the threads that go in-depth with construction and details as well as the ones where people argue about style in general.
     
    1 person likes this.
  9. PhiloVance

    PhiloVance Senior member

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    A few weeks or months ago, someone suggested that I try selling a pair of EGs for cole haan as they had just seen a similar pair go for $600 or so on yahoo Japan's auction site. When I replied with a link to the auction to show that I had followed his advice, some other member was kind enough to suggest that I refrain from posting my auctions outside of the members eBay auctions thread. Aside from the fact that I think said member needed to relax, i started to wonder how this is any different from various vendors who cross post their own wares in shoe threads such as the EG appreciation thread. It's not a major issue (and this might be a privilege that affiliate vendors are granted by the forum powers), and I'm not going to complain too loudly about images of EGs being pushed in front of my face, but this seems to speak to the issue of vendors being given a different status at SF, which has changed the atmosphere to some extent (of course, in my opinion).
     
  10. HansderHund

    HansderHund Senior member

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    I felt that way as well and Fok offered a fair explanation to it. I'm not sure of their agreements, but it sounds like he (they) are going to attempt to remind the affiliate vendors that they should keep their ads within their own threads.
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2013
  11. cyc wid it

    cyc wid it Senior member

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    Only affiliates can post links to their own auctions/sales even in brand threads - this is rarely a problem in SW&D. Also, it seems CM and people in the Alden thread (okay mostly just "Uncle") have no idea how to multiquote and use thumbs. Instead they feel the need to quote and add a one word response like "fantastic".
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2013
    1 person likes this.
  12. AmericanGent

    AmericanGent Senior member

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    Florida, unfortunately
    I lurked the forum for years, trying to find answers to stupid sh$t like "Can I wear my double-cuff shirt with a linen suit?" and I sucked a ton of info from you guys. That's why I decided to join when I moved to Napoli- I felt like I wanted to contribute since I had learned so much. I don't have a problem with the way the forum is- I think the vendor threads should be clearly identified, but not sequestered. The Allen Edmonds thread is a cumbersome, pregnant sow, but I have read every single post- same for Good Taste. I learned more from these 2 threads than I can ever say.

    So- my only suggestion is this: perhaps a few intermediate "ranks" for members would be helpful for keeping the peace and corralling the new members. The rank of senior member is gained rather quickly by posting "+1", "Nice Kops!" and such. But folks like Cold Iron- who is the backbone of the AE thread and is incredibly generous with his time, or Sugarbutch, or Marcolandra and his Napoli information are still Senior Members.

    Stitchy should be deified. No wait- canonized. Whatever- Saint Stitches.


    I have done a few walk-throughs of my experiences in Naples. Mainly because it is my unique way contribute to the forum- and I get to provide a way for the membership to visit Napoli without the trip, and to make it easier for anyone who will come to visit. In Napoli, tine is usually at a premium because folks are anxious to get back to Rome! I'm glad you enjoyed the thread- despite its major derailing.

    I am working on a few new walk-throughs now- Piccolo shirtings, the shops on Passeggiata Colonna, and fabric merchants near Via Duomo near Volpe. Should be up by month's end.

    I spent my first months on the forum picking the low-hanging fruit- answering questions about wearing a red tux to the Prom, khakis for your wedding and such. It gets exhausting, but it is a way to give back to young posters seeking to become more solid in their style. Nobody wants to look like a tool sack- but most folks just don't know how to do any better. That is what passers by get from SF. It is an important element to the experience, but like you say- the conversation is engaging. I find myself reading MUCH more than posting. I know you guys and your bathrooms and cubicles, front porches, couches and dining room tables more than I should- but the service that active and prolific members like you guys provide is priceless.

    So I'll just say thanks.
     
    2 people like this.
  13. MyOtherLife

    MyOtherLife Senior member

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    The Arena - Centerfield
    We have lost our way. The land lays barren, the masters have either jumped ship or barely lurk. We must return to the marrow; the albumen, yes, that's it. Respect the old, and search for the new. As long as there is even a single man out there who wears square-toed shoes, we must not rest. The future lays within history. The 'do's & don'ts' are incomplete without the 'whys and wherefores'. There is still work to be done. The well is still deep. The sword will rise again.
     
    2 people like this.
  14. Academic2

    Academic2 Senior member

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    When did we become a doomsday cult? Nobody tells me anything, damn it.

    Look, when you have a firm date for the apocalypse, could you at least PM me? Thanks very much.

    Cheers,

    Ac ;)
     
  15. Loathing

    Loathing Senior member

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    London
  16. Ich_Dien

    Ich_Dien Senior member

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    Disappointing because there's a large number of people including myself who actually pay for the privilege to use B&S on a more active basis; so where is that money going?
     
  17. kazzy

    kazzy Member

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    I agree, especially since questions get lost in the fold so quickly. I have a couple of quick questions, but am afraid of started new threads.
     

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