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McRiz

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The discussion on the 18-ounce mistake appears around page 555 of this thread. Someone attached an excerpt from an old catalog referencing the 22 ounce weight of the twill.

Stratkat, why did Filson remove the weight reference? Extremely poor marketing? I will gladly accept a MacCallan 12 when you are ready.
 

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McRiz

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Here is the recent "field note" about the rugged twill from the website.

I think a lot of companies, such as Frost River, Duluth and VP, use an 18 ounce twill - which is considered rugged. I think heavy twill is about 24 ounce or more. Why is there no reference whatsoever by Filson about the weight of its rugged twill?

 

TinMan3

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Below are screenshots from the Filson website from June 2017, discussing the 22 ounce rugged twill.

Stratkat, why did Filson remove the reference to the weight of its rugged twill? I think at some point, Filson also "mistakenly" indicated that the fabric weight was 18 ounce? Now there is no weight reference whatsoever. Isn't that just poor marketing, if you are right that there has been no material change to the fabric weight?
Do you know what I think? I think it was made with 22oz twill when everything started. They only had one color and it was fairly simple to get a consistent product. Over the years they kept the 22oz claim the same through very subtle changes in how the manufacturer went about making the product (on purpose or because they had no choice). When they started making additional colors, the weight was not the same. Black and brown we’re both very thick and heavy, but navy almost always lighter. So then comes 2016 and bedrock is looking to cost cut and they ask the manufacturer how they can get a less expensive product. Manufacturer says well if we dont do as heavy of a waxing that saves us time on finishing, less cost in the product and makes transport cheaper. They realized at this time that there’s no way 22oz is still an accurate statement for all their twill products, so rather than make a claim that simply can’t be true they took the weight off altogether.

It could also be that none of the “2016” stuff happened and really they just said, “our twill varies in weight by color so we better not just say it’s all 22oz” but I speculate that they know they made a change. Sorry for the essay, but like many have said there is a difference in the “stiffness” of the older twill. Likely a difference in the finish or wax but difficult to say.
 

speedy611

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Just grabbed a small Pullman that had been sitting for quite a while in a shop I like. I really like the way it packs. I think it’s going to replace my 48 hour!View attachment 1423002
Nice. I moved from the 48 to a 242 carry on (also smaller clamshell) to have twill not tin, and for just a little extra capacity plus the clamshell convenience. Although it doesn’t have the handy front pockets the big flat pocket works just as well as long as the main bag isn’t overstuffed. The vestigial trolley strap on the 48 bothered me a bit too, always though that would have been better as a pocket. Enjoy.
 

seven20

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Picked up a bag I’ve wanted ever since I got into the filson brand, the Filson x Harris tweed and twill briefcase 70066. I found this one brand new with tags from a filson retailer

I have always been a bit leery of moving to the standard size briefcase as I’ve always had a 257 and at one point when working full time and in grad school would fill it up. Back then I carried my work laptop and my personal laptop 3 days a week. Since last May I find myself trying to find things to put in it every day. I recently purchased a 24 hour bag for my son and looking at the interior I decided I could make it work.
If I ever go back to the office I’m really excited.
 

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thewinedown

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I snagged a duffle during Filson's summer sale, and I see today that it has dropped an additional $50. I emailed Filson to see if they would honor this new price (the one I ordered hasn't even arrived yet). Does anyone know how they typically handle this? Otherwise, I would need to return the first one and order again, which just seems silly and wasteful.
 

TinMan3

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I snagged a duffle during Filson's summer sale, and I see today that it has dropped an additional $50. I emailed Filson to see if they would honor this new price (the one I ordered hasn't even arrived yet). Does anyone know how they typically handle this? Otherwise, I would need to return the first one and order again, which just seems silly and wasteful.
I think in the past the price adjustment policy is 14 days from purchase. Make sure the color is the same. They won’t honor if you bought root and it’s cinder that’s on sale.
 

thewinedown

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I think in the past the price adjustment policy is 14 days from purchase. Make sure the color is the same. They won’t honor if you bought root and it’s cinder that’s on sale.
Ok thanks. Definitely within that timeframe, and yes it's the same color. I'll see what they respond with. Appreciate it.
 

seven20

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I snagged a duffle during Filson's summer sale, and I see today that it has dropped an additional $50. I emailed Filson to see if they would honor this new price (the one I ordered hasn't even arrived yet). Does anyone know how they typically handle this? Otherwise, I would need to return the first one and order again, which just seems silly and wasteful.
I was too late on that one. I wanted the medium cinder as a gift for someone. $150 is a steal
 

thewinedown

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I was too late on that one. I wanted the medium cinder as a gift for someone. $150 is a steal
Ah darn. I just looked, and it's still showing on the website for me if you're still interested in it. Go grab it!
 

seven20

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Ah darn. I just looked, and it's still showing on the website for me if you're still interested in it. Go grab it!
Yeah, it shows for me too. It was there early this morning when I looked but when clicking on the bag it says 'no longer available'. Also though, their site wouldn't render properly this morning either. It was really odd.
 

Count de Monet

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Do you know what I think? I think it was made with 22oz twill when everything started. They only had one color and it was fairly simple to get a consistent product. Over the years they kept the 22oz claim the same through very subtle changes in how the manufacturer went about making the product (on purpose or because they had no choice). When they started making additional colors, the weight was not the same. Black and brown we’re both very thick and heavy, but navy almost always lighter. So then comes 2016 and bedrock is looking to cost cut and they ask the manufacturer how they can get a less expensive product. Manufacturer says well if we dont do as heavy of a waxing that saves us time on finishing, less cost in the product and makes transport cheaper. They realized at this time that there’s no way 22oz is still an accurate statement for all their twill products, so rather than make a claim that simply can’t be true they took the weight off altogether.

It could also be that none of the “2016” stuff happened and really they just said, “our twill varies in weight by color so we better not just say it’s all 22oz” but I speculate that they know they made a change. Sorry for the essay, but like many have said there is a difference in the “stiffness” of the older twill. Likely a difference in the finish or wax but difficult to say.
That all sounds perfectly plausible but I have a question about the highlighted language. My understanding that when quoting cloth weight by ounces, whether for denim jeans, suiting material, whatever, it is shorthand for saying ounces per yard of cloth, e.g., "22 ounces per square yard of cloth."

If that is correct, wouldn't the cloth in its original state, i.e. before waxing, be the basis for its cited weight? In other words, wouldn't still be 22 ounce cloth whether later added to it was a lot of wax, a little wax, or no wax at all?

NOTE: I am not weighing in (groan) on whether or not the bags became thinner or lighter after such and such a date. I own a pair of large Pullmans, a 246, and a 256, and the four straddle the Great Corporate Takeover Date and I cannot detect a difference in cloth on the four except the ones with the most use are more flexible.
 

OtterMeanGreen

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That all sounds perfectly plausible but I have a question about the highlighted language. My understanding that when quoting cloth weight by ounces, whether for denim jeans, suiting material, whatever, it is shorthand for saying ounces per yard of cloth, e.g., "22 ounces per square yard of cloth."

If that is correct, wouldn't the cloth in its original state, i.e. before waxing, be the basis for its cited weight? In other words, wouldn't still be 22 ounce cloth whether later added to it was a lot of wax, a little wax, or no wax at all?

NOTE: I am not weighing in (groan) on whether or not the bags became thinner or lighter after such and such a date. I own a pair of large Pullmans, a 246, and a 256, and the four straddle the Great Corporate Takeover Date and I cannot detect a difference in cloth on the four except the ones with the most use are more flexible.
Good points. Plus Filson once (not sure where they stand now) states “22oz Rugged Twill is lightly brushed with a paraffin based wax to repel water and densely woven to reduce snags”. I’m not sure how much the added wax accounts for Twill Weight, but words such as “lightly” leads me to believe not much. I would of course recommend calling one of Filson’s knowledgeable customer service staff, however knowledgeable called in sick. I once called Filson CS to ask their recommendation on what wax to buy for my 257, she stated Rugged Twill bags don’t require wax and I was confusing myself with Tin Cloth. So unless Stanley Kohls himself chimes in, I struggle at taking anything at face value.
 
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TinMan3

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That all sounds perfectly plausible but I have a question about the highlighted language. My understanding that when quoting cloth weight by ounces, whether for denim jeans, suiting material, whatever, it is shorthand for saying ounces per yard of cloth, e.g., "22 ounces per square yard of cloth."

If that is correct, wouldn't the cloth in its original state, i.e. before waxing, be the basis for its cited weight? In other words, wouldn't still be 22 ounce cloth whether later added to it was a lot of wax, a little wax, or no wax at all?

NOTE: I am not weighing in (groan) on whether or not the bags became thinner or lighter after such and such a date. I own a pair of large Pullmans, a 246, and a 256, and the four straddle the Great Corporate Takeover Date and I cannot detect a difference in cloth on the four except the ones with the most use are more flexible.
Yes, so what I would be suggesting is that the weight of the fabric may not have specifically changed but the way it is finished is different. Could they have also changed the weight of the product before waxing? Yes but I can’t really speak to that. All I know is that the older bags tend to feel stouter than the newer bags especially when not heavily used.
 

linablair

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Toyota guy here. Bought a brand new 4wd Tacoma in 03, sold it last fall. Had a set of tools in it, the only thing I ever used them for was to change one tire and tighten the side plastic cover on my seat, and the door latch catch!
Traded it in for a 2019.
I bought my first truck, a Tacoma, last summer! a 2019, TRD Off-Road, double cab, long bed. Love it - especially when I'm lookin' for native brook trout streams in the deep woods!

Currently considering the Carhartt seat covers, as I leave my wet waders on sometimes when looking for a different spot. If there were rugged twill seat covers, I'd likely pull the trigger a bit quicker!
 

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