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Entry-Level Trousers

TheShetlandSweater

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I don't want to see them, unless you are Sonny Crockett in 1985 or wearing canvas sneakers it's a bad look.

View attachment 1707247
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GaiusM

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Both the TMC “Hilts” and BR “original spec” are based on the McQueen chinos. The main difference is that TMC’s stuff is explicitly branded as Steve McQueen (they have quite a wide collection of Steve McQueen products.) TMC does this with a few stars of the time, including Brando as well.

The trousers, jackets, etc used in a lot of the 60s WWII films were often not quite accurate, so to get that look right, sometimes a few of the details have to be ‘off’.
I happen to speak and read Japanese and have never come across a single mention of BR being based on McQueen's trousers. They are always explicitly referred to as being a modern styling repro of 1940's military chinos. This is in comparison to the 1942 and 1945 models which are true military repros. If you want to make the claim that Original Specs are based on McQueen's chinos then the onus is on you to provide a source and evidence.
 

dieworkwear

Mahatma Jawndi
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Meh, Mankles and Turn Ups. Not my cup of tea

Just a random thought:

For some reason, people who are anti-fashion are always in skinny fit chinos that they would have called "metrosexual" 20 years ago.
 
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JibranK

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I happen to speak and read Japanese and have never come across a single mention of BR being based on McQueen's trousers.

This was mentioned by the proprietor of History Preservation (the US dealer for Buzz Rickson's), who has worked with Toyo on the design and historical reproduction side of things, including Lone Wolf boots, Ike jackets, and others.


They are always explicitly referred to as being a modern styling repro of 1940's military chinos. This is in comparison to the 1942 and 1945 models which are true military repros. If you want to make the claim that Original Specs are based on McQueen's chinos then the onus is on you to provide a source and evidence.

Correct, I'm not saying it's an officially-licensed line like the TMC McQueen line or the Buzz Rickson's William Gibson line.

I'm a fan of both brands. I am making the point that the "60s chinos" and "McQueen chinos" of some posters' imaginations were not khaki-colored jeggings. They were trimmer than the full cut WWII khakis… but not by a whole lot.
 

yorkshire pud

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Just a random thought:

About 60% of the time I come across someone who's very "anti-fashion" online and see how they dress, they are in skinny fit chinos. These are the same people who, 20 years ago, argued with me and other fashion-obsessed guys about the virtues of slimmer fit clothing. At the time, they wore baggy slacks with echos of 1990s Armani and said slim fit was metrosexual, gay, unmanly, etc. Now they're wearing not just slimmer pants, but skinny pants, and saying they hate whatever is X.

I don't have a problem with looser pants or other peoples sexuality, who am I to judge??

I think relaxed pants are OK for hiking/climbing or going to raves in 1989 etc.

I just think a slim (not skinny) pant/Jean or chino looks better overall as a style proposition, but then again I think the early to mid 60s is the best era of mens style, maybe that is a British thing as the 40s and 50s aren't particularly looked back on with any fondness by ordinary Brits due to war rationing etc.
 

yorkshire pud

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This was mentioned by the proprietor of History Preservation (the US dealer for Buzz Rickson's), who has worked with Toyo on the design and historical reproduction side of things, including Lone Wolf boots, Ike jackets, and others.




Correct, I'm not saying it's an officially-licensed line like the TMC McQueen line or the Buzz Rickson's William Gibson line.

I'm a fan of both brands. I am making the point that the "60s chinos" and "McQueen chinos" of some posters' imaginations were not khaki-colored jeggings. They were trimmer than the full cut WWII khakis… but not by a whole lot.

You do realize that "The Great Escape" movie was set in the 1940s and Steve McQueen was wearing a costume for that role??

His actual contemporary 1960s pants are always cut slimmer
JQzUBem.jpg
tumblr_puw4frSPqO1ro1kffo1_500.jpg
 
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dieworkwear

Mahatma Jawndi
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I don't have a problem with looser pants or other peoples sexuality, who am I to judge??

I think relaxed pants are OK for hiking/climbing or going to raves in 1989 etc.

I just think a slim (not skinny) pant/Jean or chino looks better overall as a style proposition, but then again I think the early to mid 60s is the best era of mens style, maybe that is a British thing as the 40s and 50s aren't particularly looked back on with any fondness by ordinary Brits due to war rationing etc.

Spoke London doesn't look 1960s to me. It looks 2010. It's true that men wore slim-fit clothing in the 1960s -- just as they did in other eras. But at each iteration, the style took on nuances that made it a product of that era. When I look at Spoke London, I don't see 1960s Mod culture, when men would have worn such slim silhouettes. I see 2010 office bro uniforms.

The "classic" way of dressing would be to ignore these fashion trends and dress for your body type. But I think a 7" leg opening falls well outside of what would be considered classic. Some tailors already think that the trend for 7.75" leg openings on a 30" waistband trouser is too skinny.

Anyway, I think the silhouette is ill-suited for the OP. Their largest fit gives an 8" opening for heavier guys. I'm a 30 waist and weigh 160lbs. My trousers have a 7.75" to 8" leg opening.
 
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yorkshire pud

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Spoke London doesn't look 1960s to me. It just looks 2010. It's true that men wore slim-fit clothing in the 1960s -- just as they did in other eras. But at each iteration, the style took on nuances that made it a product of that era. When I look at Spoke London, I don't see 1960s Mod culture, when men would have worn such slim silhouettes. I see 2010 slim-fit silhouettes, styling, and colors. That era was influenced by turn of the century men's fashion -- Hedi and Raf slimmed men's silhouettes to skinny proportions, and then Thom Browne later brought up the hem. The only 1960s connection at the time was superficial. That silhouette came up during a time when Mad Men was popular and Thom Browne referenced 1960s films such as The Apartment and The Man in the Gray Flannel Suit in his collections.

The "classic" way of dressing is to ignore those fashion trends and find a silhouette that's based on your build. A 7" leg opening, however, is pretty skinny and would be well outside of what would be considered "classic." I wear pants with a 7.75" leg opening. When I went to an Anderson & Sheppard trunk show, John Malone, the trouser cutter, looked down at my pants and asked, "do you always wear trousers this slim?" It also took some finagling to get Edwin at Steed to cut me trousers with a 7.75" leg opening. He wanted me to take something like 8.5" and would only slim it to 7.75" if I wore the 8.5" opening for a while.

I think suits look better with a wider opening -- maybe something like 8.25" on a 30" waist. My odd trousers are 8" or 7.75". My jeans aren't even 7" opening. I think those might be 7.5".

Anyway, I don't have a problem with guys wearing skinny pants, although I think it looks better if you're ultra-thin and wearing it in a more directional look, such as SLP or something. Skinny chinos would be a bad option for the OP since he's a heavier build. I also personally don't like the styling on Spoke's website, where they just do the basic "office bro" skinny chinos with business casual stuff.

I suppose being a Web based retailer Spoke "go after the money" and use younger models wearing the skinniest fits they do, I agree some of the promo shots don't do the product justice at all. They would be better off using more mature models in the more relaxed cuts (like many retailers would). I think the photo of the older guy in grey chinos represents them better to be honest

My point is they have a vast range of sizes to try up to 48" waist in various different cuts and they are happy to keep sending pairs cut to your chosen length until you are happy FOC for a reasonable cost. If your not satisfied with the results they offer a full refund within 200 days

I think with Savile Row tailoring (or any bespoke) it would always be advisable to go with the House cut and follow the advise your given
 

dieworkwear

Mahatma Jawndi
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Also, I second the recommendation for Land's End. If you find something that fits around the seat and thighs, it's usually pretty easy to take in the waist and taper below the knees. Harder to let things out on cotton pants. So just aim for a good fit around the seat and thighs and then see if a local alterations tailor can get you to where you need.
 

Citadel

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Alright everyone, I've consolidated the advice into a list to investigate my options more thoroughly. I'm going to look for stores that have a brick and mortar location in NYC with in stock pants in my size and wool (navy/light grey/charcoal).

Here's the list of all the places everyones recommended so far, as well as some comments I felt were particularly note worthy for long term trouser wear.

SuitSupply (-2)
Luigi Bianchi
Bonobos
JCrew
Spier & Mackay (MTO)
SuSu
BrooksBrothers
Natalino
Cavour
O’Connell’s (x2)
Ben Silver
Luxire
Yeossal
Spoke-London
Uniqlo
Lands End

Ebay – Samuelsohn, Hertling, Paul Stuart, etc?

Re-enactment clothes - https://www.atthefront.com/product-p/usutw.htm

Sarti Italiani (MTO - I have a suit from them that I like and I think they make nice pants. If you ask them to put in generous inlays, you will be able to adjust your trousers up and down a size when needed. So if you get them made to a size 40 waist, you can later adjust them to a size 38 or 42. Get them made without back pockets so you don't have to worry about these details when adjusting)

Notes: When you buy pants, just make sure they fit comfortably around the hips and seat. It's pretty easy to taper trousers from the knee down. The third thing to check for is the back rise. Many companies make pants with an overly long back rise for comfort, but this results in a crumpling underneath the seat. If there's enough material inside, you should be able to have a tailor shorten the back rise and drop the crotch seam, which will give you a cleaner fit.

Edit: I made a small effort at repping repeated mentions (be it positive or negative) but was rather lazy at this endeavor.
 

Citadel

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After a thorough look, there's are the only three options with brick and mortar in my size in NYC. For sizing I included 44W-50W as acceptable.

BrooksBrothers ($150)
Bonobos ($70 - $140)
SuitSupply ($200)

I'll be checking out all three today and deciding based on fit then price.

I'll be picking up three pairs: Light grey, charcoal, and navy.

Regards for the efforts gentleman.
 

yorkshire pud

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After a thorough look, there's are the only three options with brick and mortar in my size in NYC. For sizing I included 44W-50W as acceptable.

BrooksBrothers ($150)
Bonobos ($70 - $140)
SuitSupply ($200)

I'll be checking out all three today and deciding based on fit then price.

I'll be picking up three pairs: Light grey, charcoal, and navy.

Regards for the efforts gentleman.

I was listening to an old British radio podcast today (it was later turned into a cartoon). Steve Merchant one of the hosts (the 6'7" character in green) mentioned that he once had to buy some size 15 shoes whilst he was working in NYC, after having zero luck a cab driver said he knew a place that specialized in clothing for larger men and took him there and he found exactly what he was looking for, maybe that place still exists and might be a good place to look??

MV5BNGRiODdjZmMtOGEyOC00YWU1LWJjNTUtYWVhNDAyMjBjZDVlXkEyXkFqcGdeQXRyYW5zY29kZS13b3JrZmxvdw@@._...jpg
 

TexasToast

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Today the Lands End chinos came (left by my friendly USPS delivery person)and I got to try them on. I thought they were great I got a 34 inch inseam and cuffed. I may go with a smaller inseam on the next pair but they are on my just have list of entry level trousers. Not a bad deal for $27 at all in fact I'm going to see if they're available in green or blue
 

Citadel

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Turns out I'm currently a measured 46 waist (At brooks brothers) however a size 42 fits me at Bonobos. Unfortunately, all the sizes at the retail stores I visited were sold out, so I'll be looking like a stuffed sausage until my new payday. Not happy about it.
 

SD Buck

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You might want to look at Berle “self-sizer”. I found a pair in Nordstrom Rack, and liked the way they fit.
 

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