• Hi, I am the owner and main administrator of Styleforum. If you find the forum useful and fun, please help support it by buying through the posted links on the forum. Our main, very popular sales thread, where the latest and best sales are listed, are posted HERE

    Purchases made through some of our links earns a commission for the forum and allows us to do the work of maintaining and improving it. Finally, thanks for being a part of this community. We realize that there are many choices today on the internet, and we have all of you to thank for making Styleforum the foremost destination for discussions of menswear.
  • This site contains affiliate links for which Styleforum may be compensated.
  • We would like to welcome House of Huntington as an official Affiliate Vendor. Shop past season Drake's, Nigel Cabourn, Private White V.C. and other menswear luxury brands at exceptional prices below retail. Please visit the Houise of Huntington thread and welcome them to the forum.

  • STYLE. COMMUNITY. GREAT CLOTHING.

    Bored of counting likes on social networks? At Styleforum, you’ll find rousing discussions that go beyond strings of emojis.

    Click Here to join Styleforum's thousands of style enthusiasts today!

    Styleforum is supported in part by commission earning affiliate links sitewide. Please support us by using them. You may learn more here.

Dress shirt with red buttonhole

Demeter

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2005
Messages
228
Reaction score
5
Gentlemen, forgive my ignorance, but this has piqued my interest. I just bought a shirt from Holt-Renfrew here in Ottawa, and noticed that the bottom buttonhole is horizontal (unlike the others) , and sown with red thread. This buttonhole would be pretty far down inside the pants, so I assumed it somehow serves to keep the shirt from coming out of the pants, but don't quite understand how.

Any ideas?
 

Manton

RINO
Joined
Apr 20, 2002
Messages
41,314
Reaction score
2,879
We have debated this a few times; too bad the search function is not working.

I can't remember all the twists and turns of the argument, but the conclusion was that it didn't really have a purpose.
 

JohnMS

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2004
Messages
650
Reaction score
0
I have a co-worker here who is a large person, 6'4" 300 lbs., who doesn't know much about clothing other than it's to cover the body. In any case, years ago he bought a shirt from Lands' End. Back then the LE shirts had a horizontal buttonhole at the bottom of the shirt. He commented once how he would like to have more of those types of shirts because he had a problem with that bottom button coming unbuttoned with his shirts (because of his large stomach he said) and the horizontal buttonhole prevented that.

Go figure.
 

johnnynorman3

Distinguished Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2004
Messages
2,702
Reaction score
25
Mike C. argues that the horizontal bottom buttonhole helps insure that pattern matching stays put -- it prevents the right and left sides of the shirt from moving up and down in opposite directions. Seems to make some sense -- but not that much sense.

The red stitching is probably just a stylized addition to the shirt that the company thought would make it more appealing.
 

MilanoStyle

Distinguished Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2004
Messages
1,620
Reaction score
5
I do not know why red was used, but what I heard from a sales person on the horizontal buttonhole was that since men have different hip sizes, for guys who have bigger hip, when this button is closed, it will stretch more naturally than as to having virtical buttonhole.

I thought that sounded reasonable.
 

alchimiste

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2005
Messages
577
Reaction score
1
The red stitching is probably just a stylized addition to the shirt that the company thought would make it more appealing.
I've seen shirts with a red bottom button. They used it for marketing as Pink with the pink gusset or RL with the color of labels.
 

Manton

RINO
Joined
Apr 20, 2002
Messages
41,314
Reaction score
2,879
I have shirts, from the same shirtmaker, some of which have the horizontal bottom buttonhole, and some don't. It does not affect the pattern matching, and it does not affect the fit. I get the feeling that some shirtmakers do it because they think it gives the shirt a more "old world" or "bespoke" patina.

If I recall correctly, Kabbaz pretty well refuted all functional arguments for the horizontal last buttonhole.
 

naturlaut

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2003
Messages
565
Reaction score
3
Kabbaz pretty well refuted all functional arguments for the horizontal last buttonhole.
He refuted all functional arguments of the horizontal button hole in a Bespoke Shirt. All the reasons stated above are, even if it matters just a tiniest bit, reasonable for a RTW shirt: pattern matching (which was what I initially thought it was for), hip expansion, etc.. These are all be done without the horizontal buttonhole in a bespoke shirt.
 

Manton

RINO
Joined
Apr 20, 2002
Messages
41,314
Reaction score
2,879
Do any RTW shirtmakers make the last buttonhole horizontal as a matter of course?
 

naturlaut

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2003
Messages
565
Reaction score
3
Zegna Napoli Couture (or now Couture) still does.
Gianluca Isaia too, or at least those that I have (from quite a few years ago).
 

artdeco73

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2004
Messages
58
Reaction score
0
Gentlemen, forgive my ignorance, but this has piqued my interest. I just bought a shirt from Holt-Renfrew here in Ottawa, and noticed that the bottom buttonhole is horizontal (unlike the others) , and sown with red thread. This buttonhole would be pretty far down inside the pants, so I assumed it somehow serves to keep the shirt from coming out of the pants, but don't quite understand how. Any ideas?
One word: gimmick. I have a shirt, solid white, whose top buttonhole is stitched in bright green, with gauntlet buttonholes stitched in matching green. So much for wearing it without a tie or without a jacket. Regards, Tony
 

Etruscan

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 28, 2004
Messages
135
Reaction score
0
I assume that while such an accommodation wouldn't be necessary on a bespoke model, men's RTW shirts occasionally feature a horizontally oriented bottom buttonhole in the interests of helping that button to resist a tendency to stay fastened. (Possibly as a result they may also help to keep the shirt tails from riding up as well.) The logic would appear to be the same as on some women's blouses I've encountered where the bustline buttonhole is also horizontal, presumably to prevent the button from popping open from the involuntary shifting of the breasts as the wearer moves.
 

naturlaut

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2003
Messages
565
Reaction score
3
presumably to prevent the button from popping open from the involuntary shifting of the breasts as the wearer moves.
And that's bad because ...?
devil.gif
Anyway, I just checked my old Zegna NC shirt. It's not even pattern-matched anywhere.
 

Demeter

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2005
Messages
228
Reaction score
5
Well, thank you all for the replies. I guess it doesn't serve as an attachment hole or anything like that.

But 'bigger hips on a man' doesn't really sound reasonable to me. Maybe for a more rotund gentleman, as JohnMS mentioned.
 

trogdor

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
517
Reaction score
0
Do any RTW shirtmakers make the last buttonhole horizontal as a matter of course?
I have a shirt from Interno8 that has a horizontal second buttonhole up. Now that's an affectation.
 

Featured Sponsor

How important is full vs half canvas to you for heavier sport jackets?

  • Definitely full canvas only

    Votes: 55 35.5%
  • Half canvas is fine

    Votes: 60 38.7%
  • Really don't care

    Votes: 17 11.0%
  • Depends on fabric

    Votes: 27 17.4%
  • Depends on price

    Votes: 28 18.1%

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
505,161
Messages
10,579,042
Members
223,884
Latest member
khabirspells
Top