Do you believe in intelligent extraterrestrial life?

[Nantucket Red]

Originally Posted by Pennglock

It's after posts like these that I sometimes think I should smoke less pot...

That thought will pass. Meanwhile, have another toke for me.

 

[Helix]

Originally Posted by Pennglock

It's after posts like these that I sometimes think I should smoke less pot...

Or read less Ray Kurzveil. I also hate the Drake equation.

That said it is basically impossible that there ISN'T intelligent extraterrestrial life somewhere in the universe.

 

[Connemara]

Originally Posted by dusty

This is a question of belief? I believe you're an asswipe. Also, I'm always surprised to see how many people will remark that it's probable that there is intelligent life out there somewhere even though we have absolutely zero (non-circumstantial) evidence to support the claim. And the Drake equation doesn't count on the grounds that it's absolute bullshit.
What about the fact that "life-essential" molecules are commonly found on meteors and other planets just within our solar system? Hell, we know that half of Titan's atmosphere is drenched with organic compounds (though it seems too cold to support life...no liquid water). I think that when you consider those factors, and then remember that there are literally billions of galaxies out there, the likelihood that there is NO life is practically zero.

 

[Hombre Secreto]

All I know is if E.T. ever shows up we're done for.... If Predators have the technology to reach us, and we can't even come close to finding their planets... they must have weapons that would make nukes look like firecrackers.

 

[GQgeek]

Originally Posted by Pennglock

Just playing around with the Drake equation and its variants...

where:

N is the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which communication might be possible;
and

R* is the average rate of star formation per year in our galaxy
fp is the fraction of those stars that have planets
ne is the average number of planets that can potentially support life per star that has planets
fℓ is the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop life at some point
fi is the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop intelligent life
fc is the fraction of civilizations that develop a technology that releases detectable signs of their existence into space
L is the length of time such civilizations release detectable signals into space




...I have trouble believing there are not other intelligences in our universe.

The bigger question for me has been why have they not made themselves known to us. I tend to downplay considerations of technology in communicating over large distances and instead believe these intelligences just don't care about us.

One idea is that they have an extremely interior focus, that they've long ago discovered the secrets of the structure of the physical Universe and now have moved on to deeper considerations. Why should we believe that any intelligence reasonably more advanced than ours would get juiced traveling around the universe and attempting to communicate with minds comparable to insects?

For contact between two advanced civilizations to be worthwhile, their intelligence development would have to be at similar levels. The chances of that kind of convergence strikes me as having a pretty low probability- the overlap period in which meaningful contact could occur might be as little as a 100,000 years.


And if you believe in the limitations of surpassing the speed of light, the constraint in communicating might not be between humans and extraterrestrial intelligence, but among the extraterrestrials themselves. This civilization would have grown used to communicating and processing at the speed of light, so by necessity the life is in very close proximity with each other, and meaningful thought and existence couldn't occur over large distances.

It seems likely to me that at advanced levels of development, an intelligent civilization would find a way of transferring its consciousness/soul beyond biological constraints, and its continual evolution would require it to migrate into the smallest density possible, to optimize its processing/communicating capacity. For any intelligent life-form to continue to advance, it is going to need to migrate into something resembling a very advanced computer. I see this as the future of humanity as well, as long as we aren't wiped out in the next few hundred years, we'll hit that point of singularity. As soon as we're able to advance a generalized AI, we'll see an exponential explosion of intelligence, as a self-perpetrating loop is created where AI is able to further begat AI+.

The huge challenge is going to be aligning/incorporating human values in the AI, or we'll just be left in the dust. You could try to contain the AI in a black box and just learn from it, but I see no way the AI doesn't jump mediums into the 'real' world. I don't see an easy answer to the problem, and am glad I'll probably be dead before the singularity occurs. My kids might not, though- I think it could happen that soon...

It's after posts like these that I sometimes think I should smoke less pot...
1.Interesting point.
2. Mentats are the way forward.

 

[Brian SD]

I figure at some point in time either in the past or in the future (relative to Earth time), there was or will be some other intelligent life that rivals humanity.

 

[Helix]

Originally Posted by GQgeek

2. Mentats are the way forward.

Need to find Arrakis first. Man the telescopes folks. The spice must flow...eventually.

 

[Nantucket Red]

Reminds me of an old New Yorker cartoon showing two astronauts in the background approaching a couple of warty blobs with eyes on stalks, one of which is saying to the other, "Oh no, they'll ravish our women!"

 

[rob]

Originally Posted by Connemara

I guess defining "intelligent" is kind of hard. Carl Sagan's definition was grounded in the ability of a civilization to send and receive radio waves. He argues, convincingly, that it is a pretty rudimentary measure of intelligence that is very easily understood.

So what do you think? Somewhere in the universe, does intelligent life exist?

Why is it so easy for you to ponder the existence of intelligence life (design ) light years away, but so hard to do so where you live?

You can stretch your mind a million light years away but not even a couple of inches here.

Rob

 

[oneeightyseven]

Originally Posted by rob

Why is it so easy for you to ponder the existence of intelligence life (design ) light years away, but so hard to do so where you live?

You can stretch your mind a million light years away but not even a couple of inches here.

Rob

you should have been included in my poal.

 

[Don Carlos]

Originally Posted by Tangfastic

I can conceive of a lot of possible advanced life forms that may have avoided the radio on their road to civilisation.

I think the most commonly held theory is that intelligent life is out there but it is too far away for us to get in touch with using any means we can currently come up with. Also, given the age and size of the universe it is likely that somewhere advanced lifeforms have already gained civilisation and declined and become extinct. We could get a message from some friendly near neighbours that takes so long to get here the civilisation that sent it out could be long gone.

This.

The problem with the question "Do you believe in intelligent extraterrestrial life?" is that, despite the specificity of "intelligent," it's still an extremely broad question. The sub-components that need to be addressed:

1) Do you believe in the potential for intelligent ET life?
2) Do you believe that intelligent ET life has ever existed in the universe?
3) Do you believe that intelligent ET life currently exists in the universe?
4) Do you believe that intelligent ET life has visited or still visits Earth?
5) Do you believe that we will ever make contact with an intelligent ET species?

Statistically speaking, questions 1, 2, and 3 are fairly likely (and in descending order of likelihood). Question 1 is almost totally likely, inasmuch as our existence proves the potential, and we have identified planets almost exactly like our own and believed to be capable of supporting (if not actually hosting) life. Questions 4 and 5 are much trickier, and here the probabilities drop to near zero.

If you put a gun to my head and forced me to guess at the above, I'd say I "believe" 1, 2, and 3, but do not believe 4 and am highly skeptical about 5. Until such time as faster-than-light travel is invented, 5 remains ridiculously unlikely.

 

[Connemara]

Originally Posted by rob

Why is it so easy for you to ponder the existence of intelligence life (design ) light years away, but so hard to do so where you live? You can stretch your mind a million light years away but not even a couple of inches here. Rob
Did I offend you dickwad? I just got this e-mail message (as in, not a PM but that other option) from Rob. I have never in my many years on SF received one of these. It was titled "I rarely do this" and the body consisted of: You are intellectually vapid. Rob Who is this turdburglar?

 

[oneeightyseven]

Originally Posted by Connemara

Did I offend you dickwad?

I just got this e-mail message (as in, not a PM but that other option) from Rob. I have never in my many years on SF received one of these. It was titled "I rarely do this" and the body consisted of:


You are intellectually vapid.

Rob


Who is this turdburglar?

lol he's nuts. Gives rnold a run for his money in the crazy department.

 

[dusty]

Originally Posted by Rob

You are intellectually vapid. Rob

Bang up job, you fuckin weirdo.

 

[rob]

Conne,

Okay, you're both thin-skinned and weak-minded. Sorry, I should not have sold you short.

rob